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In Reply to: RE: Whoah! I never did that - the files I converted were 24/96 posted by Chris from Lafayette on July 11, 2017 at 15:48:08
No, It is my understanding that Channel masters in dxd and then will sell you different versions derived from the DXD master. Seems overly complicated
in Stereo or Multi-Channel.
Sadly, this is NOT the case with most other Channel Classics releases. :-(
Some listeners have personal preferences for one format or another, and are willing to argue about it for years! ;-)
I actually applaud Jared for trying to accommodate these different types of listeners in this release.
To me it looks like these various formats are just a lot of technical hype for marketing purposes. It raises the price of distribution, and ultimately the price to the consumer. I don't believe you can go from one format to another without losing something! Whether it's audible or not, and to whom, might be the issue.
If they wanted to give us the very best, the "mix" would have been in the original miking as was done on the so called "non-commercial" DSD256 version written of above. If DSD64 is what they were working in (and I guess it could have been DSD256) that could have been the principal release. In the glory days of vinyl, were not many recordings made that way? (Too many mikes these days?)
So then they convert to 352.8KHz/24bit PCM (DXD). Question: If they felt they eventually need to go to the Pyramix, why did they not use 352.8KHz/24bit PCM (DXD) for the original live recording? Then they could have done the "required" mixdown with no conversion and that would represent the best that it would be possible to offer. [But they would lose the marketing cachet of having recorded in DSD v. the "old fashioned" PCM.]
But having converted to 352.8KHz/24bit PCM (DXD), how could the fidelity improve by doing yet another conversion? I would have to conclude that 352.8KHz/24bit PCM (DXD) is the best they can now make available.
Given the sophistication of the playback equipment likely used by those considering either the 352.8KHz/24bit PCM (DXD) or one of the DSD versions, is it likely that a DSD version will play back more accurately than the DXD? Is it not accuracy that is the goal? Or is it meeting the personal preference of an end user unfamiliar with the original recording experience?
Finally I might express the view (which a multi-channel listener could feel free to correct) that those of use who listen in just two channels may feel a greater need for accurate aural cues for the space and placement of instruments.
In this case, I would conclude that too, but, as I mentioned, not all listeners feel the same way.
in the recording industry is that Jared actually reveals how he makes the sausage.
You can record in DSD but you can't mix in DSD so you convert the DSD to the very best PCM format available which I trust Jared uses in the Pyramix.
On can argue all day long about formats, PCM vs. DSD and bit depths and sample rates but the truth of the matter is, the problems are largely DECODING issues in the various DACs and NOT in the information contained in the various formats.
In other words, if the recording engineer got the recording part right and it wasn't screwed up in the mixing board, it's on YOU to figure out the best way to play it back.
I've heard Jared's recordings played back on Gigabuck gear and can safely say he is producing some of the best recordings being produced today.
"In other words, if the recording engineer got the recording part right and it wasn't screwed up in the mixing board, it's on YOU to figure out the best way to play it back."
Interesting, and just how are we to figure it out, aside from theoretically, to wit, the DXD files.
I appreciate the samples and I downloaded 2 of them, the DSD256 and the DXD. Problem is that the DSD file has little more than adjusting the bass drum sticks. The DXD has more. Perhaps I should try others. But these do not represent the miking and mix of the final product.
Better still if Jarad would distribute a six minute sample of the final mix that he thought best illustrated his work, and in the various formats.
IMNSHO, it's gotta be user hardware dependent.
There are so many choices in how to decode a digital file that I doubt anyone would ever agree.
I use a multi-bit ladder DAC that likely has a real bit depth of about 18 bits or so. It's based on 8 each PCM1704's and would by many be considered obsolete as TI doesn't sell the chips anymore.
Others have DSD DACs fully capable of decoding DSD-512, some use software to up-sample to that rate, some DSD DACs up-sample internally to even higher sample rates and even deeper bit depths and on and on and on.
Who is to say what's best for you?
I use iTunes with a $10 Bit Perfect plug-in so WTFDIK
You're correct, the free samples on NativeDSD are not the micing and mix of the released album, but are a single take snippet using different mics, recorder, and placement. But the samples do provide accurate comparitive examples of the different formats (PCM/DXD and DSD rates) as how they will play and sound on different playback systems.
Your's is a reasonable request of providing a six or so minute sample of the released Channel Mahler 3 recording in the various delivery formats/rates, so we'll see how best to distribute these.
Thanks for your suggestion!
I spoke with Jared, and he'll add the Mahler 3 5th Movement to the NativeDSD Just Listen label page, in all the deliverable forms next week. This movement is particularly useful as a format comparison, as it is very rich sonically containing not only the orchestra, but the women's and children's chorus as well as the alto Gerhild Romberger.
I'll keep you all informed.
Due to vacation schedules it was not possible to place the Mahler 3 5th movement on NativeDSD this weekend. Until we can get it placed, if anyone wanting the movement earlier would mail me at the Audio Asylum tailspn address with the format and speed desired, I'll E-mail a We Transfer link to it.
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