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As noted in some recent posts below, there have been a number of favorable, even over-the-top, comments about using vintage Western Electric 16 gauge wire as speaker cables. In the US this all began with Jeff Day's reports on his blog. I was one of the folks who was tempted by Jeff's favorable comments and I ordered several batches of the genuine WE16g wire from a reputable seller while it was still available on Ebay. In the 9 or 10 months since then, I have been able to use the WE wire in several systems and compare it to several commercial speaker cables. My conclusions about the sound of the WE wire (after being fully broken in) were the same in each setup. In a nutshell, the WE wire has some significant problems in my opinion. These are:1. Tonal Colorations. The WE wire is midrange-centric in that it emphasizes the midrange to the detriment of deep bass and upper treble. In some systems this might be an advantage but in the systems in which I have used the WE it is an aberration.
2. Lack of Fine Detail. The WE wire acts like a sponge soaking up and blocking inner detail. This is true across the entire frequency spectrum but it bothers me the most in the highs. When I switch back to my regular cables (20-year old Wireworld Eclipse), I can simply hear more musical detail. There is more differentiation of individual instruments, better separation of background vocals into individual singers, and more truthful tonality of instruments, i.e. a clarinet sounds more like a real clarinet.
3. Soundstage resolution. With the WE wires, I do not hear the same degree of ambient reverberation in live recordings compared to the same record played with other cables. This is probably related to the fine detail issue.
4. Dynamics. The WE wire actually does ok with loud dynamic crescendos, which is a little surprising given that it is just a 16 gauge wire, but it does not reveal subtle micro-dynamic contrasts as well as my Eclipse cables. Again this is probably related to the fine detail issue.
To be clear, I am not saying the WE wire is terrible or that it is not a good value. For less than $100 for a pair, it's hard to beat. But if considered without regard to cost, the WE wire does have some serious limitations in terms of ultimate sonic quality.
Also, I don't want to discourage those who are so pleased with their WE cables. If you like the sound in your system, then that's fine. That's all that matters. I am only posting this to offer another perspective: not everyone who has actually tried the WE wires loves them.
And yes I have ordered some of the new Duelund wire to try. Again at the price it seems like it's worth trying, but honestly I do not have high expectations.
Edits: 07/28/16Follow Ups:
I agree with your generalizations about the WE16 wire, but I do not experience the negative effects to the degree that you found. In my system, I actually find the midrange-centric bloom to be quite musical and the slight attenuation in the bass to be welcome relative to other cables I own that present an overdone bass that rattles the room on some music.
The WE wire sort of reminds me of high-end MUSE digital gear I used to own that displayed a more even-handed presentation that was very satisfying over the long-haul but did not have that wiz-bang-wow factor that some gear has upon first listen.
IMO, anybody using this wire with high powered solid state gear should definitely increase the wire gauge over simple runs of 16awg wire. Larger wire sizes and quad-constructed, cross-connected geometry improves dynamics, staging and deep bass, at least in my system. My best results were obtained using either a bi-wire pair of speaker cables consisting of a quad-constructed pair of WE16 wire to the MF/HF drivers and a quad constructed pair of WE14 wire to the LF drivers or, later, bi-wired pairs of WE10 (i.e., 10awg wires and 7awg aggregate to each speaker) for an even richer, more powerful result. I will likely try quad-constructed runs of WE10 wire next.
On another topic, I made balanced pairs of the Belden 8402 ICs and never liked them. They sort of did everything you point out about the WE wire but, for me, in a bad way. Sucked the life out of the music.
One last note, all the WE speaker wire discussed above was terminated with high quality copper spades and conditioned on my Audiodharma Cable Cooker.
One last note, all the WE speaker wire discussed above was terminated with high quality copper spades and conditioned on my Audiodharma Cable Cooker.
I believe Jeff Day did the same....
Thanks! for sharing- Alan.
One could say that the use of some ancient 16AWG stranded wire is the contrarian view. Just sayin.
Honest reporting- I like it- Salectric.
"As noted in some recent posts below, there have been a number of favorable, even over-the-top, comments about using vintage Western Electric 16 gauge wire as speaker cables. In the US this all began with Jeff Day's reports on his blog. I was one of the folks who was tempted by Jeff's favorable comments and I ordered several batches of the genuine WE16g wire from a reputable seller while it was still available on Ebay. In the 9 or 10 months since then, I have been able to use the WE wire in several systems and compare it to several commercial speaker cables. My conclusions about the sound of the WE wire (after being fully broken in) were the same in each setup. In a nutshell, the WE wire has some significant problems in my opinion. These are: ... "
Salectric, you are not alone. I have experienced most, if not all, of the things you mentioned with the WE 16 GA (and similarly, with the Belden 8402/Switchcraft Gold IC). I have repeatedly put them in, separately and together - and I take it/them out.
I have made PC's with WE 14 ga and 10 ga and various ends. Respectable, but one can do better.
aa
"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination" -Michael McClure
nt
Excellent responsible reportage Salectric. This kind of post IMO is a service to the audio community. Especially new people. IMHO 16AWG is too thin for optimal sound as speaker wire, as many already know. On top of that it is stranded. Some of us, I'm not the only one think that stranded wire, with wires that touch each other, is not optimal for the audio signal. Also, as I have posted before, I think it a good idea for beginning experimenters to get 10AWG Temco solderable magnet wire to use as a reference, meaning it to me sounds very good and would be a very cheap wire to try to beat. All this is IMHO,YMMV. It is also Anti-cables opinon and many other brands that would never use regular stranded wire for their products. Happy listening, Tweaker
And with system synergy playing its role its no wonder we see differing opinions. We need to respect the opinions of all on some level but the best thing to do has always been to try for ourselves.
ET
"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936
Yes, try for yourself.
I find interesting that of all the descriptions of the negatives of the WE cable I find exactly the opposite to be true. to a massive degree 9In my opinion). Also we don't all know that 16 ga cable is toothin for good base. I get thunderous deep bass down to 27hz from my Maggie 3.6 speakers using 16ga WE cable. System synergy is crucial. Try it in your own system
Alan
Alan did you use a single run or a double run with your WE16GA speaker cable with your Magnepan 3.6s? I have a small amount of probably genuine WE16GA cable that I would like to try with my 3.7s and IIIa woofer panels and would appreciate your experience with the WE16GA. I also have the Duelund cable on order as my pieces of WE16GA are rather short. Thanks in advance for your advice, Joe Fagan
Guys-
where are we regarding this issue?
I received my order of Duelund 16g wire and the very first listening was promising. I am going to break them in on my video system so won't be listening to them again in the hifi setup until they have a lot more hours.
Actually I bought a pre terminated run of WE cable. I am not sure how many runs of cable is used.
I looked closer at the cable I have and it looks like they used a single twisted pair
alan
Edits: 08/03/16
Yup you have to try it and I also don't agree with the negatives. Complete opposite as you say.
I get superb articulate bass and at times I have had people here looking for the sub.
I have the WE 14ga here too have not tried it yet. Every time i mess with pulling out the 8402 Belden and these WE16GA I have to put them back in because something had not been right. So they stay and everything gets back to normal for me. May not be for others. And that's why there is so much used shit on the market.
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