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Spinning shellac! (photos)

72.174.56.142
Posted on May 17, 2017 at 10:09:48
cactuscowboy@bresnan.net
Audiophile

Posts: 7738
Location: Powell, Wyoming
Joined: July 23, 2007
 I have over 10,000 78's and enjoy giving them a spin. I use both a Technics SP-15 and a KAB modified SL-1200MK5. Stanton 500 cartridge with appropriate stylus and a KAB Souvenir EQS-MK12 variable EQ phono preamp with signal summed to mono.

Prior to the advent of tape following WW II, all 78's were cut Direct-To-Disc, in essence live recordings in studio without any sort of overdubs or multi-tracking. Because of this recording technique, these records have a direct and immediate sound to them, quite appealing despite limitations of shellac pressings and mono sound. And of course the music of this bygone era can be wonderful.

A few recent spins:






















 

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Direct-to-disc, posted on May 17, 2017 at 10:24:30
M3 lover
Audiophile

Posts: 6604
Location: SW Mich
Joined: May 29, 2005
Contributor
  Since: July 4, 2007
 cactus, you've likely heard this story. In an interview Doug Sax said it was being so impressed by the sonic, life-like qualities of some older D-t-D 78s that inspired him to try that procedure with a modern 33 recording. And so Sheffield Lab was born. ;^)

I'll bet they sound wonderful, but your pups don't appear to be impressed.

"The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing, if you can fake that you've got it made." Groucho

 

RE: Spinning shellac! (photos), posted on May 17, 2017 at 12:29:45
MannyE
Audiophile

Posts: 2088
Location: Miami Beach
Joined: March 4, 2001
 How do you clean old 78s?

 

That Ike Quebec set is fantastic. With my limited jazz experience, I had, posted on May 17, 2017 at 16:02:21
alaskahiatt
Audiophile

Posts: 7508
Joined: December 9, 2000
Contributor
  Since: November 1, 2005
 not heard of him before. A quick search on all music.com tells me that I have to look for his LPs now.

I am sure that you have already checked popsike.com for the value of that Blue Note set, but I would never get rid of it anyway. Congrats on a great find.

 

Sheffield Lab, posted on May 17, 2017 at 18:42:12
vinyl survivor
Audiophile

Posts: 1471
Location: Southeastern US
Joined: November 28, 2007
 The complete story at the link below.

 

RE: Sheffield Lab, posted on May 18, 2017 at 14:13:40
M3 lover
Audiophile

Posts: 6604
Location: SW Mich
Joined: May 29, 2005
Contributor
  Since: July 4, 2007
 Thanks for that expansion on my sketchy story.

However, considering the source, I'm surprised they state the tape recorder was not introduced until 1948?!

"The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing, if you can fake that you've got it made." Groucho

 

Doesn't 1948 represent when magnetic tape recording started in the US?, posted on May 18, 2017 at 14:40:49
alaskahiatt
Audiophile

Posts: 7508
Joined: December 9, 2000
Contributor
  Since: November 1, 2005
 I remember reading that magnetic tape recording did not come to the US until after WWII. However, the Germans were using it as early as the 1930s.

 

RE: Spinning shellac! (photos), posted on May 18, 2017 at 14:46:22
Dave Pogue
Audiophile

Posts: 11689
Location: DC Area
Joined: October 9, 2001
 I use a manual Nitty Gritty being sure NOT to use any fluid containing alcohol. Yeah, it's a pain, worthwhile only for discs like the ones shown.

 

RE: Doesn't 1948 represent when magnetic tape recording started in the US?, posted on May 18, 2017 at 14:54:24
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 17305
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
 The third wave of development in audio recording began in 1945, when the allied nations gained access to a new German invention - magnetic tape recording. The technology was invented in the 1930s, but remained restricted to Germany (where it was widely used in broadcasting) until the end of World War II. Magnetic tape provided another dramatic leap in audio fidelity — indeed, Allied observers first became aware of the existence of the new technology because they noticed that the audio quality of obviously pre-recorded programs was practically indistinguishable from live broadcasts. From 1950 onwards, magnetic tape quickly became the standard medium of audio master recording in the radio and music industries....

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

RE: Spinning shellac! (photos), posted on May 18, 2017 at 15:27:32
MannyE
Audiophile

Posts: 2088
Location: Miami Beach
Joined: March 4, 2001
 They are in pristine condition! That Nitty Gritty sure does a good job!

 

I heard, posted on May 18, 2017 at 15:29:26
Travis
Audiophile

Posts: 6170
Location: La Grange, Texas
Joined: November 25, 2001
 or read somewhere that Bing Crosby brought the first tape recorder to the US from Europe at the end of WWII. He hated doing his radio show live.




"If people don't want to come, nothing will stop them" - Sol Hurok

 

RE: Spinning shellac! (photos), posted on May 18, 2017 at 15:47:32
coffee-phil
Audiophile

Posts: 1444
Location: Shingle Springs CA
Joined: January 7, 2010
 Nitty Gritty sells a fluid called PURE 1 for 78s. I use it for my shellac records.

For Edison diamond discs I use 91% pure isopropyl alcohol. I would use even more pure stuff if I could find it.

For vinyl records (78s as well as Lps) I use PURE 2.

Phil

 

Higher % alcohol, posted on May 19, 2017 at 08:56:31
ToddM
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Posts: 1612
Location: Atlanta, USA
Joined: May 15, 2001
Contributor
  Since: June 13, 2005
 You can get 99.9% on Amazon, I've gotten it for other uses where azeotropic wouldn't suffice. It's not cheap, but you can probably last a while on a quart.

 

RE: Higher % alcohol, posted on May 19, 2017 at 09:24:09
coffee-phil
Audiophile

Posts: 1444
Location: Shingle Springs CA
Joined: January 7, 2010
 Hi Todd,

Thanks! I just checked. It is ~ $10 for a quart. I probably paid more than half that for the 91% stuff and I had to look for that. 70% is common.
I'll get some on my next order to Amazon.

Phil

 

Pure 2 not for shellac 78s, posted on May 19, 2017 at 10:16:55
Dave Pogue
Audiophile

Posts: 11689
Location: DC Area
Joined: October 9, 2001
 Contains alcohol (death to shellac)

I know you talked about 78 rpm VINYL, but just to be on the safe side.

 

RE: Spinning shellac! (photos), posted on May 19, 2017 at 12:06:07
coffee-phil
Audiophile

Posts: 1444
Location: Shingle Springs CA
Joined: January 7, 2010
 Hi Dave,

Yes PURE2 has alcohol. If you suspect a record of containing shellac do not use PURE2 on it. Any record made before WW2 most likely has shellac in it. For later 78s tap on the edge and compare the sound to an Lp. If it sounds the same as an Lp you are probably safe with the vinyl cleaning stuff. Another clue is that the vinyl records may say unbreakable on the label.

Phil

 

Maybe less pure is okay??, posted on May 19, 2017 at 16:44:24
alaskahiatt
Audiophile

Posts: 7508
Joined: December 9, 2000
Contributor
  Since: November 1, 2005
 I also look for just the 99% isopropyl at one of our local department stores, Fred Meyers. It used to be everywhere in our city, but most local stores carry only 91% or even 70% now.

As far as I know, less alcohol percentage may not be that bad, since the remaining fluid percentage is water anyway. Hopefully it is distilled or purified water. Therefore, all we need to do is use a lower dilution of the 70% or 91% alcohol in order to achieve the desired percentage of alcohol in our cleaning solution.

 

RE: Maybe less pure is okay??, posted on May 19, 2017 at 18:55:38
coffee-phil
Audiophile

Posts: 1444
Location: Shingle Springs CA
Joined: January 7, 2010
 Hi Alaskahiatt,

I have not had a problem with the 91% stuff and I used the 70% stuff before that.

I'm guessing that if you keep it from the edge or the center hole you should be OK. The playing surfaces are Condensite which is a plastic Edison's chemists developed. It is said to be similar to Bakelite. With care and records in good condition I think the lower concentration stuff should be OK. I have some Diamond discs which are pretty raggedy near the edge. With those records I'd worry about the solution getting to the core via the small cracks and causing further delamination.

Phil

 

My comments were meant to apply to vinyl cleaning fluids as well as Diamond Discs., posted on May 19, 2017 at 19:54:25
alaskahiatt
Audiophile

Posts: 7508
Joined: December 9, 2000
Contributor
  Since: November 1, 2005
 I should have been more clear. Or did you mean that you use only the 91% alcohol on the diamond discs without diluting it?? Boy, you sure are correct about avoiding those outside edges of Edison diamond discs when using water. Some of those damaged Edison diamond discs look like a stack of pancakes.

 

RE: My comments were meant to apply to vinyl cleaning fluids as well as Diamond Discs., posted on May 20, 2017 at 10:38:34
coffee-phil
Audiophile

Posts: 1444
Location: Shingle Springs CA
Joined: January 7, 2010
 Hi Alaskahiatt,

I just use the 91% isopropyl alcohol on Edison diamond discs, although if I were to bring home an Lp from a thrift with sticky, nasty stuff on it I might be tempted to try it. On Lps, I use Nitty Gritty's PURE 2. Shellac 78s get PURE 1. I have only one Pathe record and while it is vertically encoded and spins at 80 RPM it looks like shellac so I use PURE 1 for it.

Phil

 

RE: Pure 2 not for shellac 78s, posted on May 20, 2017 at 11:13:32
coffee-phil
Audiophile

Posts: 1444
Location: Shingle Springs CA
Joined: January 7, 2010
 Yes, most definitely! If in doubt, use PURE 1 as it won't hurt vinyl.

I have a few standard groove vinyl 78s as well as micro-groove vinyl 78s on which I use PURE2, but If you are not sure use PURE1.

Phil

 

RE: Spinning shellac! (photos), posted on May 20, 2017 at 11:14:47
Munkie_NL
Audiophile

Posts: 4860
Location: Netherlands
Joined: August 24, 2003
 Just saw a great doc on Joe Bussard on Youtube. The legendary 78 RPM collector. You must be the Joe Bussard of jazz hehe!



"The torture never stops"

Greetings Freek.

 

Ah, thanks. On my 78s, I only use a diluted solution of Original Woolite. nt, posted on May 21, 2017 at 16:39:51
alaskahiatt
Audiophile

Posts: 7508
Joined: December 9, 2000
Contributor
  Since: November 1, 2005
 nt

 

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