Home Music Lane

It's all about the music, dude! Sit down, relax and listen to some tunes.

RE: Seriously?

>> I'm afraid you've lost me on the rhythm thing.>>

OK I will remind you of what you said on the subject.
"Yuja Wang's rhythms are wrong, and where they aren't wrong, they're unsophisticated."

>> While the rhythmic anomalies were obvious and had been mentioned in previous posts, I didn't myself mention them at that point.>>

See there you go again. "wrong rhythms" "rhythmic anomalies" that you are now claiming are "obvious." So obvious that two jazz musicians both of whom are fans of Art Tatum missed them? Maybe you could be more specific about the alleged "wrongness" of the rhythms and the alleged "rhythmic anomalies?" It would be quite interesting to see if you can point them out the the jazz musicians who seem to be utterly oblivious to the "obvious."



>> As to the jazz pianist, well, I suppose it's interesting on some level. But it has little significance to the argument, because it's an appeal to authority, which, as of course you know having brought that up, is a logical fallacy.>>

But before this was your position on such things.

"I think that you have to have some familiarity with a genre to sense when the style is right or not, and fully judge the skill of a performer."

So would you say that Sasha Mazakowski has "some familiarity with the genre?" Clearly she did not sense that the style was "wrong." If you are going to assert that your claims on these alleged "rhythmic anomalies" are valid based on your familiarity with the genre you can't claim logical fallacy when an opposing position is presented by someone who is clearly more familiar with that genre

>>Tchaikovsky didn't like Brahms. Could there be a more authoritative opinion on things musical than Tchaikovsky's? And yet, I feel quite confident in saying that Brahms was a great composer.>>

Had Tchaikovsky made objective claims of Brahms music being objectively "wrong" then the analogy would work. It has been said numerous times by both Chris and myself that we take no issue with your subjective opinions on the piece.

It is your objective assertions of "rhythmic anomalies" and lack of "sophistication" that I find problematic. And the bottom line is your appeal to your experience "I think that you have to have some familiarity with a genre to sense when the style is right or not, and fully judge the skill of a performer." doesn't seem to hold up in this case as we have two musicians, one of which has a college degree in jazz did not detect any such "rhythmic anomalies."

>> You don't have to be a chef to know whether a meal is good. Such judgments are made through talent, which is partly inborn, and exposure.>>


So are you suggesting that your assertions of the "wrongness" of the rhythms or as you put it in your last post the "rhythmic anomalies" are supported by your "talent which is partly inborn and exposure." as opposed to Sasha Mazakowski's "talent, which is partly born, and exposure?" I think you lose the argument if that is the criteria.

>> Professional training isn't necessary. And the reason I think is that, after all, art (and cooking) appeal to the faculty of the listener, not the performer (or gourmet). Professional training teaches us to make a souffle, not to enjoy it.>>

Really? It seems you are saying there are chefs who are good at what they do and knowledgable about food but lack the ability to discern the quality food? If that is your position I think you are plainly wrong. One can not excel at anything without the ability to evaluate the success of their en devours and the en devours of others. There is no way a musician as well versed in jazz as Sasha Mazakowski is going to miss objectively "wrong rhythms" or "rhythmic anomalies." You may not like the tempo Yuja Wang chose and you may not like her choices in phrasing. But there is no way they are objectively wrong.


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