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In Reply to: RE: Better to not share a preamp in the same outlet or strip as the amp? posted by Mechans on January 16, 2017 at 04:50:05
Just to be clear, I posted Ralph's Agon quoted comments only for voltage drop, as that was the purpose of his post on Agon.As for your experiences using a single branch circuit to power all your audio you are not alone. Many others do as well.
Could it sound better using a single dedicated branch circuit strictly for your audio system, instead of a shared convenience 120V 15 amp outlet branch circuit?
Could it sound better using at least two dedicated branch circuits, one for the analog equipment and the other for the digital equipment?
All that really matters is you are happy with how your audio system sounds.
//
About 8 years ago a friend of mine that owned a B&M Audio/video store ask me to install some power on a new wall he had built. He said he didn't really care where I fed it from. I talked him into installing 2 new 20 amp dedicated branch circuits to the wall where the audio equipment rack would be located. One for analog the other for digital. (Wiring material used, two solid core 12-2 with ground MC aluminum armor cables)
I happened to stop in his place one day just to talk and look around. I noticed all the equipment on the rack was plugged into one Box Store bought power strip that was plugged into a receptacle of one of the dedicated circuits.
My friend, the owner, was not there at the time but one of his sales guys was there. I should mention the guy has been in the business for many years and has a good ear for hearing differences of audio equipment and speakers.
I asked the guy why is all the equipment plugged into one power stripped plugged into only one dedicated circuit? I reminded him I installed two, one for analog the other for digital. He replied the way he had it was to make his job easier. He then added most the people that walk through the door could not hear the difference.
I then asked him, do you think you could hear any differences? He responded, probably not.... You would be surprised how may audiophiles think the same way. How possibly could the AC mains power have any impact on the sound quality of an audio system?
I asked him if he would like to participate in a quick listening test. He said sure, why not.
Just going from memory the amplifier was a Marantz integrated and the CDP was I believe a Marantz or maybe a Cambridge audio. I don't remember the speakers. They might have been Monitor Audio or Paradigm. I do remember the pair that were hooked up at the time were floor standing and sounded pretty good connected to the Marantz amp.
For the blind test we found a good size piece of cardboard to hide his view from the two dedicated circuit wall duplex receptacles and from seeing what I might be doing. Though there was other equipment on the rack only the CDP and amp was used for the listening test.
The listening test.
I asked the guy to pick out a couple of CDs he was familiar with. CDs of a female artist and maybe some solo piano segments preferred.I first let him listen to the system as he had it connected to the power strip, plugged into the wall receptacle. I then plugged both the CDP and the amp into the same duplex receptacle, not telling what I had changed. I then said ok I am ready for him to listen to the track again and listen for any differences. Believe it or not I could hear a slight difference for the better right off the bat. The guy listened for only about 30 seconds and then said let him listen to it again the other way. He had me repeat the A/B comparison only a few times and picked the sound that sounded best to ears. I then removed the cardboard so he could see both the CDP and amp plugged directly into the same duplex receptacle.(I should mention here the power strip was not an audio grade power strip by any means. The purpose of test was to set up a level playing field for the next test that would follow.
Test 2.
Could he hear any differences when the CDP and amp was plugged into the same duplex fed from only one branch circuit, and when each were fed from their own dedicated branch circuit.For this test A/B/X testing was used. Cardboard screen was again used so he could not see what I was doing.
I allowed him to listen to A or B upon request. He then could then ask to listen to X again.
30 seconds or so of listening some times less was all that was needed for him when listening to a song. Just going from memory he picked when I had the CDP fed from one circuit and the amp fed from the other circuit sounding the best to his ears every time. After about 6 to 8 trials he said that's enough. That one sounds the best, remove the piece of cardboard.
I said what do you think? He agreed it definitely sounded better when the CDP was plugged into one circuit and the amp plugged into the other..... But then he added but most of the people that walk through the door won't know the difference. Especially if he doesn't tell them or show them.
When I went back a few weeks later everything was plugged into the single plug strip and fed from one wall outlet circuit.
Edits: 01/16/17Follow Ups:
The main danger of desiring to use two or more outlets is the possibility of having BOTH branches of the 240 connected through the IC.
No problem until a fault. Then you could get 240 volt differential possible through the IC connecting the two separate 120v branch.
(combined they make the 240 volt differential)Like I wrote, this is not usually ever an issue. but it can accidentally create a potential lethal voltage.
You can check to see if both AC duplex are from the same 'side' of the 240v. buy using a voltage checker from both 'hot' sides of the two duplex. If you get O voltage. then they are the same. If you get 240v, then they are from the two different sides.
If you have no idea which is the hot.. Then the readings would be (trying all four wires with each other through a voltmeter for AC level) same: 0v(both hot) 120v 120v (hots to other neutral) 0v(both neutral). or if not same: 240v(both hot), 120v 120v(hots to other neutral) 0v(both neutral)
Edits: 01/16/17
Sorry I forgot to mention that.Though I should mention I have read posts where a user had big 600 watt mono block krell amps fed from two dedicated circuits installed on Line 1 and Line 2, (240V potential between the 2 hot contacts of the 120V dedicated branch circuits), without any adverse SQ problems.
In this instance the importance of the integrity of the electrical safety
equipment ground is of the upmost importance. It could/would prove to be quite dangerous/lethal if the equipment ground was defeated/lifted on either amp or both.//
3+4=5,
You got me thinking while reading your post. A while back on the Agon forum I was responding to a guy that lives in Chicago Il. Chicago has some old out of date electrical codes that are still required by their city AHJ, (Authority Having Jurisdiction). Still to this day branch circuit wiring must be installed in EMT conduit inside a single family dwelling unit.
What really peaked my attention was the use of multi wire branch circuits where the neutral is shared with two hot wires, (two separate 120V circuits). One must be fed from one Line, leg, the other fed from the other Hot Line, leg, in the electrical panel......
(Note: Only the imbalanced load of the 2 hot conductors returns on the neutral conductor to the electrical panel.)For any of you that live in Chicago be damn careful if you personally try replacing any wall duplex receptacles convenience outlets where the device is used as a junction point for the shared white neutral conductor. You might have the HOT circuit feeding that duplex receptacle de-energized but if the other hot circuit of the 3 wire multi conductor branch circuit is still energized you may receive a lethal electrical shock when breaking, disconnecting, the neutral wires from the duplex receptacle..... TAKE A GOOD LOOK INSIDE the wall duplex receptacle outlet box for another HOT circuit wire passing through the same box.
I have also found Florida use to use a lot of 3 wire with ground Romex multi wire branch circuits.
Informational note:
Just going from memory I believe the 2008 NEC Edition starting requiring all multi wire branch circuits must be fed from a multi pole breaker or breakers using an approved common trip handle.... That does not mean the AHJ in your area adopted the change......//
Check out the Link/video below on how a multi wire circuit shared neutral works.
Edits: 01/16/17
This is all absolutely crazy but completely right,
To tone it back a notch, I have a power strip with 5 zones. I made one zone dedicated to the Hypex amp and bass has improved, the thing is I have the preamp and DAC on the same zone, immediate difference, much veil, but very good, also my preamp is breaking in at the same time I am going nuts.
Thanks again for all the help, this is much fun.
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