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In Reply to: RE: Hope someone can help clear something up for me . . . posted by JoshT on June 14, 2017 at 22:39:39
NOS? Looks like UOS (used old stock) in white boxes.
Just because a tube tests with new or near new readings, doesn't make it new old stock.
New Old Stock is new, unused, in the original box.
I can't compete with the dead (Buck W. 2010)
$45 gets them out the door tomorrow. $50 gets them out the door yesterday (Byrd 2016)
Cowards can't be heroes. (Byrd 2017)
Follow Ups:
They were sold to me as NOS by a dealer with an excellent reputation, whom I trust, and he sourced from Brent Jesse, who's reputation is exemplary. On his website, Brent Jesse says that many of his NOS tubes are in white boxes because the original packaging had deteriorated, but that if they are sold as NOS, they are NOS.
Why do you say they look used?
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"If you are the owner of a new stereophonic system, this record will play with even more brilliant true-to-life fidelity. In short, you can purchase this record with no fear of its becoming obsolete in the future."
I just question if they are truly NOS. Just as someone might question them being matched. Occasionally, I too sell a NOS tube outside of it's original box, and point out the original box could not be salvaged (gross mold). That is very rare. Dilapitated or not, NOS tubes should stay in and go with their original box. That's not too much to ask.
I can't compete with the dead (Buck W. 2010)
$45 gets them out the door tomorrow. $50 gets them out the door yesterday (Byrd 2016)
Cowards can't be heroes. (Byrd 2017)
What about tubes purchased in bulk? I've bought plenty of tubes packaged in egg-crate type boxes that were intended for use in production where individual boxes were both unnecessary and unwanted.Who says the box the tube is in now is the original one it was packaged in?
Who says the tube in that old tired box wasn't used for a few hours then put back in the box?
And so on...
We've had this discussion here so MANY times before. The conclusion reached is that unless you had the tube in your possession from the time it left the factory until today there is no absolute assurance it is new and unused. Period.
Get the tubes from a trustworthy source. That's all you can do. If you have a question about the tube ask the seller. Some of the answers you get will have to be judgment calls - so the knowledge/experience and ethics of the seller are important in the process.
I am a tube seller - and I have NEVER sold a tube that I can be 100% sure was brand new. Since I've never taken delivery of tubes directly from a tube plant I can't be 100% sure. I have sold tubes that in my best judgment were NOS however. And I'm sure I'm not the only tube seller to do so.
Edits: 06/15/17
By definition, labeling an item as "new" also means it was never previously sold to an end user. End user in this case would include TV/radio service persons, broadcast stations, etc. Regardless of whether such a tube has been put into service, it is legally used merchandise.
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Buy Chinese. Bury freedom.
FWIW, here is what he says under Q&A on his site:
"Q:
ARE ALL OF YOUR TUBES NEW?
A:
Most of them are. On my audiophile tube list, it states directly if a tube is NOS or used. Most of my regular stock list are "NOS" or New Old Stock, meaning the tubes themselves are old, discontinued, and/or obsolete. Ninety five percent of my tubes are over 30 years old, so they may not always look "new", and may not be in a new looking box. Many boxes have not survived the years, and I will supply the tubes in clean white boxes. Some of my tubes were obtained in jobbers boxes, which are egg carton type boxes or styrofoam crates. While these are NOS tubes, they never had a box of their own. I have also bought tube caddies full of tubes. It was a common practice to recycle the boxes in tube caddies, and refill them with tubes from bulk jobbers boxes. While these tubes are also NOS, the tube box may be worn and have the tube number hand written on it, with the original type number crossed off. I will try to send you a tube with a good label in a good box, but with high demand tubes, this may not always be possible. This is because all of my tubes are vintage. I do not sell recently made Chinese or Russian tubes, which may look newer and have a new box, but typically do not perform as well as vintage tubes. The big exception here is antique or "two digit" tubes. These are all over 60 years old, and it is nearly impossible to tell if a tube has ever been powered up in a circuit before. These tubes, like all of my others, are tested as NOS. I test every tube I sell, and these must test as new or I will not sell it as such. All of my tubes, even those I sell as used, carry my 30 day satisfaction guarantee."
Under NOS Mullard 12au7s, much of what he lists specifically says "White Box".
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"If you are the owner of a new stereophonic system, this record will play with even more brilliant true-to-life fidelity. In short, you can purchase this record with no fear of its becoming obsolete in the future."
"It was a common practice to recycle the boxes in tube caddies, and refill them with tubes from bulk jobbers boxes."
It was also common practice to put the used tube from the radio/TV into the box in the caddy after replacing it. Sometimes the box got marked, sometimes not.
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Buy Chinese. Bury freedom.
It was also common practice to put good used tubes from equipment into boxes after they needlessly replaced one.
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