|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
24.174.46.195
In Reply to: RE: Tube recommendations for Yaqin (Pacific Valve) Tube Buffer (single tube) posted by umn on August 25, 2009 at 08:39:48
Email this seller and make sure these are actually 1977 manufactured and made in the Ulyanov factory (bomb logo). These tubes really are the "bomb", really sound great. These are much better tubes than the ones sold by Triode Electronics, and those are better than the Chinese 6N1s versions which you have. It will make a BIG difference. I collect 6N1Ps, which are one of my favorite tubes, and the ev versions made in this factory, during the 70s, are among the very best available.twystd
Edits: 08/25/09Follow Ups:
Just a correction... it is not a bomb, it is a rocket, and the factory is Voskhod, in Kaluga, not Ulianovsk.
And of course they are not equivalent of the 6DJ8 family.
You're right about it being a Voskhod made tube. However, I still think they are the "bomb"!;-) I know the 6N1P is not a 6DJ8 equivalent, but I am correct about the Russian 6N1P-EV being a direct replacement for a Chinese 6N1, aren't I?
twystd
The name Voskhod (Sunraise) had to do with the second generation of the Soviet manned space craft... the first one being Vostok (East), so the connection to space flights was strong and clear one.
But of course the difference between the space rocket and ICBM is just the payload... :(
Yeah, I remember when the Soviets were kicking our western butts in the space race, largely with vacuum tube technology. That speaks volumes for Russian vacuum tube technology.
From what I understand, the Russia military up until at least pretty recent times, had tube fired radios and radars, even in their jet fighters. Some in the west thought that was pretty backwards. However, in case of nuclear exchange, they'd have the only working radios and radars, because of the effect of EMP on solid state. Thank god that never happened, on so many levels, at least so far.
In reality their use of vacuum tubes was caused by simple lack of developed and available solid state solutions. As soon as there was any chance, the electronics was changed to all solid state. But since they had to claim something, they promoted that EMP story, which is true to some extent only. Yes, an antiquated electronics can survive certain events better... but the reality is solid state, and especially digital electronics, is thousands of times more mission-capable. Therefore much of old tube based electronics was replaced already in the sixties and seventies, and the line had been pushed further and further. The analog tube computers in the first and second generations of SAM's were replaced by digital guidance systems. Given their average 20 year technology lag, they are still flying some tubes on older planes, but you can safely say that all modern front line equipment has been converted to solid state long ago. I started working there in the early seventies, and even back then most engineers already hardly knew anything about tubes. We worked with hybrid and monolythic integrated circuits, but of course the level of integration was pitiful.
It's funny,.. I'm probably the last one to believe the stuff that our government feeds us but if it came from the RU, heck, it must be true!
I guess in this case, it doesn't really have any earth shaking consequences so maybe I'll just keep believing it?
Seems as if I bought into Soviet propaganda. It's good to hear from someone actually in a position to know. Accurate information on the old Soviet Union is pretty hard to come by. I appreciate your posts.
None the less, some of the Soviet era tubes are at least the equal of some of the best western tubes, and present great value. Some of the Soviet era capacitors are very interesting, like the SSG silver and micas, the copper foil/paper KBGs, and the aluminum foil/paper MBGOs. I don't know of any western equivalents with the very useful voltage and uf ratings, with that kind of construction.
twystd
Although many lines paralleled the Western parts, there were some unique ones, not found anywhere else. And today some of them represent true bargains.
Victor, hi. I was wondering what is going on with Svetlana Electronic Devices these days. I see a few SED =C= tubes available through Antique Electronic Supply and that is it. The photos of inside the plant published back when there was an RU/US trading company looked pretty good. As I recall the technicians were all wearing some kind of lab coat arrangement including head covering. It looked like they could make just about any kind of tube in that plant. Was this window dressing (a vacuum tube Potemkin village!) or actuality? It would be cool (perhaps not politic) to get your perspective in general on tube making in RU in addition to Svetlana ED. Thanks. I greatly enjoy what you post. Your point of view is informed and succint. It is a pleasure to read.
Edits: 08/25/09
Very hard to tell. Last time I was inside the Svetlana factory was twenty some years ago. But I have visited other production plants since then, and my general impression was they were running just like they used to in the seventies... which is to say - far from modern. Vacuum tube production has never been clean process, and typically you see oil saturated asphalt or concrete floors, lots of noise, hot furnaces, some semi-automated equipment that had seen better days.
I suspect the clean rooms and lab attire that you saw were part of the Svetlana semiconductor production facilities. Even in the seventies they already represented the majority of the firm's production - if you exclude the large to VERY large transmitter tubes - some five feet tall.
Based on the evidence we have - (their tubes) - they ARE capable of making good product, although I have to say the general quality levels are nowhere near what used to exist in the tube heyday - for instance we constantly have to reject very large portion of new tubes. On one particular tube model we had to completely move away from the current Russian production in favor of the JJ tubes - the rejection rate was 100%. But that is not a typical example, fortunately. So overall I would rate the new tubes as "acceptable".
... and they wrote the tightest code imaginable, because when they started coding they just did not have superfast machines with large memory that could run advanced visual coding environments (bloatware) that helped them out. So, they do it the old fashioned way by writing the code down on paper and getting it small and fast. Those habits stay with you as you move on.
Regards,
Geoff
... and the target in the navigation computer. ;-)
Regards,
Geoff
I saw that the heater elements are different?
Looks the same to me. Here's a link to the 6N1 data page: http://tubedata.milbert.com/sheets/095/6/6N1.pdf and here's the same for the 6N1P-EV: http://tubedata.milbert.com/sheets/113/6/6N1PEV.pdf Looks like they both have 6.3V heaters @ 600ma, and use pin 4 and 5. Looks like everything else is the same as well. From what I understand the Chinese 6N1 is just a copy of the Russian 6N1P, and the Russian long life special construction version is the 6N1P-EV.
Thanks for your response. Please see my comment "You may have hit on something!" above.
One of my pet peeves is people claiming the 6N1P being a substitute for the 6DJ8/6922 family. That is not true, the hotter heater of the 6N1P will effect the electron emission, and the higher plate resistance really changes things. A power supply that is optimized for a 6DJ8 will not supply the optimal voltage to the plate of the 6N1P, not to mention cathode resistor, and plate load changes as well. If you look at the tube curves and draw load lines you will see how different they are.
Yeah, the 6N1P has the same pinout and mu as the 6DJ8, but that's about it. Often people will report that a 6N1P will sound better than a 6DJ8 when dropped into a circuit optimized for the 6DJ8. However, the 6N1P would sound even better if the equipment was optimized for a 6N1P.
BTW those 70's vintage ev version Voskhod/Kaluga (rocket logo) tubes sound great. I collect a lot of these tubes, and run them in my DIY 6N1P-EV parafeed line stage. I've rolled a lot of vintages and factories, and those sound "technicolor". Try what I'm suggesting, I really don't think you'll be sorry. Email and confirm that these are 1970s Voskhod manufacture, and are the EV versions (important).
twystd
Post a Followup:
FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: