In Reply to: What would you do?? posted by muzak lvr on March 16, 2005 at 22:09:37:
When the brand and model are hidden, and two components play at exactly the same SPL, audiophiles often do not hear differences among amplifiers (non-clipping) and preamplifiers (except for some high output impedance (tube) models that alter the frequency response in reaction to the speakers impedance curves) ... and so far none have been able to prove an ability to hear differences among wires.Contrast the consistent results under controlled listening conditions with sighted auditions where one virtually never hears the words:
"I can't hear a difference" or "I don't know which component sounds best".The bias toward hearing real or imagined differences among many audiophiles is huge -- those who listen under blind conditions suffer character attacks when reporting the results of their experiments ... by audiophiles who have spent a lot of money on components and refuse to accept any possibility that they imagined component differences.
Controlled listening experiments done under double-blind conditions may not apply to your ears if you did not participate, however it wouldn't be wise to casually dismiss the results merely because one believes component differences are virtually always audible (the golden ear mantra).
Under controlled conditions, audiophile's hearing ability has been consistently proven to be significantly worse than the audiophile's expected.
Differences "heard" in sighted warm-up auditions often magically "disappear" minutes later under double-blind conditions.
The possibility of hearing no real audible difference from new electronics, and especially from wires, should not be casually dismissed if you want to make an intelligent purchase decision.
Upgrading speakers, adding room acoustic treatments and buying the highest quality recordings are most audible. Parametric equalization of subwoofer bass frequencies (under 80Hz.) is also audible in most rooms. Equalization of frequencies above 80Hz. is also audible although may be worse than before if the EQ is used for more than very minor changes to the speaker's frequency response.
Many audio beliefs are nothing more than urban myths and unproven conclusions. The belief that "real" audiophiles can virtually always hear differences among components has yet to be proven in over 30 years of blind auditions (where attitudes, beliefs and expectations
have a limited effect on what people hear).
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Follow Ups
- Speakers are the only component you can upgrade with high confidence of hearing a real difference - Richard BassNut Greene 08:21:43 03/17/05 (44)
- True! - Al Sekela 13:36:16 03/18/05 (1)
- Almost funny Al, but not as funny as Golden Ears "testing" their hearing ability ! - Richard BassNut Greene 10:00:05 03/21/05 (0)
- I'll give audiophiles credit for being able to hear whether new speakers are really "updgrades" - Richard BassNut Greene 11:01:58 03/18/05 (4)
- Wait a minute here... - mkuller 13:58:16 03/18/05 (2)
- You attack thoughts not in my posts (why waste bandwidth?) = maybe you can't refute what I actually write ? - Richard BassNut Greene 10:34:29 03/21/05 (1)
- Call the wahhh-mbulance... - mkuller 12:08:06 03/21/05 (0)
- This was supposed to be a response to Pablo -- the confuser obviously made mistake and placed it here - Richard BassNut Greene 11:05:49 03/18/05 (0)
- I disagree - PabloP 10:23:43 03/18/05 (0)
- Re: Speakers are the only component you can upgrade with high confidence of hearing a real difference - Peter 14:34:10 03/17/05 (0)
- Everyone needs to listen for themselves and decide... - mkuller 14:00:36 03/17/05 (9)
- Knowing the brand & model of component being auditioned can distract from the sound quality analysis - Richard BassNut Greene 11:24:22 03/18/05 (7)
- You and many of the other naysayers who claim... - mkuller 12:15:23 03/18/05 (6)
- Once again you twist my thought so you can attack them -- my posts are clearly written for those who read them - Richard BassNut Greene 10:48:20 03/21/05 (3)
- This ONE sentence is the key... - mkuller 13:00:04 03/21/05 (2)
- I have no proof your attack posts waste bandwidth, however just reading them gets me close - Richard BassNut Greene 14:48:35 03/21/05 (1)
- "I have no proof"... - mkuller 14:53:09 03/21/05 (0)
- Re: Why would introducing 'X' into the A/B blind-testing... - BluesMan 09:01:56 03/19/05 (1)
- Try a DBT for yourself... - mkuller 11:41:22 03/19/05 (0)
- Mistaken quantifiers. - Pat D 18:05:29 03/17/05 (0)
- Never trust anyone,on any issue, that is ABSOLUTELY sure that their opinion is unquestionably right. NT - lancelot 12:49:00 03/17/05 (1)
- There are no "ABSOLUTES" in my original post -- you have a reading disability - Richard BassNut Greene 11:34:39 03/18/05 (0)
- not true - Donald North 12:04:08 03/17/05 (3)
- They were not controlled tests, they were out-of-control auditions typical of high-end audio "golden ears" ! - Richard BassNut Greene 11:49:45 03/18/05 (2)
- Proof... - mkuller 11:50:13 03/19/05 (1)
- Better to keep quite and be thought a fool ... but that never stops your attack posts - Richard BassNut Greene 11:00:30 03/21/05 (0)
- Re: Speakers are the only component you can upgrade with high confidence of hearing a real difference - Brian Cheney 08:51:21 03/17/05 (4)
- Your choice of which type of component to create (speakers) answers the question clearly - Richard BassNut Greene 11:57:52 03/18/05 (1)
- Re: Your choice of which type of component to create (speakers) answers the question clearly - Brian Cheney 13:30:22 03/18/05 (0)
- Crudely put, Brian, but ... - Feanor 09:21:32 03/17/05 (1)
- Re: Crudely put, Brian, but ... - Brian Cheney 09:28:54 03/18/05 (0)
- That is absolutely amazing - MarkgM 08:49:19 03/17/05 (0)
- Re: Speakers are the only component you can upgrade with high confidence of hearing a real difference - hifi heretic 08:48:46 03/17/05 (6)
- What components do you use? - Chris_F 09:09:55 03/17/05 (5)
- Found your system in the Member's Systems area - Chris_F 09:22:08 03/17/05 (1)
- I can't say... - hifi heretic 09:40:47 03/17/05 (0)
- Not Best Buy, but not the most estoteric, either - hifi heretic 09:20:03 03/17/05 (2)
- Thanks for your response - Chris_F 09:27:52 03/17/05 (1)
- and you too! - hifi heretic 09:48:18 03/17/05 (0)
- Re: Speakers are the only component you can upgrade with high confidence of hearing a real difference - mintaka 08:44:25 03/17/05 (0)
- What components are you using in your system? - Chris_F 08:25:41 03/17/05 (4)
- My components at home listed here - Richard BassNut Greene 12:10:10 03/18/05 (3)
- You don't understand my intent behind the question - Chris_F 04:42:04 03/19/05 (1)
- You misquote me and then wonder why I don't respond? - Richard BassNut Greene 11:05:57 03/21/05 (0)
- Richard, you have a thing about Wollensak and Bogen :-) - andy_c 19:42:08 03/18/05 (0)