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Intolerance of viewpoints/thoughts

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Posted on June 5, 2020 at 08:31:41
gonzo
Audiophile

Posts: 2512
Location: new england
Joined: November 28, 2002
 Over the years it has been increasingly difficult to have civil discussions with someone when there is a strong difference of opinion. Has anyone here had a discussion with someone with whom they really disagreed but it has been civil and informative? I try to but it is challenging. I find avoidance is the best policy. Norm

 

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RE: Intolerance of viewpoints/thoughts, posted on June 5, 2020 at 08:41:32
Dave B
Audiophile

Posts: 1053
Joined: October 5, 1999
 I have two friends that I can do this with. We value the friendships more than the differences in ideology.

 

RE: Intolerance of viewpoints/thoughts, posted on June 5, 2020 at 08:42:25
rivervalley817
 I've had many Norm, though a lot of people simply don't know how. What's on your mind sir?

be well,


 

I enjoy those discussions..., posted on June 5, 2020 at 12:05:40
viridian
 ....IMHO, there are plenty of reasonable people with unreasonable opinions.

 

RE: Intolerance of viewpoints/thoughts, posted on June 5, 2020 at 12:27:26
dean_martin
Audiophile

Posts: 1747
Location: lower alabama
Joined: January 26, 2006
 many descriptions for today's politics-
win at all costs
win by any means
dominate the other side
tit for tat
revenge

The political class is at war. They've done a good job of dragging regular folks into their war. Because we're being programmed to believe we have to win every issue, yeah, it's hard to have a civil discussion about politics with someone who holds differing views, especially online where behavioral norms don't apply. It's becoming increasingly difficult in person, especially if I don't know the person very well. I try to engage on things we have in common - like kids, pets, sports, hobbies. If you're able to start there, then get into politics, it's a little easier and less confrontational. I think you can tell if it's worth jumping off into a political discussion from there, or that it's best just to nod and smile and occasionally mention an alternative view based on cues you're getting. It might sound funny, but I think it helps if you look like you're really thinking hard about what they said while expressing your view, "but, I've always thought [fill in blank] because [fill in blank] ." I find that you have to back up your conclusion with your own experiences or facts they can relate to. Of course, that removes some topics from discussion, e.g., most of the time, two guys are not going to relate to, or have any experiences when it comes to a topic like abortion.

My neighbor and I are from different generations (he's older and retired) and we have different world views, but we have respect for each other and we look out for each other. We either find common ground or give consideration to each other's alternative views.

But, I've also become more pragmatic. Who wants to have a neighbor that hates you? If the shit hits the fan or there's a catastrophe in the neighborhood, we'll need to depend on each other.

 

Check out the ChangeAView forum, posted on June 5, 2020 at 12:54:02
vacuous
Audiophile

Posts: 4485
Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Joined: August 25, 2000
Contributor
  Since: November 7, 2020
 There is an entire forum dedicated to getting people to change or modify their thinking. Check out ChangeAView, link below.

Good idea in principle. Doesn't seem to work very well in practice. Too much rant over there, too little cogency. Still worth a visit.




 

RE: I enjoy those discussions..., posted on June 5, 2020 at 15:18:03
rivervalley817
 and everyone is entitled to them

like ours for instance

with regards,


 

Neither side is curious what the other side thinks, posted on June 5, 2020 at 15:34:59
jedrider
Audiophile

Posts: 15167
Location: No. California
Joined: December 26, 2003
 so nothing will heal that divide.

However, we do have a duty not to let bullshit slide without a challenge, that much I will argue for.

I think one has to be willing to learn something in order to change one's mind.

The answer is NO, in brief, on the major ideological issues of the day.

 

I love various absurd viewpoints, posted on June 5, 2020 at 18:53:50
PabloP
Audiophile

Posts: 14875
Location: So. Cal
Joined: January 23, 2001
 I love that people are nuts. That doesn't mean that I respect the basis of your opinion. You are regurgitating something fed to you that you aren't able to process. If you're my friend, relative or neighbor, I just let it go. But it makes me sad.

But a serious discussion about current affairs with someone with an opposing viewpoint? I would have to have a viewpoint.p

 

RE: Intolerance of viewpoints/thoughts, posted on June 6, 2020 at 05:59:10
JURB
Audiophile

Posts: 2056
Location: North Ohio
Joined: May 29, 2016
 "Over the years it has been increasingly difficult to have civil discussions with someone when there is a strong difference of opinion"

I know. Now I don't know what this proves or disproves, but there was a discussion between Hillbilly and I about something that well,

"Bandana lost his license for not having insurance but he doesn't have a car"

"Well that is how it is"

"If he drove someone else's car he would be covered under theirs, if he drive for a living he would be covered under theirs, why should he lose his license ?"

"The way it is"

"What if you lost your CCW permit (he has one) because you didn't own a gun ?"

This is a reasonable Man, a friend. Good thing to because his neck looks like your leg. It came down to "I gotta hang up now because this is going nowhere".

Different perspective. He does not want to fuck with them.

How many people argue and do not understand that their opponent has a different background and has had different points of view as well as the tilt of the information put in ?

Think he is lying ? Fact is usually he believes what he says, now the question is why. Understand that and you got it licked.

 

It always has been so. A significant number of colonists strictly opposed independence. , posted on June 6, 2020 at 07:26:44
tinear
Audiophile

Posts: 65782
Location: Kansas City, KS
Joined: April 9, 2006
 The Civil War speaks for itself (and still does, today). WWI, very unpopular. Temperance. Early women's rights. Our delayed entrance into WWII. Vietnam. Civil rights.

And on to today. All of these subjects have produced vigorous and at times violent disagreements. We are witnessing nothing new.

What is new is the behavior of a commander-in-chief. In this country, he has led to many "firsts."

 

I used to think it comes from a failure to understand the other side's POV, posted on June 6, 2020 at 07:36:37
Dave_K
 When I was younger, I was a solid Republican but I used to enjoy long and interesting discussions (often over beers) with people way to the left of me and to the right. But that was pre-internet or early internet days.

It's nearly impossible to do that now, even with friends I've known for decades. You can't even get 5 minutes into a conversation before the thinking stops and the talking points come out.

I used to think that if people would just agree to lay down the talking points and listen, we might get somewhere. But more recently, I've come to the realization that 40% of the population (maybe 20-30% on the right and 10-20% on the left) are living in a social media driven alternative reality bubble that nobody knows how to penetrate. They are unreachable for now. The other 60% of the population already knows what each other thinks and simply doesn't care how the other side is getting along.

 

RE: It always has been so. A significant number of colonists strictly opposed independence. , posted on June 6, 2020 at 08:05:51
dean_martin
Audiophile

Posts: 1747
Location: lower alabama
Joined: January 26, 2006
 How dare those colonists put on disguises and destroy private property!

 

Good perspective there Tinear, something many here lack or show..., posted on June 6, 2020 at 13:20:15
musetap
Audiophile

Posts: 31878
Location: San Francisco
Joined: July 8, 2003
Contributor
  Since: January 28, 2004
 mostly because they seem SO incredibly wound up and frightened that they have lost perspective
on what the history of this country entails OR that it is a shared history and not just THIS POV or
THAT POV.

There's a shitload of greys between the blue and the red.

Greys are important and necessary.



"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination"-Michael McClure



 

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