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General Asylum: That is missing the point... by jamesgarvin General audio topics that don't fit into specific categories. |
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In Reply to: The sound can enhance the experience or detract from it posted by Sordidman on January 24, 2012 at 12:32:15:
Certainly the sound can detract from the live music event. Or it can make it more pleasurable. And the sound can detract from the recorded event. Or it can make it more pleasurable. The point is that a music lover listens beyond the sound, and appreciates the music on its own terms, regardless of the sound. The music loving audiophile may notice the sound, but listens anyway because the music is worth it, and they allow their souls to be moved. For example, audiophiles who listen in the car, and attend live music events, and perhaps even on a clock radio. They are still audiophiles. And they are music lovers. Then there are the audiophiles who cannot listen to a music performance unless it sounds right to them. Or they only purchase music that accentuates the positives of their systems.
How to characterize someone who only listens to music on a high end audio system, who refuses to actually experience live music either because of laziness or because they don't like the sound of a venue? They can call themselves whatever they want. I simply don't believe someone who listens to music only on a high end audio system and does not listen to music anywhere else and does not attend live music events because the 'sound' is not up to par is truly a music lover. They are a sound lover.
It is sort of like calling yourself a good citizen because you watch MSNBC or Foxnews, except you can't take the time to vote.
I suspect you believe audiophiles are automatically music lovers. My point was they are not automatically music lovers. Listening to music does not automatically qualify someone as a music lover. They are audiophiles because they own the equipment. Really, all it takes to be an audiophile is to write checks, or flash plastic. That requires little effort. The heavy lifting is actually immersing yourself in music.
We can all appreciate better sound. I think your opera example is a little misleading. I suspect you are not a fan of the opera. Consequently, for you, the sound was more important than the content. On the other hand, I suspect there were a great many opera fans there that evening who were moved, sound be damned. I read that Avery Fisher Hall is a terrible acoustic - yet it regularly fills up.
And that is the crux of the matter. I think you can group listeners into three catagories. Are you into sound? Music? Or both? (1) The music (genre dependent, of course) moves the music lover, who cares not a whit what it sounded like. (2) The sounds move the non-music loving audiophile, who is focused more on the sounds than the music, and will not listen to a recording because it lacks or has something objectionable. (3) And then there is the audiophile who, after listening to a record or live music event, would say "I loved the music and had a great time, but I wish it were just a little ......," or had "a little less less....." or "it sounded really crappy, but man, they did some great things up on that stage. I am impressed." The music loving audiophile appreciates the sounds, but ultimately judges the music on its own terms.
My point is that there are many audiophiles who are also music lovers, but not necessarily. It takes more than buying square boxes and having electricity to be a music lover. For me, personally, I find it difficult to call someone a music lover who does not attend live music events. You've heard the saying "actions speak louder than words?"
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Topic - Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - thetubeguy1954 04:12:17 01/24/12 ( 102)
- Just had a related thought - Japesgalore 03:21:20 01/28/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - otari 03:12:23 01/26/12 ( 0)
The premise is invalid - vinyl phanatic 08:07:05 01/25/12 ( 0)
Audiophiles never have enough... - Neil49 04:13:12 01/25/12 ( 0)
Well, it can get pretty complicated... - genungo 02:36:16 01/25/12 ( 0)
It depends - Teresa 01:24:32 01/25/12 ( 0)
there is no spoon - hifitommy 22:29:23 01/24/12 ( 7)
- Damn....and I was just starting to forget about those clowns - Justlisten2 12:46:05 01/26/12 ( 1)
- Everyone needs a soapbox, even if... - kerr 16:15:20 01/26/12 ( 0)
That phrase is spoiled for me - kerr 09:49:54 01/25/12 ( 4)
- i almost anticipated your response - hifitommy 21:26:25 01/25/12 ( 3)
- That's the guy! - kerr 04:34:51 01/26/12 ( 2)
- look what i found - hifitommy 06:13:00 01/26/12 ( 1)
- RE: look what i found - kerr 11:15:57 01/26/12 ( 0)
The real question - HarlemAirShaft 22:14:31 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - hahax@verizon.net 20:29:07 01/24/12 ( 0)
As Todd says below they are just labels… - three_sox 20:06:53 01/24/12 ( 4)
- RE: As Todd says below they are just labels… - Inmate51 10:48:17 01/25/12 ( 0)
It may be trivia...... - Alpha Al 20:15:37 01/24/12 ( 2)
- Next you will say a Sudz post is not trivia ... - three_sox 20:33:07 01/24/12 ( 1)
- Concur. Sudz is leader of the "Occupy Bandwidth" movement N/t - Alpha Al 20:52:13 01/24/12 ( 0)
I Don't Know............ - Todd Krieger 19:47:05 01/24/12 ( 0)
Simple - AbeCollins 19:21:24 01/24/12 ( 2)
- RE: Simple - JCarney 10:48:21 01/25/12 ( 0)
So What About This? - Todd Krieger 19:52:53 01/24/12 ( 0)
Audiophiles listen to test tones and Music Lovers to music - KIDDING!!!ence? - Arvind Kohli 18:04:37 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: Audiophiles listen to test tones and Music Lovers to music - KIDDING!!!ence? - Bill the K 19:43:08 01/24/12 ( 0)
This is worthy of discussion over beer only. nt - Norm 17:45:03 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: This is worthy of discussion over beer only. nt - JCarney 10:45:00 01/25/12 ( 0)
Just a somewhat lopsided Venn diagram - josh358 17:18:23 01/24/12 ( 3)
- RE: It"s as the late Gizmo put it--- - painter27 17:53:15 01/24/12 ( 2)
- RE: It"s as the late Gizmo put it--- - josh358 18:56:30 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: It"s as the late Gizmo put it--- - painter27 19:12:59 01/24/12 ( 0)
To me? - Condorsat 13:17:15 01/24/12 ( 1)
- 25 years ago ... - reelsmith. 15:35:26 01/24/12 ( 0)
Absolutely Nothing - hodad 13:16:58 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - middleground 13:13:16 01/24/12 ( 2)
- That JA canard is simply untrue, one could have thousands of recordings and still have spent more on gear. - cfb 15:07:54 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: That JA canard is simply untrue, one could have thousands of recordings and still have spent more on gear. - josh358 19:03:39 01/24/12 ( 0)
An audiophile likes gear, while a music lover MAY... - Steve Parry 13:12:47 01/24/12 ( 0)
Well, I regularly attend live unamplified concerts, rarely - Timbo in Oz 12:57:44 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: Well, I regularly attend live unamplified concerts, rarely - josh358 19:07:02 01/24/12 ( 0)
A Music Lover is a former Audiophile who can no longer afford to purchase gear. ;-) - cfb 12:14:26 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Chazro 12:06:23 01/24/12 ( 1)
- "A Sudz question" LOL - double28 13:25:54 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - kerr 11:44:42 01/24/12 ( 2)
- RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - adaug 21:09:04 01/24/12 ( 0)
I like that.nt - jamesgarvin 15:17:05 01/24/12 ( 0)
If you don't know, you're probably an audiophile - J.Mac 11:36:16 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Bizango1 11:35:07 01/24/12 ( 0)
I'm surprised no one mentioned this yet - it's so obvious: - carcass93 10:44:19 01/24/12 ( 3)
- You are being a little too melodramatic, I'd say... - genungo 18:51:10 01/24/12 ( 0)
Okay, so I'm confused. Which one is illegal and morally wrong? - Raiderman 11:02:07 01/24/12 ( 1)
- When did Audiophile become a pejorative term for some other than as used by significant others – WAF. - cfb 12:10:43 01/24/12 ( 0)
My best friend is a music lover... - Petevisits 10:35:06 01/24/12 ( 1)
- Man, PAR? or? you seem to post under a lot of different - Sordidman 10:57:06 01/24/12 ( 0)
One can be both... - mkuller 10:23:51 01/24/12 ( 0)
One simple answer . . . - M3 lover 10:13:47 01/24/12 ( 0)
about $10,000 ! :) - PhilJ 10:11:38 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: about $10,000 ! :) - JCarney 11:54:05 01/24/12 ( 0)
Audiophile has a system and can name every component brand, music lover gives a blank stare when asked brands - Elizabeth 09:56:28 01/24/12 ( 0)
I'd rather hear music I like on an AM radio than a hair band on a great system. nt - hcman 09:26:22 01/24/12 ( 0)
IMHO, it is a level of commitment - jamesgarvin 09:25:41 01/24/12 ( 10)
- RE: IMHO, it is a level of commitment - josh358 17:24:10 01/24/12 ( 0)
Disagree with JA. The acquisition expense ratio on recordings has no bearing on the matter. Here's why; - cfb 12:41:07 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: IMHO, it is a level of commitment - Skye 09:37:15 01/24/12 ( 7)
- And there is the crux of the issue... - jamesgarvin 10:08:01 01/24/12 ( 5)
- The sound can enhance the experience or detract from it - Sordidman 12:32:15 01/24/12 ( 3)
- That is missing the point... - jamesgarvin 01/24/12 16:12:22 01/24/12 ( 2)
- Your statement..... - Sordidman 16:39:31 01/24/12 ( 0)
- What about the househusband or housewife - Sordidman 16:33:04 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: And there is the crux of the issue... - Skye 11:43:28 01/24/12 ( 0)
My "other hand" has four fingers and a thumb. - M3 lover 10:07:37 01/24/12 ( 0)
What's the Difference or is there any? - tomservo 09:23:12 01/24/12 ( 7)
- RE: What's the Difference or is there any? - Inmate51 12:01:21 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: What's the Difference or is there any? - Inmate51 11:19:09 01/24/12 ( 1)
- RE: What's the Difference or is there any? - tomservo 19:26:53 01/24/12 ( 0)
Making live music sound better is answering the highest audio calling. - Enophile 09:30:08 01/24/12 ( 3)
- RE: Making live music sound better is answering the highest audio calling. - tomservo 19:28:30 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Making live music sound better is answering the highest audio calling. - Inmate51 11:40:55 01/24/12 ( 1)
- I wish more people went into engineering, then. The majority of live sound sucks. - Enophile 13:08:35 01/24/12 ( 0)
none - Sordidman 08:59:31 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Bizango1 08:53:12 01/24/12 ( 0)
The Difference - Skye 08:52:06 01/24/12 ( 0)
Both! I love high end stuff (read: GOOD sounding) and have been a musician for over 25 years... - Dman 08:41:09 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Inmate51 08:37:32 01/24/12 ( 0)
Music lovers are too busy enjoying music to be overly bothered with a gear fetish. - Enophile 08:20:21 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - mcguirek 08:09:44 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - daleda 07:45:24 01/24/12 ( 0)
In my case equipment always stood on the way - on truly enjoying the music.. - Eldragon@gmx.com 07:39:09 01/24/12 ( 0)
Unabashed, unashamed, unapologetic Audiophile and equipment enthusiast. I seek recreated “real” sound - cfb 07:31:28 01/24/12 ( 2)
- Recreated real sound - Mike K 08:22:49 01/24/12 ( 1)
- Ah, there's the rub; what aspects of sound that seem “real” to one may not be so to another. However, - cfb 09:08:03 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Sebrof 06:58:46 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Alpha Al 06:19:01 01/24/12 ( 0)
If you believe them, sound vs. song - bartc 06:06:29 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - Bromo33333 05:56:29 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - adaug 04:40:05 01/24/12 ( 4)
- RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - josh358 19:12:40 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - manor999 17:28:06 01/24/12 ( 0)
Excellent definition!...N/T - musetap 08:45:00 01/24/12 ( 0)
RE: Audiophile vs Music Lover --What's the Difference? - ahendler 07:32:38 01/24/12 ( 0)