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In Reply to: RE: Can audio component sales personnel play tricks on customers? posted by SpotcheckBilly12345 on May 15, 2017 at 09:45:17
Can't answer logically without system details.
Fair enough. Unfortunately, I don't have those details.
However, would it be possible to discuss this in a more general vain -- do you know of any trickery that could be applied when A/B testing a system? I'm asking because I've been more than once in a situation where a salesperson would play me one configuration, and then play another configuration (like swap the interconnects), and the sound suddenly improves like 100%! Seems almost supernatural, that much of a leap.
Follow Ups:
A B&M audio store was remodeling its main speaker showroom when I happened to walk inside. They had one of those "sophisticated" speaker switching boards comprised of rows and rows of pushbuttons which was supposed to allow the salesman to select any combination of sources, amplifiers, and speakers at the touch of a button or two. After looking at the back of this device when it was pulled out of its console I was suspicious of this switching panel when I discovered that certain buttons ran the signal through a strange looking device that seemed to be loaded with various resistors, etc. while other buttons connected these same components together without the "benefit" of going through the strange looking device. Suspicious? Hell yeah!
I also think of the infamous Monster Cable demonstration setup that was employed by Best Buy to sell the "upgraded" cables by showing how superior Monster was to basic speaker wire. What a joke. They were running the signal through a 100ft roll of 18ga cheap speaker wire on one position of the switch while the 10ga Monster Cable side of the demo was only about 10ft long. Did the Monster Cable sound better? What do you think? ;-)
I'm not trying to say that all or most audio dealers are dishonest, but the two examples that I witnessed were questionable to say the least.
Cheers,
SB
Evidently they have some good equipment!
Find out if the MQA was played through the $200 MQA Dac, or the $20,000 MQA Dac.
The Stereo Stores I've bought from leave me in the room alone, with all the equipment in plain view, for me to adjust as I please.
I will say that ICs and Speaker Cable upgrades make a LOT of difference to me in my systems over the years.
I heard those metal thingies once.
I don't like the idea of something Ringing while I'm listening, my Piano, for example.
Maybe those bowls actually had the effect of doubling the sound without distorting or covering the basic sound.
I'm more of a Wall-Hanging/Rug guy...
Find out if the MQA was played through the $200 MQA Dac, or the $20,000 MQA Dac
Yes, he showed me, it was a $599.00 MQA DAC.
So, if you SAW the CD ( what kind of CD player? )
and liked MQA better, that's what MQAers are saying.
But maybe it was a cheap CD player.
Maybe another would do much better.
But to me, I prefer Hi-Res over Redbook.
And a $600+- Dac is very reasonable.
Can you do some follow-up at the Store?
Remember volume levels have to be the same. Even a .2 db difference will favor the louder
Alan
Remember volume levels have to be the same. Even a .2 db difference will favor the louder
Good point. Incidentally, I found that I consistently prefer quieter configuration when comparing two variants and different volume levels. So I don't think it's necessarily the case that a louder configuration is always favoured.
But to me, I prefer Hi-Res over Redbook.After doing some A/B testing, I realized I cannot reliably detect differences between Redbook and hi-res. They sound 'dangerously' similar to me.
However, MQA sounded drastically better to my ears.
I'll try to get more specific details about the demo I listened to...
Edits: 05/15/17
Interesting!
What is your set-up for Redbook and Hi-res Playback?
What is your set-up for Redbook and Hi-res Playback?
I'm using Mac mini as the media server, streaming files via ethernet cable into Logitech Squeezebox Touch, and from there into Beresford Bushmaster DAC via digital coax.
Both the Touch and the DAC are powered by battery.
The true benefits of high resolution recordings require a bit more than what a Touch and modest DAC can deliver in order to fully appreciate.
The Touch itself is limited to 24/96. You might consider joining the ranks of many others who have sold their Touch players and have moved onto the Raspberry Pi platform for a near even swap money wise with decided performance gains in transparency and low end response.
Point taken. I know that Touch is by now a legacy platform. But I'm putting all my time and money now into the analog system, so I don't have the cycles needed to replace the Touch with Raspberry Pi (although I do have the little bugger sitting in my drawer).
If you get a minute, would you be able to point me at a good resource for the DIY project for setting up Raspberry Pi to stream hi-res content?
I asked the same question back in February. Responses found here .
Your 5V battery supply will work the RPi, but you most likely will need a different cable. Fortunately, getting a USB to mini-USB is pretty easy.
do you know of any trickery that could be applied when A/B testing a system?
Any number of ways! The mere switching itself can combine electrical characteristics of connected gear. Such a test would be irrelevant to me without knowing the particulars. Exactly what was switched? You could have been comparing MQA to a 128 kbs MP3 stream.
As for MQA vs Redbook, one reason why many DAC and music vendors refuse to sell that format is they are coy about what goes on and refuse to provide source for a truly valid comparison.
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