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Do I really need a Sub?

107.77.215.38

Posted on October 23, 2020 at 15:11:32
Posts: 268
Location: Puerto Rico
Joined: April 17, 2006
Question:

Do I need to add a sub to my stereo system?

My speakers are Altec Valencia rebuilt / 416 woofer/ 811 horn & 806A driver. I had a powered sub years ago with different speakers. ok but not great.

I don't really think I need one, but could be wrong.

 

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RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 23, 2020 at 19:11:58
Bill Fitzmaurice
Industry Professional

Posts: 5370
Location: New England
Joined: October 20, 2002
You shouldn't need a sub for music. You might for home theater. If that was the case it would take a pair of very large subs to add much to what the Valencia are capable of.

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 24, 2020 at 09:04:24
mnawaz3@aol.com
Audiophile

Posts: 502
Joined: March 28, 2002
adding a sub is an adventure. in my case, i have failed in all my attempts. i experienced bass anomalies in addition to mid-bass and mid-range changes. it separates the men from the boys. having said that, i think it become necessar to add a bass when you are dealing with pure-horn mid-bass units that cut off at 80-120. with ported bass, valencia should give you 40-55 depending on room, room placement and cabinet quality.

note. some people add subs to get thump at bottom. if you dont care about integration with mid-bass...then it may be worth it.

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 25, 2020 at 01:38:06
KanedaK
Audiophile

Posts: 2515
Location: Brussels
Joined: April 27, 2010
The best way to add a sub is to add TWO subs, and a quality active crossover.
Do you NEED them? no.
Could it help tremendously? It could and it would, if you were using a low power amp on your Valencias; the real benefit here, more than bass extension, would be to free the amp from the burden of low frequencies.

 

Do we really need anything?, posted on October 25, 2020 at 07:34:12
Rod M
Web Geek

Posts: 16199
Location: So. California
Joined: March 1, 1999
Contributor
  Since:
March 1, 1999
My Altec Model 19s don't need subs much for music. However, bass is much better with a 100wps SS amp than a 30 wpc tube amp.

I had a couple subs sitting, an old TrueSub and a Dayton 12". Once they got tweaked in, generally by reducing volume and maybe a shade lower xover, it does add a more solid bass foundation. the trick with subs is getting them set when you don't 'hear' them, just 'feel' them.

I would guess that the 19s have that nice 60-80hz bump, but are down some at 40hz. The subs can fill in the range and add pressurization that feels more real.

OTOH, on my EdgarHorn system that does drop like a rock at 80hz, it took me quite awhile to realize that one sub wasn't working. I need a special fuse and Radio Shack went out of business, I procrastinated. A couple weeks ago, I noticed something and checked the other sub and it seems to have blown a fuse. I need slo-blows and when I'd bought some, Frys only had regular, but they blow now and then, probably an HT DVD with a nasty soundtrack.

Anyway, I haven't really missed not having the subs enough to pull a plate amp and get the fuse value, but then I haven't watched anything with dinosaur foot steps in a while.

-Rod

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 25, 2020 at 17:48:25
hottattoo
Audiophile

Posts: 141
Location: New York
Joined: July 30, 2011
Perhaps, I am the wrong guy to ask about subwoofers. There are good subwoofers and then there are excellent subwoofers. I do not like ported subs as I can easily pick out the annoying sonic signature. The integration is a real problem to get right amd if not done properly you would be better off without the subs. The lower the frequency you cross the subs into your system the better off you will be. If you play ALL types of music, you need a pair of subwoofers. If you never hear what you are missing, you will not miss it. Excellent subwoofers, either made or bought are NOT cheap (trust me !!).

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=meet+joe+and+his+amazing+diy+horn+speakers

Happy listening,
Joe

 

If you play ALL types of music, you need a pair of subwoofers., posted on October 25, 2020 at 18:44:31
Bill Fitzmaurice
Industry Professional

Posts: 5370
Location: New England
Joined: October 20, 2002
This may be true if your mains lack the low frequency extension and output capability to deliver what you want, but by and large that wouldn't apply to a pair of Valencias.

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 28, 2020 at 19:44:07
Retsel
Audiophile

Posts: 1238
Joined: April 17, 2000
You should measure the bass response of your speakers at your listening position to see what the bass extension is. It could be that the speakers deliver adequate bass, but maybe due to room interaction, the room may be robbing you of bass at certain frequencies, or overemphasizing bass at other frequencies.

Out of curiosity, I did a quick review of some reviews of these speakers. Many people report the lack of deep bass, but your situation might very well be different than theirs. Measure!

For many people bass extension down to 40 hz is adequate. For others, bass extension down to 20 hz is necessary. For others, who also use their audio system for their home movie theater or for playing certain audio discs with deeper bass recorded on the discs, they even want deeper bass extension. A lot depends on what you want from your audio system. Only you can answer that.

Retsel

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 30, 2020 at 09:52:05
Jim D.
Audiophile

Posts: 854
Location: FL
Joined: October 26, 2000
I would be inclined to not add a sub to the Valencias. I have a pair of Altec Flamencos that do OK without. My main speakers are another story. They use a diy front loaded mid-bass horn that rolls off very steeply below 68 hz. This system along with the Edgar salad bowl mid-range absolutely needs a sub. I like stereo subs using an active crossover and big ss amp which is what I use.

I'd take an SPL meter and test disc and run some measurements. If you have extension down anywhere around 40 hz, then I'd spend my money on something else - assuming a music source.

Jim

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on October 30, 2020 at 11:37:18
lokie
Audiophile

Posts: 1986
Location: Georgia, USA
Joined: January 28, 2003
No. You need at least two subs.

 

RE: Do I really need a Sub?, posted on November 15, 2020 at 17:05:14
Sebrof
Audiophile

Posts: 634
Location: AusTX
Joined: July 12, 2002
I have 416s in DIY cabinets.
I didn't know I needed two subs until I got two subs.

 

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