First of all humans are a whole,and while we can analytically give names to aspects of our being.

Posted by Timbo in Oz (A) on August 10, 2012 at 17:13:45

In Reply to: RE: There's an interesting thread over at General! posted by learsfool on August 9, 2012 at 23:59:06:

These are arbitrary (but useful) distinctions, all classifications are arbitrary just by the way. I'm not saying that reductive analysis isn't useful, but that it does have limits. And that it is not the only valid path to usable knowledge. Systems thinking tries to avoid this by looking at wholes.

I'm engaged on this subject because I enjoy thinking - it gives me pleasure and I'm emotionally attached to it. I wouldn't bother if I didn't.

If all classifications aren't arbitrary then I'd put it to you that 'fuzzy logic' (aka continuous set theory) which makes your life safer in many ways every day, can't work. It is dependent on the fact that many things, events, processes, entities, can have part membership in other classes.

As far as I can see appreciation and understanding are interlinked, or overlap to use another word, and that even emotions and intellect are interlinked and interdependent. Try the article on 'Objectivity' I've posted here at AA several times. It argues that 'objective man' as distinct from 'subjective man' is wrong headed. Even when we are measuring, and certainly when telling someone (or a whole readership) what we thought about a performance.

So, I don't think our responses to music can be independent of what we already know, I think it is impossible for that to be true.

In logic either knowing more helps us appreciate/understand something or it doesn't, so why do we bother, because it does?

I agree that a lot of audiophile recordings are limited musically, but I also find that multiple close mono-miked mix-downs by definition are destructive of the music being made, because it alters timing and interplay and is also lossy in the same way as lossy digital is. Just as two pebbles in a pond will create two expanding ring ripples which will cancel as the ripples meet. I prefer recordings that get out of the way. Yes, the sound at concerts is most unlike even a simple coincident pair recording.

Lots of people run or broadcast 'Music appreciation' courses. Like the one you can click on below. I haven't experience or reviewed any that are restricted to how we should feel at any given point or what Haydn intended the affect to be. Most of them are focussed on structure, development, keys and form. And human contexts and music history.

Now either the people who run them or attend to them are either wasting their time or they're not.

Warmest

Tim Bailey

Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger

Key to music. (Open in New Window)

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Follow Ups Full Thread

Topic - There's an interesting thread over at General! - Timbo in Oz 15:32:36 08/08/12 (24)

Pardon My Ignorance, But............. - Todd Krieger 00:36:32 08/10/12 (2)

RE: Pardon My Ignorance, But............. - Timbo in Oz 00:44:53 08/11/12 (1)

Oh.......... - Todd Krieger 20:30:54 08/11/12 (0)

RE: There's an interesting thread over at General! - learsfool 23:59:06 08/09/12 (2)

First of all humans are a whole,and while we can analytically give names to aspects of our being. - Timbo in Oz 17:13:45 08/10/12 (0)

RE: There's an interesting thread over at General! - rbolaw 07:57:38 08/10/12 (0)

When a solo orchestral violinist closes their eyes and looks heavenward - Frihed89 23:26:44 08/09/12 (1)

Expense Account? I Want that job! - oldmkvi 09:04:14 08/10/12 (0)

No. - rbolaw 18:52:24 08/08/12 (11)

first-time listener - oldmkvi 07:40:04 08/09/12 (0)

If you read my posts to the thread, you'll find that I disagree - Timbo in Oz 19:41:56 08/08/12 (9)

WADR, I think you underestimate - rbolaw 06:22:18 08/09/12 (0)

Sheldon, Sheldon, Sheldon.... - jimbill 22:49:15 08/08/12 (7)

If you ahd read my posts to the thread, you'd know that I can only - Timbo in Oz 02:38:51 08/09/12 (1)

Not upset - jimbill 22:36:54 08/09/12 (0)

RE: Sheldon, Sheldon, Sheldon.... - kavakidd 22:52:43 08/08/12 (4)

RE: Sheldon, Sheldon, Sheldon.... - jimbill 22:42:27 08/09/12 (0)

Reda my posts, Dave - Timbo in Oz 04:01:13 08/09/12 (2)

I did - kavakidd 09:37:01 08/09/12 (1)

Par for his course. nt - Rick W 09:46:20 08/09/12 (0)

RE: There's an interesting thread over at General! - robert920rogers@gmail.com 16:25:59 08/08/12 (0)

RE: There's an interesting thread over at General! - hesson11 15:59:18 08/08/12 (2)

it's not the one Sudz posted - Timbo in Oz 17:07:35 08/08/12 (1)

Too sleepy to give a rat's ass. - hesson11 21:06:43 08/08/12 (0)

Follow Ups

First of all humans are a whole,and while we can analytically give names to aspects of our being. - Timbo in Oz 17:13:45 08/10/12 (0)

First of all humans are a whole,and while we can analytically give names to aspects of our being.

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