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The quest continues……….

It all started a few years ago when I had an opportunity to own my audio system with Onkyo AV intergrated amp and a pair of KEF. Just like anyone interested in audio equipment, I went to many friends’ homes and listened to their systems. It didn’t take long before I fell in love with tubed equipment. However, the price was out of my reach! It didn’t take long before I realized that there are tube amps available from our motherland, China at a much lower cost. Buying my first integrated tube amp with 6L6 has quenched my thirst – but not for long………… there are just so many areas that can be improved. Listening in the audio shops will give you an idea of what good sound should be. However, even with the Chinese tube amp, those that can give good sound still cost a lot……….. This is why I ended up in the road of DIY.

One of the advantages in living in a big city like Hong Kong is that it is so crowded, but this also means that you can easily find someone with your interests. After knowing a company called TranscendentSound on the internet and the open circuit, I began to build my first ever tube preamp – the Grounded Grind (GG). The circuit is designed with the idea of “simple = best”. The sonic character is fast and well controlled even at the base region. This gives you the best of both tube and SS world! The author of the circuit believes that good circuit design is far more important than using expensive components. One day, in a friend’s home, I had a chance to hear a scratch built preamp with crap <$2 components and the one with Solen, RMG etc……. The verdict was simple. Good components do make a difference………. a big difference. Period.

So I went on to modify my GG with Black gates and RMG with Jensen copper as the coupling caps. The sound was really good. Good dynamics, good details, and resolution…… But being an anal-retentive person like me, I never stop. I started to play with cables, and this is how I came across Chris from VH Audio about his cryo cables which are really great. They further enhance the transparency of my system. Like the veil has been taken off, as some of my friends said. After buying a few times from Chris, I had a feeling that we both have the same quest for the same type of sound - transparency, speed, good control, accurate tonal balance, wide and deep soundstaging. One day, I received an email from Chris about his new cap – the V-Cap. Well, the price was a bit high, but since they were at a reduced price because of promotional offer, I thought I may give it a try after the positive experience with the cryo cables and the cotton silver interconnect. Actually, after the Jensen copper, I have also tried Dynamic cap, Russian Teflon caps, Jupiter caps and MCap Silver oil. Each cap has its own characteristics, with the MCap Silver giving the best highs and most balance, but perhaps the bass was a bit dim.

The V-Cap took a few days to arrive in a securely packed box, and each pair of caps was wrapped in paper towels and an air tight plastic bag. The pair I ordered was 1uF, which is an exact replacement for the coupling cap in GG.

Once I received the V-Cap, it was immediately installed in the system composed of DIY GG as preamp, 2 DIY TranscendentSound T8 OTL as power amp. The T8 is actually bi-amped to control the 2 way speakers after a DIY active crossover. The source is a Marantz SA14a ver 1 with modified clock and most capacitors changed to Blackgates.

When the V-Cap was first installed, the sound was already as good as the MCap Silver, with a very good treble and good extension to the high end. However, even though the extension was good, the treble in this fresh new cap was a bit “digital”, not as smooth as the well-burnt MCap. There are no loss to details, but the sound stage was a bit contracted, the bass was also restricted and loose. But this is just for the first one hour of the caps life. When compared to Dynamic cap, the V-Cap in this first hour is less dynamic. After the first 10 hours, the V-Caps had settled down, and the “digital” sound had virtually disappeared.

After this, the V-Cap was burnt-in for another 100 hours. I tried not to listen during these 100 hours to see if there was any real change. At about 100 hours, we had a gathering with a couple GG DIY group members, to see the half burnt-in V-Cap. We had Jensen, Dynamic cap, Jupiter cap, Russian teflon and MCap Silver all connected via a dip switch so we could do an A/B comparison. All are of 1uF in value which is the exact value specified in the circuit. At 100 hours, the V-Cap is more relaxed, and we can now listen for a long time without causing fatigue. The high is already silky smooth and the bass extension is also very good. The mid range is getting more refined and smooth. The Paper in oil army grade cap, Dynamic and Jupiter all have different characteristics. The Dynamic cap is really “dynamic”, Jupiter gives a lot of details but the V-Cap wins them all, and by a good margin. The V-Cap is both detailed and dynamic. Listening to live recordings gives you an impression of being there. Focusing is particularly good, especially when listening to symphony type of music- you can tell the location for each piece of instrument!

However, none of these have prepared us for the phenomenal impact on the system when we listen to the V-Cap again at 400 hours of burn in a few weeks later…………..

At 400 hours of burn-in, the shoot out continued. Good extension to both high and bass with good control and silky smooth trebles was already present at about 200 hours of burn-in. What else can this cap improve on with this few hundred hours of burnt in? Alot. If you haven’t listened to it, you wouldn’t believe me.

Using the same setting, we played a variety of music this time, and compared the different caps. First up was David Roth’s Pearl River from Stockfish records, the sound of the guitar was really, really good. You could hear the details of change of the sound when he slid his fingers along the strings when he changed chords. He voice was very relaxing and comfortable, but accurate. To determine whether equipment can differentiate the different characteristics of an instrument, The Miracle Makers by Bein & Fushi is the acid test. This CD is composed of music by many different violins, each with its special character, and all worth more than a fortune. The total cost of the violins cost over $100 million. It was an enormous effort to produce these recordings. This is a MUST BUY CD for the violin lover. With the V-Cap, the characteristics and tonality of each violin are very well presented. When using the MCap, the sound of the violin is very smooth too, but the character is not as distinct. The features are not as accurate. What about other caps? Well, forget them.

What about vocals, for female vocals, we chose Carol Kidd – All my tomorrows SACD, LINN records. Her sexy, sweet voice is already well known to many. The V-Cap not only further enhanced her presentation of smoothness, but also let you hear the music coming from the base of her throat. You can feel the power and strength of her voice, yet was very smooth and relaxing. These characteristics are particularly evident with Louis Armstrong – What a wonderful world. The vibration of the vocal cords is so clear. Perhaps too clear for some!

What about live music? We tried Vivaldi’s four seasons. The version we listened was Gala Stradivarius Concert by the English chamber orchestra, Start Records. This is a live recording ….. The sensation of space and air is so strong that we had a feeling our listening area of about 150ft had extended to the whole hall. Even using stereo speakers, it felt as if we were using a multichannel amp! However, despite this feeling of space, there is no loss of sound stage- it is wide and deep, not contracted in the middle of the empty space. The resolution is clear and the positions of different equipment are also very accurate. You can “see” the whole orchestra in front of you.

To test the speed and dynamics, we used SACD version of Living Stereo – Offenbach: Gaite Parisienne. The V-Cap is fast… very fast. There is no muffling of the sound and the sound of each instrument is distinctly heard, even though this recording has many instruments and is very fast with so many things going on at the same time. The dynamics are also excellent, with no compromise in detail or big swing to either end of the listening frequency.

Our last test was positioning, and we used Musik wie von einem anderen stern, Manger. When listerning to Der Himmel deckt alles mit Stille zu, the position of the door and the ticking clock etc… are accurately placed with both horizontal and vertical dimensions giving a real 3D experience.

Overall, the V-Cap is an outstanding cap that we are all very happy with. It belongs to the fast, accurate type with a good balance of musicality. We are extremely happy with the effect it has on the system. Will I stop here? Well, there are always areas to improve, the resistors, the power caps………, but at least I have found THE CAP for the coupling position in my preamp, and for this position, this will be the end…

The quest continues……..

Ackcheng & Tai Po

Product Weakness:	Nil
Product Strengths:	Fast, transparent, with a good balance of musicality

• V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - wjgruenewald 13:12:34 10/13/04 (7)
  In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by artcheng@netvigator.com on October 10, 2004 at 17:32:03:

  Nice essay!! However, I'm not personally very happy with these devices. Mainly, the "hype" associated with these things, and the "expense". V-Cap has'nt done anything for my system, except to totally screw-up the soundstage, imaging, focus and immediacy of my system. In addition, now after over 1000 hours of 'critical listening', I'm still not sure as to "where" these things are going to! I'm still waiting for that "strawberry chocolate flavor" that these things impart (so its been said), and "when it will happen!! Try a capacitor that is known for its accuracy - Ansar is!!
  
  

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  • Your time is up... - ChrisVH 13:05:31 10/22/04 (0)
    In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by wjgruenewald on October 13, 2004 at 13:12:34:

    I have not received any caps back from you, nor have you provided me with an order number. Will you stop telling tall-tales now?

    It's been a little over a week. Plenty of time to pack those V-Caps up and send them back, or find the order number from one of those people who so generously provided you with the caps to evaluate for 7 months, er, I mean "1,000 hours of critical listening". Funny that someone would spend all that money on shiny new caps, only to give them to you to evaluate for such a long period of time. Generous people indeed. Oh, and you mentioned that you are "still not sure as to "where" these things are going to!". Wouldn't that imply that you still have them in your possession, or at least still have access to listening to them?

    You've been called out, sir.

    
    
    

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  • Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - ChrisVH 15:43:51 10/13/04 (5)
    In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by wjgruenewald on October 13, 2004 at 13:12:34:

    Do you really own these caps? I have no record of these caps being sent to you. If so, I will take them back and issue a 100% refund, and I'll EVEN throw-in all shipping costs. If you'd like to keep them, I will pay you a crisp $50 bill if you can post your order number for these caps. I will post a followup to this thread that you actually owned them and returned for a refund. Otherwise, your "comments" are suspect, IMHO. I'll post back in a week if you haven't returned your caps or provided me with your order number.

    Put up or shut up.

    As far as the "hype" around the V-Caps, if you call actual user reviews hype, then what about the fact that most of your posts to Audio Asylum are pimping Ansar caps (which may be a fine cap BTW)?

    
    
    

    • Hype?   (Open in New Window)

    
    

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    • Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - wjgruenewald 21:59:14 10/13/04 (4)
      In Reply to: Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by ChrisVH on October 13, 2004 at 15:43:51:

      Thanks for the offer!! Actually, I would never own these capacitors, for the following reasons:

      1: The equipement that these caps were installed into did'nt do anything for me - ARC Ref ll pre and phonostage, Dr. Arthur Loesch pre.

      2: Cost - I simply would refuse to "pay that type of money" for a part that I now know would not be satisfactory in my applications.

      3: The percieved "bed-fellow" syndrom regarding the "hype" with the V-Cap modification of the Hurricanes.

      4: My extensive experience with the Ansar caps in my system leaves not doubt in my mind which is the most neutral cap to be had to date, and I tried most of them.

      5: My response to your add regarding the V-Cap insofar as "Capacitor Ageing" is concerned - ie. - snake-oil!!

      In closing, allow me to say this: I hope that the promise of your product will be "positive" for you - that is, after all, what you are after!!

      Thank you for "exposing" my previous (I think 14 posts)to the various boards. One-track mind you say - damn right. Appears that we "do not" agree on anything, except that the Ansars are indeed very special!!

      Cheers, William

      
      
      

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      • Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - wjgruenewald 03:02:30 10/14/04 (3)
        In Reply to: Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by wjgruenewald on October 13, 2004 at 21:59:14:

        Clarification regarding point 1 of the previous message: The ARC REF ll belonges to my brother. I had both units - actually all 3 units - ARC Phono for approximately 7 month I removed the V-CAP and replaced same with Ansar SPA Audio-Grade, silver, 1.1mm leads, 1% tolerance. Regarding the Dr. Arthur Loesch Pre: Removed "all" V-CAPS and installed SPA Grade Silvers. To me, the results were predictable: Soundstage opened up significantly with the Loesch. No "artificial" flavors in both pre-amps. Image-focus tightened significantly, midrange and bass now had more definition and extension. This all happened after the equipment reaching "thermal equilibrium" - about I hour into warm-up. No dicernable improvement regarding the Ansar's since initial warm-up. Yes, I probably could get you the V-CAP from their owners. I'll certainly won't loose any sleep over retrieving those V-Caps. However, if I am able to do this, and providing that they still have these devices, I will "overnight" these to you, gratis!! I'll do even better than that: I'll include complete specifications of the 3 types of Ansar capacitors available: PPA, CPA,& SPA grades, compromising approximately 210 different value capacitors between those groups. And if your really nice to me, I might even be talked into a "freebie sample" for you!!
        
        

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        • Unbelievable... - ChrisVH 08:19:05 10/14/04 (2)
          In Reply to: Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by wjgruenewald on October 14, 2004 at 03:02:30:

          You said: Clarification regarding point 1 of the previous message: The ARC REF ll belonges to my brother. I had both units - actually all 3 units - ARC Phono for approximately 7 month

          Umm, the first sale of V-Caps was made in June. It's now October. That's 1, 2, 3, 4.... 4 months ago. If your "brother" had V-Caps installed in his unit at least 7 months ago, then I would suggest he should be nominated for the Nobel prize, since he has made the breathtaking discovery of time travel.

          Next you state: Yes, I probably could get you the V-CAP from their owners.

          I thought this was just one person's pre that the V-caps came out of? Did multiple people own this pre? Now we have multiple sources of the V-Caps you used?

          I can appreciate you like your Ansar caps. There are MANY fine caps in this world, but to disparage a cap that you've NEVER HEARD to call attention to one you like is rather underhanded, IMHO.
          
          
          

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          • Chris - You can run but you cannot hide!! - wjgruenewald 19:40:48 10/14/04 (1)
            In Reply to: Unbelievable... posted by ChrisVH on October 14, 2004 at 08:19:05:

            Actually, to answer once again your questions, there were a total of 3 units, the ARC REF ll, its Phono Stage, and a Dr. Arthur Loesch design pre-amp - thats three, no?? The parts (your stuff) was sourced not by me - I just put them in!! Maybe I was wrong in my 7 month estimate - so what! To flately state that I "never heard" your V-Cap is totally wrong, and therin lies its major shortcoming: One can hear the damn thing!! Furthermore, one can hear it not only at 10 hours, but at 50, at 100, at 200, at 400, at 600, etc. Will it ever form?? I suppose that with your product installed one has to "hope that it will sound good as it did yesterday", but may not tomorrow!! So much for consistancy. You may be able to "fool" these kids with your fancy advertisements, I personally like those "rave" testimonials, but you can't fool somebody with over 40 years of experience with these things. (No, I'm not talking about your V-Cap here, lest you accuse me of additional "time travel"), but of electronics in general!! When was the last time you actually tried to "solder"?? Maybe you never have - no? Ever done any 'prototyping' - don't know what that is - thought so. How about winding your own transformers?? Oh well - I guess it comes down to "anything for a buck" - no??
            
            

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            • Sigh. - ChrisVH 20:29:58 10/14/04 (0)
              In Reply to: Chris - You can run but you cannot hide!! posted by wjgruenewald on October 14, 2004 at 19:40:48:

              I await the return of the parts, or for you to provide the order number... I'm done playing your little game.
              
              

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• very well-written, just like YK Chan's article in Audiophile - EL84 18:23:31 10/11/04 (0)
  In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by artcheng@netvigator.com on October 10, 2004 at 17:32:03:

  magic pills, magic cable, magic tube...
  
  

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• V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - audiquattro 12:12:59 10/11/04 (3)
  In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by artcheng@netvigator.com on October 10, 2004 at 17:32:03:

  How did you perform a 400 hour burn in? You mean you just hook up your system and playing from a tuner or something for the 5 weeks time period?
  What's the difference between this and dynamicap?
  
  

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  • Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - artcheng@netvigator.com 05:27:03 10/12/04 (2)
    In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by audiquattro on October 11, 2004 at 12:12:59:

    Thanks for thr compliments!

    To do the 400 hours of burn in, I connected the CD player playing STS Burn-in CD to the Pre-amp and play about 10 hours / day.

    Compare to the dynamicap, VCap has a better trebles and has a lot more air and the sense of space especially in live music!
    
    

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    • Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - audiquattro 06:22:07 10/13/04 (1)
      In Reply to: Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by artcheng@netvigator.com on October 12, 2004 at 05:27:03:

      Do you think this test might be system dependent?
      What I'm saying is:
      Dynamicap might sound better in some other systems than the V-Cap.
      It might not be as transparent but it might be fuller and sweeter sounding.
      Aside from that, the V-Cap price is more than double of dynamicap.
      If your preamp/amp requires 2 dozen caps then the cost is really high.
      
      

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      • Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components - artcheng@netvigator.com 08:26:06 10/13/04 (0)
        In Reply to: Re: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by audiquattro on October 13, 2004 at 06:22:07:

        Well, you are quite right that dynamicap may sound better in other systems. But I have only tested the caps in my system so I suppose I cannot make further comments regarding other systems...

        For the type of sound that I am looking for, I suppose I prefer Vcap.

        
        
        

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• You should write professionally - james_b 11:08:12 10/11/04 (0)
  In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by artcheng@netvigator.com on October 10, 2004 at 17:32:03:

  You should write professionally for $$$ as your review was as good or better than many reviews. Excellent input!
  
  

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• I found your writeup enjoyable, nice work (nt) - tommytube 09:34:34 10/11/04 (0)
  In Reply to: V-Cap TFTF Passive Components posted by artcheng@netvigator.com on October 10, 2004 at 17:32:03:

  
  
  

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