What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE

24.42.134.101

Posted by dejan on January 3, 2002 at 15:11:35

Hello,

I have B&W CDM1SE for nearly two years. I use them in my small (12'x9'x8') study. They are on firm, sand-filled three-pillar stands (26'' - a little higher than usual to bring them to my ear level when I am sitting in the computer chair). Due to space limitations, the back sides of the speakers are 12'' from the front wall (which is not that bad since they are front-ported, so the distance from the woofers is actually about 2'). The speakers are slightly toed in and biwired with two runs of Audioquest Type 4.

I tried many amps with them (Linn Majik, Audio Analogue Pucinni, Bryston B60, Classe CAP-101, Musical Fidelity A3, Arcam A85) hoping to find the winning combination. However, I am at the end of my rope and I think I will need to upgrade the speakers also.

I have the following problems with CDM1SE:

1) They sound slightly 'stuffy'. They have the famed B&W midrange, but it is not that flat (it has some midrange prominence followed by somewhat recessed presence region). After two years, they failed to 'relax' - they always sound strained and uptight (the opposite of relaxed).

2) They have the usual BBC bump in the mid/upper bass. It gives speakers some 'wooden' quality that helps cello and piano have the resonant body, but can sound 'hard', particularly combined with elevated 1-2kHz region. In addition, this bump combines with my small room modes to mask the midrange and lower bass (whatever it can master given the enclosure and woofer limitations).

3) As many other B&W Kevlar-based speakers, it can sound dry.

Here is the ideal speaker I am looking for, given the limitations:

1) A stand-mount that either has a front port or will not object having the rear port as close as 12'' from the front wall.
2) Budget range $1000-1500.
3) Should be refined, linear and without the BBC midbass bump to avoid small room mode excitation.
4) Should not have strong output below 50Hz (again, small room modes).

I read many posts here and I understand I can find cheap speakers like NHT Super One or Triangle Titus that would work well in this situation. However, I would like to 'upgrade', not 'downgrade' i.e. want a more upscale sound than the usual budget 'suspects'. My problem is that more expensive speakers are also harder to position in a small room.

I had some offers to get almost new B&W N805 or Totem Model One Signature. I used to lust for a N805 (compared it to CDM1 SE and liked it much, much more), but from all the posts here, they may overload my small room even though they have a front-firing port. Similarly, although Totem Ones are small, they need space and 12'' from the front wall may also result in excessive boom. I also listened to CDM1NT and although I see from the measurements that it does not have the bump like CDM1SE, it has peaky treble (which means I would trade hard, wooden quality to hard, metalic quality :-).

As a side note, I am a little frustrated now. You would think that there are hundreds of speakers to choose from. But when you factor in budget and small room constraints, very few speakers are left standing :-).

So the question is: what is the majical speaker that is clean, neutral, relaxed, refined, fairly flat, without the artificial bass bump, easy to position (can tolerate 12'' from the front wall and a small room) and costs between $1000 and $1500? Or should I ask 'is there such a speaker at all' :-).

P.S. Please help a poor fellow inmate regain sleep :-). If I don't find the speakers that work with the room, there is no point upgrading upstream components (it can be counter-productive; adding more powerful amplifier typically results in more bass extension i.e. more boom - not what you were hoping :-).

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Topic - What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - dejan 15:11:35 01/03/02 (24)

Plugs and panels... - Arvind Kohli 09:37:08 01/09/02 (0)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - Greg 17:41:12 01/05/02 (0)

Same Ol' Problem, Still No Solution - Luminator 08:51:14 01/04/02 (4)

Re: Same Ol' Problem, Still No Solution - dejan 09:17:19 01/04/02 (3)

No bass, insensitive...hmmm - layman 19:00:05 01/04/02 (0)

Speaking Of Headphones - Luminator 12:44:00 01/04/02 (0)

Headphones? (nt) - Christine Tham 12:21:00 01/04/02 (0)

North Creek Okara II - MozartRules 06:30:49 01/04/02 (0)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - noel 04:27:22 01/04/02 (0)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - Christine Tham 21:19:21 01/03/02 (1)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - dejan 21:41:38 01/03/02 (0)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - Sean H 20:24:11 01/03/02 (0)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - Brad V 17:48:10 01/03/02 (2)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - josh 08:45:51 01/04/02 (1)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - Brad V 07:53:23 01/05/02 (0)

Sapphire III LE - Tiny 17:31:12 01/03/02 (1)

Re: Sapphire III LE - AaronT 04:21:53 01/04/02 (0)

I always like the original CDM1 better than any of the newer... - Mike 16:19:30 01/03/02 (4)

Re: I always like the original CDM1 better than any of the newer... - dejan 16:43:34 01/03/02 (3)

Plus, Classe CAP-101 gets too hot - dejan 16:49:38 01/03/02 (2)

I guess we have differing sonic opinions... - Mike 07:52:06 01/05/02 (1)

Re: I guess we have differing sonic opinions... - dejan 11:37:30 01/05/02 (0)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - Cut-Throat 15:21:01 01/03/02 (1)

Re: What speakers instead of B&W CDM1SE - BernardD 10:43:37 01/09/02 (0)

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