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Beethoven Symphony #9 recommendations?

73.240.202.23
Posted on May 16, 2017 at 19:23:40
Tracy
 I currently have just one version on CD with The Cleveland Orchestra/Dohnanyi and have been wanting to get one on vinyl now that I've been playing more records. I like this version but it's a digital recording on Telarc. What are the renowned recordings on vinyl to look for? I know there are many to choose from, but I would only like to buy one vinyl recording of the symphony. Thanks for your recommendations!

 

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RE: Beethoven Symphony #9 recommendations?, posted on May 16, 2017 at 19:34:47
DanS
Audiophile

Posts: 313
Location: EL PASO, TEXAS
Joined: December 19, 2002
 Reiner/ Chicago SO on RCA
Munch/ Boston SO on RCA
Excellent interpretations and terrific sound dynamics!
Dan

 

RE: Beethoven Symphony #9 recommendations?, posted on May 16, 2017 at 19:39:03
wareagle69
Audiophile

Posts: 16
Location: Texas
Joined: May 16, 2012
 This is my favorite:

 

RE: Beethoven Symphony #9 recommendations?, posted on May 16, 2017 at 21:04:39
SgreenP@MSN.com
Audiophile

Posts: 3537
Joined: April 23, 2007
 my fav's are the 3rd and 6th.

 

More, posted on May 16, 2017 at 21:32:29
TGR
Audiophile

Posts: 3002
Location: No. California
Joined: March 22, 2004
 I like the Reiner mentioned by another poster. Klemperer's reading is one of the best things in his Beethoven sets, and Karajan's early 60s version is one of the better things in that set. Fricsay was a great conductor, but I feel that he is a little intrusive in his direction - but many love that reading. Szell and Walter are worth hearing, too. Oh, and Jochum's Philips reading with the Concertgebouw.....

Lotsa good ones.

 

And even one more, posted on May 16, 2017 at 21:33:57
TGR
Audiophile

Posts: 3002
Location: No. California
Joined: March 22, 2004
 Stokowski on Phase 4 is surprisingly good - shame that it is on one diss, with a side break in the 3rd movement.

 

Probably safest bet on Lp is Fricsay's: great team of soloists, excellent playing/interpretation and warm, , posted on May 16, 2017 at 21:53:17
jdaniel@jps.net
 spacious early DGG sound.

Someday listen to Furtwangler's '44, (beats the pants off the more famous EMI.)

 

RE:Klemperer, posted on May 17, 2017 at 00:01:14
mr.bear
Audiophile

Posts: 4167
Joined: November 13, 2001
 Klemper, according to musicologists, has the closest to perfect tempi through all the movements. His was long regarded as the baseline.

Get several different versions! The Glorious 9th is, after all, the single greatest work of human creativity. It moves we Bears to tears without fail.

 

+1. nt, posted on May 17, 2017 at 02:28:02
jusbe
Audiophile

Posts: 5950
Location: North Island
Joined: April 4, 2000
Big J

"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."


 

René Leibowitz, RPO, is one I would reach for first., posted on May 17, 2017 at 02:32:13
jusbe
Audiophile

Posts: 5950
Location: North Island
Joined: April 4, 2000
 RCA or AAA (Analogue Audio Association) repress - worth it if you can find one. However it's also worth having a few interpretations to dial in on the approach that pleases you most.

I also have the Klemperer and PO on Horzu and a few others (Solti, Bohm/Berliner Phil' - which is quite fine - et al).


Big J

"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."


 

the baseline?, posted on May 17, 2017 at 08:49:35
TGR
Audiophile

Posts: 3002
Location: No. California
Joined: March 22, 2004
 I'm not sure that THAT many folks considered the Klemperer to be THE baseline - the English critics certainly revered him, and his was the first 9th I was exposed to, by my German teacher. That was about 1968 or 1969, and there were many who argued that Toscanini was definitive, or argued for Furtwangler's Bayreuth performance, Szell and Walter were in the mix, and Lennie had a new version out, many liked the Reiner, et al. But Klemperer's was up there.

Klemperer's Beethoven set is really interesting but also eccentric in many ways - the reading of the 5th is almost bizarre, and with that, and the overall slowish tempos, I wouldn't recommend the Klemperer set as a first choice. However, the 9th is a powerful performance, and I like it a lot.

 

RE: Beethoven Symphony #9 recommendations?, posted on May 17, 2017 at 08:53:50
reidcc
Audiophile

Posts: 13
Location: Northeast
Joined: August 29, 2008
 Just as a quick aside remark on #9 - my first intro to it-and what made me find a copy, was watching the movie Help(Beatles) where everyone broke into singing "Ode to Joy"!!!

Anyway- I have an old shaded dog RCA in the white cover #9 by Reiner, which I like. I also have the DG release via van Karajan on DGG(60's set), and I don't like it as it has less Choral.

I also listened to the old MFSL version by Solti- and thoroughly enjoy this version. It is supposedly the same release on DECCA re-issued by Speakers Corner(which I did purchase).

The Solti release seems better tempo and livelier Choral.

Chris

 

9ths to avoid, posted on May 17, 2017 at 08:55:55
TGR
Audiophile

Posts: 3002
Location: No. California
Joined: March 22, 2004
 OK, TMI, most likely, but I would avoid Bohm (in fact the whole set- Bohm is a completely square and boring conductor, IMO), Ansermet (the playing sounds like a parody of HIP performance. I understand there are decent renderings of some of the symphonies in his set, but the 9th isn't one of them), and of course, most controversial, any of the Furtwangler recordings of the 9th - I have heard 3 of them, and to me they are all of a piece, and more about Furtwangler than the music. Others adore Furtie, so your mileage may vary.

 

I like the Solti too, despite the propensity of inmates here to rake him over the coals :-) nt nt, posted on May 17, 2017 at 10:05:02
Rick W
 nt

 

RE: I like the Solti too, despite the propensity of inmates here to rake him over the coals :-) nt nt, posted on May 17, 2017 at 11:15:26
Opus 33 1/3
Audiophile

Posts: 4184
Location: D.C. Area
Joined: February 19, 2014
 I think Solti is best with specific composers and Beethoven is one of them. I also like his Brahms First, the one with CSO, performed in Medinah Temple in Chicago.





Opus 33 1/3

 

My take , posted on May 17, 2017 at 11:49:39
docw
Audiophile

Posts: 8115
Location: So. California
Joined: July 23, 2004
Contributor
  Since: November 29, 2004
 I had composed a long answer, but wiped it by mistake. Simply want to ask why are you spinning vinyl now and what gear are you using? I am excited by noting your age and always encourage learning about analog.

It takes some honest effort and work to get good copies of used LP's and the new or sealed are rare.

I own many versions here, listened to the piece for over 40 years.
Varying approaches are often valid, but I know that CD you have is of very high quality and balanced in approach and tempi. Get the 3rd, 5th and 7th and 8th symphonies in that set.

Maybe I agree with the others, Szell, Karajan 1963, Klemperer Philharmonia, Solti or Reiner CSO are good versions to begin to search. Listen on line to sample them first.

 

American Record Guide. Old issues always have group comparisons.., posted on May 17, 2017 at 12:20:07
3+4=5
 Your local big city library may have back issues.
Mine does, and I have scoured the pages of American Record Guide for each issues group comparisons. Then photocopied them
(sadly that was year ago, and I now no longer have the copies)
They may do Beethoven String Quartets, and compare the various recording and which ones they like.
Or Brahms symphonies.
Or like for the op, Beethoven symphonies.
So I say find old issues of American Record Guide.
The comparisons were great. Not a lot of discussion, just a short blurb. but I found it worth the trouble to find them.

 

NY Phil Live w/ Mehta, posted on May 17, 2017 at 12:55:34
Cuernavaca
Audiophile

Posts: 878
Location: NW
Joined: December 23, 2011
 I like this one, and I have several different recordings, this has been a favorite.

Thomas
"I've never owned a firearm, but I do have an attack parrot!"

 

RE: Beethoven Symphony #9 recommendations?, posted on May 17, 2017 at 13:02:34
dadbar
Audiophile

Posts: 1675
Location: Portland OR
Joined: June 29, 2003
Contributor
  Since: March 25, 2006
 +1 on that Reiner....I have the same white cover 2 disc set....with #1 and 9. That version ticks all of the boxes....performance, sound quality, pace and great vocals.

 

But you must get the Decca PFS, posted on May 17, 2017 at 18:41:00
vinyl1
Audiophile

Posts: 3948
Joined: October 3, 2001
 The equalization on the London SPC release is absurd, with booming bass and shrieking treble. The Decca is quite listenable.

 

One for the singing only, posted on May 17, 2017 at 18:44:57
vinyl1
Audiophile

Posts: 3948
Joined: October 3, 2001
 The Schmidt-Isserstedt on Decca is not the greatest orchestral performance, but the solo performance by Marti Talvela is fantastic.

 

RE: One for the singing only, posted on May 18, 2017 at 08:54:20
Mel
Audiophile

Posts: 2993
Location: New York City Area
Joined: February 21, 2001
 Unfortunately, sound limited by being released on just one disk. Marketing.

 

Thank you all for your recommendations, all of them are great., posted on May 18, 2017 at 17:19:49
Tracy
 After listening to several of the recommendations in here--not each one in its entirety--I decided I liked the Fricsay version as proposed by wareagle69 and jdaniel. TGR is probably correct in saying Fricsay's direction of the symphony is a bit intrusive, but it's definitely a more lively version than the one I have. I'm looking forward to hearing this version on vinyl, and it probably won't be my only purchase of the 9th on vinyl as much as I thought it would be when I started this thread, for there is no definitive version of this powerful achievement of human creativity.

 

RE: My take , posted on May 18, 2017 at 17:25:56
Tracy
 My late father was an avid vinyl enthusiast so I grew up in a household that always had a turntable, or "record player" as my brother and I would always call them, but after ruining several of his needles when we were young they became off limits. We had our CD's and Ipods to keep us satisfied musically. When my Dad passed away recently the bulk of his equipment and record collection was liquidated. The Rega I now have was part of his office system. I am learning to appreciate music on vinyl though not to the extent my Dad did. My brother and I utilize the current methods of music delivery, but we're still fond of vinyl because of our parents. It is the CD which has become a thing of the past, an afterthought, as it were....

 

RE: My take , posted on May 18, 2017 at 21:14:35
docw
Audiophile

Posts: 8115
Location: So. California
Joined: July 23, 2004
Contributor
  Since: November 29, 2004
 Thanks for your info and keep on growing--my Linn LP 12 is 30 years young but has developed issues these few years, which I have gotten past thru help from various repair men.

 

RE: Thank you all for your recommendations, all of them are great., posted on May 19, 2017 at 13:20:03
docw
Audiophile

Posts: 8115
Location: So. California
Joined: July 23, 2004
Contributor
  Since: November 29, 2004
 More lively, but maybe less to the letter of the score. Where will you look for a vinyl copy?

 

RE: Thank you all for your recommendations, all of them are great., posted on May 19, 2017 at 14:37:47
Tracy
 The Dohnanyi version I have on CD is probably more close to the letter of the score, but the Fricsay version I listened to on Spotify just seemed to appeal to me as the choral section sounded more energetic and clearer, like being center stage front instead of back row center. It was a different experience listening to it. The versions are often venue reflective, so I guess I'm exploring a bit with the Fricsay version. I put an offer on this one on eBay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/FERENC-FRICSAY-9th-Symphony-Overtures-Egmont-Leonore-III-UK-GATEFOLD-2-LP-/311865870281?hash=item489ca787c9:g:-zkAAOSwWxNYqfbX&autorefresh=true

I have seen mono versions available too, though I have no idea if it's the same one I listened to. The one I listened to seemed to part of a set. The eBay lp, I think, is the same recording.

 

RE: Thank you all for your recommendations, all of them are great., posted on May 19, 2017 at 15:45:21
docw
Audiophile

Posts: 8115
Location: So. California
Joined: July 23, 2004
Contributor
  Since: November 29, 2004
 DG recently released their whole Fricsay archive as a set.
Mono is different but some like the more "plain" sound. An example might be Dvorak cello concerto by Fournier and Szell and BPO. Good luck

 

RE: HIP performance, posted on May 20, 2017 at 12:33:04
Tracy
 Can you elaborate? I'm unfamiliar with the term other than the contemporary "hip hop" phrase which might be considered "hip." Somehow I doubt that's what you mean :)

 

RE: Beethoven #9 recommendations? -- Toscanini, but. . ., posted on May 20, 2017 at 14:58:23
goldenthal
Audiophile

Posts: 1001
Location: Ontario
Joined: March 28, 2003
 which of his several recordings are currently available on vinyl you will have to search. All will have sound quality below modern. But the performances are peerless!


Jeremy

 

RE: HIP performance, posted on May 20, 2017 at 17:07:29
TGR
Audiophile

Posts: 3002
Location: No. California
Joined: March 22, 2004
 HIP stands for Historically Informed Performance. Usually applies to both instruments and performance practice.

 

RE: the baseline?, posted on May 20, 2017 at 17:14:02
mr.bear
Audiophile

Posts: 4167
Joined: November 13, 2001
 Interesting- I was exposed to the Klemperer at almost the same time, around 1967, by my music teacher- who conned the school into buying a real HiFi- AR table, Dyna SCA-80 integrated, and small KLH's, which sounded quite nice for those music appreciation classes. That teacher was a real wacko- got tossed out of school for throwing music stand at girl- I saw the whole thing... He was nuts! Gave me a sweet Heathkit tube mono power amp one summer.

 

Interesting Toscanini Beethoven's 9th on eBay, posted on May 20, 2017 at 17:18:58
Tracy
 In my search I came across an unusual set of Toscanini, the 1st and 9th on 45! AFAIK records are cut at the 45 RPM speed to increase fidelity so the sound quality might be acceptable, but the number of breaks needed would probably detract from the performance as a symphonic piece:

 

RE: HIP performance, posted on May 20, 2017 at 17:25:37
Tracy
 I did look it up, but it was after I posted the question. Still, your answer is there for others to read. Thank you. I will now have to hear such a performance of Beethoven's 9th. Am I understanding correctly that Ansermet's recording was his reading which sounded HIP but was not actually meant to be period correct?

 

RE: Interesting Toscanini Beethoven's 9th on eBay, posted on May 20, 2017 at 18:13:57
goldenthal
Audiophile

Posts: 1001
Location: Ontario
Joined: March 28, 2003
 Interesting indeed -- I've never seen these before. But note that higher speed is generally for preservation of highest frequencies -- probably not there to begin with. Moreover, note the seller's caveats.


Jeremy

 

RE: NY Phil Live w/ Mehta, posted on May 20, 2017 at 18:49:44
Tracy
 This was #2 on my "like" list of the ones that I listened to on Spotify, it was a difficult decision, so many to choose from. I chose the Fricsay version as the one to buy, but I can see why this is your favorite of the Beethoven Symphony#9 performances. Thank you for suggesting it.

 

The only truly worthwhile vinyl version..., posted on May 20, 2017 at 19:12:41
vinyl1
Audiophile

Posts: 3948
Joined: October 3, 2001
 ....is the red linen box two-record set. It is highly collectible and quite expensive.

I don't know why the reissuers don't reissue this, it would certainly sell very well.

 

RE: The only truly worthwhile vinyl version..., posted on May 20, 2017 at 20:13:11
Tracy
 I saw one such set available on eBay. It was, as you said, quite expensive. I'm sure the seller is hoping it is not reissued before it has sold :)

 

RE: HIP performance, posted on May 22, 2017 at 08:22:41
TGR
Audiophile

Posts: 3002
Location: No. California
Joined: March 22, 2004
 It sounds to my ears like a parody of a HIP performance - in other words, it is a really poor performance, in my opinion. The orchestra has absolutely no feel for the music.

 

RE: Interesting Toscanini Beethoven's 9th on eBay, posted on June 9, 2017 at 08:16:32
CaliforniaBob
Audiophile

Posts: 92
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: June 2, 2004
 I have lots of the 9th and there's two that I favor - Toscanini's and
Karajan's. note that there are lots of recordings of Arturo's. some
are electronically enhanced for stereo. Toscanini was noted for
his ability to read a score and remember it.

the AT performance is electrifying.

Karajan is romantic and memorable.

 

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