High Efficiency Speaker Asylum Need speakers that can rock with just one watt? You found da place.

---

[ Follow Ups ] [ Post Followup ] Thread: [ Display  All  Email ] [ High Efficiency Speaker Asylum ]

---

[ Alert Moderator ]

---

you've never heard of "cupped hands" distortion?

Posted by thump (A) on February 21, 2017 at 22:42:36

In Reply to: believe as you like (nt) posted by mhardy6647 on February 21, 2017 at 14:46:23:

there are several WELL KNOWN forms of distortion inherent in horn design. as mentioned, one is the "cupped hands" syndrome. horns are also prone to shriek, spit & sizzle. i've heard this any number of times on crappy club speakers.

i'm not going to go digging for my absolute sound magazine with the review of avagantgarde's zero 1, but YOU should read the review as it goes into detail about other forms of distortion horns can create eg. if there are imperfections in the throat of the horn. from what i do know of horns, waveguides are the least distorted type.

the article is very favorable in its review of zero 1s stating that they overcome most of the drawbacks of horns, including time alignment issues and the reviewer names it "the best" horn speaker ever, but STILL notes some siblance issues, which i've heard plenty of times with lousy club systems. i don't like ANYTHING about PA speakers, especially the sloppy loose bass and i don't care how much air they move.

you claim "technical superiority" of horns, as being a regular here, methinks you're biased in favor of "that sound" just as i'm biased towards the tight, controlled, imaging monster sound of acoustic suspension minimonitors which don't sound "big and impressive", but do sound "less distorted" especially in the lightning quick resonance free tight thumping bass.

i digress... horn tweeters have terrible specs! most drivers can't get it up over 18kHz! how on earth is that superior to a ribbon/AMT/planar that can do up to 40kHz or even more? then there's their lousy frequency responses. i couldn't even find curves for the 25-30w radian drivers i was going to bring up here, with one selling for a whopping $187, but take a look at all 4 of those LOUSY curves... down around 20dB @ 20kHz for ALL OF THEM, and i didn't cherry pick the results. i just used the first two graphs i could find in under 30w drivers (though i did ignore peavy as low end junk) and the two drivers on top are the two most expensive that PE sells with the first being a

$840 JBL 2446H http://www.parts-express.com/jbl-2446h-2-titanium-horn-driver-8-ohm-4-bolt--294-415

followed by a $300 Selenium D4400Ti to its right
http://www.parts-express.com/selenium-d4400ti-2-titanium-horn-driver-4-bolt--264-230

then a $120 RCF ND1411-M on the bottom left
http://www.parts-express.com/rcf-nd1411-m-1-neodymium-horn-driver--294-818

with a $100 dual horn PRV Audio WG2-230Ti on the bottom right
http://www.parts-express.com/prv-audio-wg2-230ti-two-d230ti-compression-drivers-line-array-waveguide-package--294-2847

not ONE of those response curves is even CLOSE to acceptable! there's an undeniable form of distortion right off the bat, and from what i've seen of compression driver response curves when i last looked at them years ago, they don't get any better. compression drivers have never heard of the +-3dB standard.

but hey, if YOU like 'em, that's your business.

BTW... i'd heard lascalas playing art of noise tracks i was familiar with in the 80s and wasn't impressed. sure, they sounded loud and dynamic, i'll concede that, but after hearing those and a bunch of other $1,000+ speakers at 4 different shops back in the day, THE moment i lost my mind listening to a system was a friend's home demo of his tiny little infinity reference minis with their grey styrofoam 3/4" tweeters and 4 1/2" poly woofers playing talking heads' more songs about buildings and food which i'd owned for years.

i couldn't believe it. that was the first time i ever heard pinpoint imaging. i could pick out every singer's & instrument's location. the treble was extended and clean and best of all, it was actually the BASS that blew me away! yes, it had no scale at all, but it was lightning quick and undistorted... no boom... no slop... no overhang... just *POP!* or as i call it now, "thump".

that sound is NOT for everyone's tastes and isn't even the most popular as most people seem to be OK with all the distortion that's evil and hideous to me that ports generate in the name of creating a big fake resonant "bluh", so you can keep your $8,000 lascala IIs, and i'll be happy enough with $250 NHT superzeros, even if they need tweeters that have more bite, like ribbons or AMTs. THAT's the sound that wows me, if not you. top to bottom speed & detail with as little distortion as possible is what floats my boat. to my ears, lascalas sound big & fake.

This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:

---

[ Top of Page ] [ Contact Us ] [ Support/Wish List ] [ Copyright © 2024, Audio Asylum, all rights reserved ]

---

[ General ] [ Speakers ] [ Tubes ] [ Vinyl ] [ Digital ] [ Hi-Rez ] [ Video Asylum ] [ Cables ] [ Tweaks/DIY ] [ Music ] [ Films ]

---