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Let's see if you can answer these simple questions

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In Reply to: Re: Here's what you said posted by Pat D on April 27, 2006 at 17:50:54:

1. Are your interconnects "neutral"?
2. If so, why?
rw

Follow Ups:

So, in fact, nothing in my statement was unclear and you want to shift the discussion. - Pat D 06:02:08 04/28/06 (8)
You are asking me to prove the null hypothesis, which you know very well cannot be done. So you're questions are not really honest ones, they are simply rhetoric to justify your predilection for expensive audio jewellery. The real problem is to disprove the null hypothesis, and this you have utterly failed to do.

____________________________________________________________
"Nature loves to hide."
---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
- Fine - E-Stat 07:34:53 04/28/06 (7)
  So you chose your interconnects without having a clue as to whether or not they are neutral. While you said you would prefer choosing a neutral cable, you really have no idea.
  rw
  - Provide some evidence. - Pat D 14:16:02 04/28/06 (6)
    First of all, I have said nothing about my interconnects being neutral. If they are not neutral, then I would want to know about it--except you have produced no evidence, no reason, why I should spend my time doubting that they are neutral.
    The sun rises every morning. Will the sun rise tomorrow? I have no reason to suppose that it won't, although it is possible to think of scenarios where it would not. Isaac Asimov wrote a novel, Nemesis, in which that was set to happen and the novel is about making sure the earth was saved from destruction. But I'm not seriously expecting it to happen right now.
    ____________________________________________________________
    "Nature loves to hide."
    ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
    - Evidence to what? - E-Stat 14:21:35 04/28/06 (5)
      You said you prefer neutral cables. Ok. Sounds reasonable to me.
      My question remains: How do you know what is a neutral cable?
      rw
      - Re: Evidence to what? - Pat D 14:23:59 04/28/06 (4)
        
        In Reply to: Evidence to what? posted by E-Stat on April 28, 2006 at 14:21:35:
        
        You again have asked me to prove the null hypothesis. Why don't you get honest?
        ____________________________________________________________
        "Nature loves to hide."
        ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
        
        Is this a fair conclusion? - E-Stat 14:37:38 04/28/06 (3)
        
        In Reply to: Re: Evidence to what? posted by Pat D on April 28, 2006 at 14:23:59:
        
        All cables are assumed to be sonically neutral regardless of the significant variations in basic LRC parameters, materials construction, connectors, and degree of RF shielding until proven otherwise by virtue of DBTs.
        Hmmm. You might not actually be using a neutral cable, but are unable to prove that empirically since you cannot trust your ears. Uh oh! What to do?
        rw
        
        Not really. - Pat D 18:24:27 04/28/06 (2)
        
        In Reply to: Is this a fair conclusion? posted by E-Stat on April 28, 2006 at 14:37:38:
        
        "All cables are assumed to be sonically neutral regardless of the significant variations in basic LRC parameters, materials construction, connectors, and degree of RF shielding until proven otherwise by virtue of DBTs."
        Do you have any evidence that my interconnects or most interconnects are built so badly that they mess up the signal sufficiently to be audible?
        "Hmmm. You might not actually be using a neutral cable, but are unable to prove that empirically since you cannot trust your ears. Uh oh! What to do?"
        If one does a blind audition, whose ears is one trusting? You wilfully misrepresent the truth.
        Will the sun rise tomorrow?
        ____________________________________________________________
        "Nature loves to hide."
        ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
        
        Everything sounds the same. Got it (nt) - E-Stat 18:51:59 04/28/06 (1)
        
        In Reply to: Not really. posted by Pat D on April 28, 2006 at 18:24:27:
        
        rw
        
        Where do you get such silliness? (nt) - Pat D 19:10:31 04/28/06 (0)
        
        In Reply to: Everything sounds the same. Got it (nt) posted by E-Stat on April 28, 2006 at 18:51:59:
        
        .
        ____________________________________________________________
        "Nature loves to hide."
        ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
E-Stat, you need to read Pat's tag line - Bruce from DC 05:52:28 04/28/06 (16)
"nature loves to hide"
Pat is a nature boy. He hides in the bushes ,and you'll need a bird dog to flush him out.
:-0
- Reminds me of the ever evasive Silver Eared John (nt) - E-Stat 13:33:22 04/28/06 (0)
  rw
- Re: E-Stat, you need to read Pat's tag line - bjh 07:31:44 04/28/06 (0)
  "Pat is a nature boy. He hides in the bushes ,and you'll need a bird dog to flush him out."
  Truly hilarious! LOL
  --
  However, I suspect the bird dog would be ineffective. In Pat's case I suspect even Agent Orange would be likewise, and not just as a flushant. They don't call him "Pat D Invulnerable" for nothing!
- Re: E-Stat, you need to read Pat's tag line - regmac 07:03:45 04/28/06 (1)
  I wish those nature boys would hide in the bushes. Traveling about Greece, my wife and I were treated to myriad nature worshippers whose motto appears to be, "If you got it, flaunt it." A little of that goes a long way.
  - to paraphrase our former President: - Bruce from DC 07:43:59 04/28/06 (0)
    Depends upon what "it" is!
    ;-0
- Oh no, he's just trying to trip me up. - Pat D 06:16:57 04/28/06 (11)
  He seems to think that if he can catch me in a careless statement then that will prove that the differences between various interconnects, cables and such can normally be expected to be audible. He's just being silly.
  ____________________________________________________________
  "Nature loves to hide."
  ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
  - Re: "'being silly" - Bruce from DC 08:30:21 04/28/06 (1)
    I don't think so, Pat.
    If a person believes that wires (interconnects) have no sonic effect on reproduction, then refering to a "neutral interconnect" is a redundancy. By definition, they are all neutral.
    So, which is it: a defect in your writing or a defect in your thinking?
    ;-0 [trip!]
    BTW, if you personally want to test this proposition, buy yourself a pair of DH Labs Bl-1 interconnects and a pair of Goertz Micropurl AG interconnects. They're both cheap, especially if you buy 1/2 meter length. It shouldn't be too difficult for you to set up at least an SBT of them. I make that suggestion in all seriousness because, until I replaced the DH Labs with the Goertz IC's I didn't think interconnects made any difference. Of course, the components I was connecting were different from the components you are using, so it still may not work. FWIW, the electrical characteristics of the two ICs are quite different. The Goertz wires are high capacitance, low inductance; and the DH Labs are higher inductance and probably relatively lower capacitance because of the differences in design.
    - Re: "'being silly" - Pat D 14:18:58 04/28/06 (0)
      Where have I said that every interconnect has no effect on the signal, let alone no audible effect? Anything can be built badly, but I have no reason whatever to think mine are or that selling price has much to do with it.
      ____________________________________________________________
      "Nature loves to hide."
      ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
  - Or, choice B - E-Stat 07:54:51 04/28/06 (8)
    simply trying to understand how you determined that a given cable is neutral or not.
    Evidently, you don't. You just say you like "neutral" cables.
    rw
    - Apparently you missed the most important lecture during ... - bjh 08:03:17 04/28/06 (7)
      your formal Philosophy education, i.e. you must have been away the day they viewed The Matrix. Had you not, you would be perfectly aware ...
      "There is no B."
      - Where did I assert my interconnects are neutral? - Pat D 14:21:58 04/28/06 (6)
        
        In Reply to: Apparently you missed the most important lecture during ... posted by bjh on April 28, 2006 at 08:03:17:
        
        My statement was an 'if-then' type statement. But you have given me no reason to suspect they are not audibly neutral. You apparently have no reasons for doing so.
        
        ____________________________________________________________
        "Nature loves to hide."
        ---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
        
        Ah ha --- so your interconnects are NOT neutral? - Richard BassNut Greene 07:09:06 05/03/06 (5)
        
        In Reply to: Where did I assert my interconnects are neutral? posted by Pat D on April 28, 2006 at 14:21:58:
        
        That's equivalent to throwing a horse blanket over your speakers.
        Barry Manilow could sound like Frank Sinatra.
        Frank Sinatra could sound like Tony Bennett.
        k. d. lang could sound like Tiny Tim.
        Sell all your audio equipment immediately and buy a Bose clock radio.
        
        My dear Nut... - kerr 07:26:28 05/03/06 (4)
        
        In Reply to: Ah ha --- so your interconnects are NOT neutral? posted by Richard BassNut Greene on May 3, 2006 at 07:09:06:
        
        k.d lang sounds like Tiny Tim on ANY system.
        
        k. d. lang has one of the best female voices in pop music -- although may sound like "Tiny Tim on YOUR system - Richard BassNut Greene 07:50:29 05/03/06 (3)
        
        In Reply to: My dear Nut... posted by kerr on May 3, 2006 at 07:26:28:
        
        MY stereo is better than YOUR stereo.
        
        She does - kerr 08:02:17 05/03/06 (2)
        
        In Reply to: k. d. lang has one of the best female voices in pop music -- although may sound like "Tiny Tim on YOUR system posted by Richard BassNut Greene on May 3, 2006 at 07:50:29:
        
        But really only by Annoyance Factor, not timbre or tone.
        HAF = High Annoyance Factor
        Tiny Tim - HAF
        k.d lang - HAF
        Your posts - HAF :)
        Sorry... I'd better get back to my washroom attendant duties... even numbered stalls.
        
        That was a very amusing post -- your ghostwriter is ? - Richard BassNut Greene 08:38:53 05/03/06 (1)
        
        In Reply to: She does posted by kerr on May 3, 2006 at 08:02:17:
        
        I've seen k. d. three times live.
        The Ingenue tour in the early 1990's showed me the best vocalist I've ever heard live (even compared with Ella Fitzgerald and Sarah Vaughan live, although well after their prime years). That was her peak and the slide down to mediocre songs, and too many slow ballads, has been steep since then.
        The last concert a few years ago can be described as "if one slow ballad is good, then five in a row are better". Better for falling asleep in the audience perhaps, which I almost did in spite of the fact the treble was the brightest I've ever heard at a concert (we were in the middle of the auditorium) so we had to use earplugs even though the overall SPL was unusually reasonable.
        
        You of all people should be able to answer that! - kerr 08:53:54 05/03/06 (0)
        
        In Reply to: That was a very amusing post -- your ghostwriter is ? posted by Richard BassNut Greene on May 3, 2006 at 08:38:53:
        
        YOU write them just so you can have the joy of refuting them. :)
        I don't like kd lang, you don't like Audioquest cables (or anything over 50 cents a foot, apparently) - there's no accounting for taste!

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