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Two MUST reads for digital audio consumers

198.7.58.101
Posted on May 23, 2017 at 14:25:49
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
 1-Sound On Sound Magazine

Mastering For Streaming Services:

http://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/mastering-streaming-services

The full article will cost you $1.50 if you are not a subscriber

Not a SINGLE mention of MQA. NONE.

__

2-The Recording Academy P&E Wing Hi-Res Music Prod. Recommendation

Link to PDF:

https://www.grammy.org/files/pages/recommendations_for_hi_resolution_music_production_05_10_17.pdf

40 pages, and exactly TWO mentions of MQA, strictly in the context of streaming services. NO mention of use in production, mixing, or mastering.

For good reason. It is, contrary to lies Bob Stuart has told, it is NOT part of the production process. It is POST production DSP, at this point only for use with Tidal streaming.

The mention of MQA was the behest of Bob "dollar sign" Ludwig, who is actively seeking to capitalize on MQA.

I don't know a SINGLE recording, mixing, or mastering engineer who gives the slightest toss about it. Not a single artist either.

 

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Thanks for an educational peek into the world of pro audio. nt, posted on May 23, 2017 at 14:40:43
Charles Hansen
Manufacturer

Posts: 6984
Joined: August 1, 2001
 nt

 

Enjoyed the second read, posted on May 23, 2017 at 17:04:03
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 37555
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since: April 5, 2002
 One of the conclusions mirrors that of my own experience - that 24/96 pretty much captures the top octaves.

Most certainly better than the Jurassic-in-terms-of-computer-technology Redbook standard. It's amazing you still find folks who cannot hear the difference between lossy MP3 and Redbook - much less higher resolution content. :)

 

RE: Enjoyed the second read, posted on May 23, 2017 at 17:40:41
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
 I tend to agree about 24/96. But many believe archiving an analog tape to 24/192 then mastering to 24/96 is the best of both worlds. Of course, new recordings tracked, mixed, and mastered in 24/96 are also ideal.

Audiophiles love numbers. Many believed that 24/96 was going to be essentially "twice as good" as redbook, and of course, 24/192 was going to be 4x as as good. Not so.

As good as a read as this was..many, many albums come out of mastering houses at 24 bit/44.1 kHz.

 

RE: Two MUST reads for digital audio consumers, posted on May 24, 2017 at 02:46:27
PAR
 Thanks for the links in particular the Recorind Academy pdf. It is so nice to find a technical dicument that is so well written, as if the author imagined that his/her readers may not actually have physics Phds.

For me there were two revelations that outweigh anything to do with MQA. The first is the apparent lack of knowledge about basic audio theory, techniques and standards that may exist with some producers and artists. I left the industry 16 years ago but it seems much remains the same.

The second is the realisation by the hi-rez consortium that the consumer requires reassurance as to the provenance of the hi-rez files he is purchasing. The forthcoming adoption of a system of coding to represent provenance similar (if of necessity more complex) to the old SPARS codes for CD is an action that must be applauded.

As for MQA, yes it receives only a cursory mention. However the passage is nevertheless highly positive in regard to MQA's benefits and acceptance. Of course, I cannot vouch for its accuracy on either count.

 

Draw your own conclusions, posted on May 24, 2017 at 05:29:32
Jim Austin
 Sound on Sound covered MQA extensively here.

 

RE: Draw your own conclusions, posted on May 24, 2017 at 07:08:49
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
 Yes, I previously posted this link last year.

The magazine published exactly ONE article on the MQA.

Contrasted with the hundreds of mentions in stereophile and countless official posts on the web site.

Quite a disparity.

 

Thanks for those. Frustrating trade-offs., posted on May 24, 2017 at 10:40:18
jusbe
Audiophile

Posts: 5950
Location: North Island
Joined: April 4, 2000
 Perhaps the lesson of the current 'overreach' of MQA with pretensions to inveigle its way into production workflows is the problem.

It seems an ideal format for portable digital systems... until one considers whether the DACs, mini amps and associated headphone quality might even be able to convey the time-domain advantages (while simultaneous losing bit depth).

I'd be much more inclined to see a new standard of Meridian filter applied to traditional DAC technology, without the attendant MQA compression. Perhaps there is still time for that. Who knows? But the current package deal of the MQA digital offering seems hastily confected.


Big J

"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."


 

RE: Thanks for those. Frustrating trade-offs., posted on May 24, 2017 at 10:59:13
Charles Hansen
Manufacturer

Posts: 6984
Joined: August 1, 2001
 >> I'd be much more inclined to see a new standard of Meridian filter applied to traditional DAC technology, without the attendant MQA compression. <<

Excellent point, and one I discuss in some detail in the post linked below.

 

I think this is what it boils down to., posted on May 24, 2017 at 11:16:33
jusbe
Audiophile

Posts: 5950
Location: North Island
Joined: April 4, 2000
 And since what Meridian are keen to promote is just another digital filter scheme, wrapped up in a superfluous distribution format, one can see where the 'disconnect' occurs with the potential audience.

The issue then becomes whether Meridian's custom filter technology is substantially better than the competition. I'm betting that there continues to be some very stiff competition in this space.


Big J

"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."


 

RE: I think this is what it boils down to., posted on May 24, 2017 at 13:38:07
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 37555
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since: April 5, 2002
 And since what Meridian are keen to promote is just another digital filter scheme, wrapped up in a superfluous distribution format...

Understand that like cloud computing, this is a revenue model.

When you are challenged competing on the open market, attempt to close it with a proprietary scheme that requires everyone to pay. :)

 

does it really sound better than conventional hi-res digital recordings?, posted on May 24, 2017 at 13:53:08
Frihed89
Audiophile

Posts: 15703
Location: Copenhagen
Joined: March 21, 2005
 Not everyone likes hi-res compared to Red Book + NOS Dac.

 

RE: Two MUST reads for digital audio consumers, posted on May 25, 2017 at 05:53:05
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 37333
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 If it weren't for the fact that I'm extremely happy with my current CD playback setups, I'd be more interested in a streaming service..... But for now, I have no interest in blowing money on technologies that I'm personally skeptical that it would further enhance my enjoyment of music. (The recordings themselves have not exactly been stellar.... Many of them overprocessed..... Many of them upsampled from 16/44.1.... It would be a total waste to listen to newfangled technologies on Auto-Tuned singers or other overprocessed recordings...... )

I hope to attend the September audio show in Orange County, CA..... (I won't be able to attend the LA Audio Show.) I'll likely experience MQA first hand..... It might be great, it might be yet another gimmick.... But I won't comment further until I actually listen to it.

 

I understand the sentiment, posted on May 25, 2017 at 08:16:00
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 37555
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since: April 5, 2002
 If it weren't for the fact that I'm extremely happy with my current CD playback setups, I'd be more interested in a streaming service.

As I thought that too for a long time. But despite the fact I'm an old boomer, having access to millions of tracks in CD quality via Tidal is really cool.

It's not about playback quality per se - it's all about having instant access to almost any piece of music you've ever wanted to hear.

It is also a great way to test drive new recordings. Sure, some are crappy but not all. Now I get it. :)

 

RE: I understand the sentiment, posted on May 25, 2017 at 12:42:03
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 37333
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 I do cheat with those 5-disc CD changers..... Although I would still have to hunt for a song because I don't know the sequence.

I personally wish good sound from CD playback were more readily available..... If it were, I believe the industry wouldn't have drifted to file based playback and streaming audio. (But then again, vinyl may have not made a comeback.)

I do admit that I'm lazy..... The time I've spent in finding something that sounds good with CD playback I do not want to repeat with other digital audio playback formats..... Even if it might ultimately beat the CD from a sonic and musical enjoyment standpoint.

 

RE: I understand the sentiment, posted on May 25, 2017 at 14:09:24
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 37555
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since: April 5, 2002
 The time I've spent in finding something that sounds good with CD playback I do not want to repeat with other digital audio playback formats..... Even if it might ultimately beat the CD from a sonic and musical enjoyment standpoint.

I get that. The journey for me was long with a number of pot holes in the way. Having said that, I find the challenge was well worth the effort. While perhaps not quite as passionate about the ill effect of RFI, I've taken quite a few steps to minimize its effects with my computer based system.

First and foremost - the music server isn't remotely close to the listening areas. I use shielded CAT7 to get the signal to the player upstairs. All sources run through a conditioner and amplification through dedicated lines. The uRendu player uses a power supply which delivers galvanic isolation from the AC.

The beauty is being able to focus more on the music - all of it and instantly! - without having to futz around handling shiny frisbees. :)

 

RE: I understand the sentiment, posted on May 26, 2017 at 13:12:58
knewton
Audiophile

Posts: 563
Location: Mid-Atlantic/Northeast
Joined: May 18, 2010
 "I personally wish good sound from CD playback were more readily available..."

I agree, Todd. What's ironic is that was the big promise of CD from the get go, part of it's primary raison d'etre. Rather than perfect sound forever we've more been saddled with mediocre sound forever. While the floor of cheap CD is perhaps higher than that of cheap vinyl, the ceiling of vinyl is higher than that of CD.
_
Ken Newton

 

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