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Please share your own choices. The $6k price can be new, or used. You might want to read my caveats, if you'd like to help me in my own search. If not, that's ok, just share whatever your own choice is (whether you currently own it or not).
Here is sort of a run-down of my own thoughts at this time.
So far two speakers have interested me: The Sonus Faber Liuto, and the Vienna Acoustics Mozart Grand. (The Sonus Faber "toy tower" does not appeal to me.) The Vienna looks like at least as good a value for money, since it is priced well under $4k (although it looks like prices have been hiked on this brand over the last 2 years or so...and premium Rosewood costs an extra $300 or more...that should be more like $200 imo).
The Spendor 5B looks interesting, but doesn't seem to have adequate bass extension, and the dealer network looks limited here in the Southeast USA. I liked what I heard from different Spendor speakers in the past, though...but not really for the asking price.
I love the finish on the cabinetry from ProAc, but they seem to be moving away from using dome tweeters (at least on their top models). The Studio 140Mk2 does use a soft dome, but also uses carbon filled polypropelyne cone midwoofers. The speakers I've used and owned in the past, which use this type of cone, sound a little too over-ripe, and lack detail. Also it looks like the woofers share the same airspace with each other, but I could be wrong. If that is the case, then that's also not what I want.
The Aerial Acoustics 7T looks quite nice, as a used product only. Since it's a recent model, I doubt it will be on the used market for a while. I'm really not a fan of buying used, although I have done it with some very good success in the past.
I also don't really like metal dome tweeters or woven fiberglass cones, so that cuts out PSB and the lower range from Focal. I own the small Magneplanar MMG (besides other speakers which aren't planar). I like them (had them for 16 years!), and I'm sure the larger models would be better. But I really prefer to look for a 2.5 or 3 way cone-type speaker now.
Speakers generally don't seem to hold their value well at all, on the used market. So if there is a brand you have in mind that does, feel free to enlighten me. Wilson Audio obviously does, but I don't think they have a 3-way which would even sell used for under $6k...I also don't like their titanium tweeter. If I had to own a metal tweeter, it would be at least a ceramic, or ScanSpeak's beryllium...but let's not get outrageous.
Chario speakers have always appealed to me, by their looks alone (similar to Sonus Faber), but I've never heard any. Opera speakers also look interesting. Neither seems to have any dealers in the USA.
The Ascend Acoustics Sierra Tower looks interesting for only around $2k, and is an America-based company. But I think I would have a much harder time reselling them in the future, than one of the more well-known brands. I could be wrong though.
The Zu Audio speakers look interesting, but I have a feeling they might lack the refinement of the lower sensitivity competition...especially in the midrange.
Salk Sound (another American company) makes some lovely cabinents, but ribbon tweeters coupled with magnesium cones just don't do it for me (the Mundorf AMT tweeters just might...but a 3-way system with those would be entirely too pricey). I keep coming back to ScanSpeak or similar soft dome tweeters.
I haven't mentioned Dynaudio, because I currently own speakers which use their drivers. I do like them very much, but I'm ready for something that at least sounds slightly different. Their MSP cones and aluminum formers do sound superb, and I don't remotely classify them with the much poorer-sounding mineral filled polypropylene mentioned above.
Happy Listening!
Carl
Follow Ups:
If I were looking for a great speaker under $6,000, I'd buy them. I'm not endorsing the seller -- I don't know him.
I've heard Tannoys in the past. I liked them ok, but not enough to buy. The tweeter kind of sounds like what it is, a horn (albeit a "low compression" one).
and Tannoy DCs are owned by a great many sellers, engineers, designers and manufacturers of hi-fi equipment.
I see a few options in your price range.
Well, that narrows it down!
Dennis Murphy's Philharmonic 3 loudspeakers. Unfortunately, they're only $3K for the pair so there's not a lot of bragging rights in that regard. Stereophile had a brief write-up that was favorable. And since Dennis does much of the crossover design work for Salk Sound, I'd bet his speakers sound wonderful too.
Not sure why you get away with your screen name...I guess you have influence here. I've been banned from audio forums for less...
I'll admit that speaker looks fabulous (other than the low sensitivity). The drivers used are pricey, so it looks like it might be a nice value for money. I also like the idea of transmission lines...but I've not read how or why this is a "mass loaded" one (I assume to damp a line resonance).
That's the only real drawback with Scanspeak's Illuminator woofers. None of them seem very efficient. An 85 dB / watt speaker just doesn't appeal to me at this time.
The Raal ribbon is supposed to be one of the better ribbons, but I've never heard one. I own a Raven R1 driver (had it many years), and am considering selling it. I've also never heard the Mundorf AMT's. If this Philharmonic 3 used the smallest Mundorf tweeter, for a similar asking price...then that would be extremely tempting (even with the necessarily low spl to match the woofer).
And hey, I'm not all about only buying speakers for their snob appeal, or even spending a "lot" of money. I mean, I've even considered very cheap speakers recently. But then I came to my senses a bit...
I'm a speaker hobbyist myself, I just don't have my own crossover design equipment. Perhaps in the future. I'd like to think I have an ear for it...but I need to be a bit more prolific, haha.
With the 90 day return policy - and the really good reviews - why not consider the Von Schweikert VR 33? Less than $4000. No fancy wood cabinets but supposedly very excellent sound for the dollar. Response down to 25 Hz.
Yea I don't care for the cosmetics. If I'm going to pay more than $1k for a speaker, it better look like it costs that much. I'm sure the VR33 is a fine sounding speaker, as are most or even all of what has been suggested. Thanks for the suggestion, though. As a company I have no bias against Von Schweikert.
They sure have gotten rave reviews...
-RW-
I'll second the motion on the Gallo 3.5, though I'm not as enamored with the 3.1. I currently have the 3.5 and have previously owned the 3.1. The 3.5 is a more live and dynamic sounding speaker than the 3.1 was, though both throw a very wide and deep sound-stage. Any particular questions feel free to ask.
Edits: 06/24/12
Is that the speaker you use?
Hi Carl,
In reading your posting, I'm not learning what is the problem with your current setup that you are trying to solve. You speak a lot about driver materials, costs of cabinet wood upgrades and potential resale value, but nothing about what kind of music you listen to, what you like and dislike about your current setup and what you are after.
Some detail in these areas might elicit more focused responses.
Good luck!
George
Hello George,
I'm not all that dissatisfied with the responses.
I like rock, classical, and jazz. What do you like?
I really just want to try something that is similar to what I have, but different, and preferably more detailed in the upper bass and low mids, and perhaps more extended in the low bass. Seems like it shouldn't be that hard to do (going from a 2 way to a 3 way), but I guess it might be.
I don't think there is any primary problem I am trying to solve, though.
As I said, I've actually not listened to music enough lately. I used to be obsessed with it (and with audio stuff), back in the early 2000's. To the point where I was renting all sorts of cables from the cable company, and writing reviews on my findings, many of them nobody ever read. I finally settled on the cables I like (sort of)...they aren't all from one brand. The speaker cable is 7 AWG solid silver...but it didn't cost a fortune. Nowadays it would. I admit it sounded better with some parallel runs of various smaller copper speaker cable along with it.
I also decided the power cords I made myself sounded better than everything else I tried back then. I admit they look crappy, they're just thrown together by hand. I didn't even use really expensive conductors in them, either.
I recall trying one power cord that was all the rage (can't think of the name, but you might know)...it was extremely stiff...the plug wouldn't even stay in the wall. It sounded bright to me, and definitely not worth $2500, or whatever the retail price was...might have been $3500.
One thing I've learned...unless you're rich, or else you know the manufacturers and can buy stuff from them at their cost (which is way below dealer cost)...then you can't ever have a truly snobby system...haha.
I recall speaking to, I think it might have been the designer at NBS cable. He was telling me how the local pro sports players had bought a lot of his cables, implying that was a selling point. This hobby can get crazy and just absurd...one of several reasons I got bored with it back then. Sports and media celebrities are overpaid to the point that we should all seize their assets and redistribute them to people who know the value of money and hard work...not that I'm a leftist (quite the opposite actually). I guess I'm just saying, that's when you know it's time to focus on more worthwhile things in life...if you are trying things celebrities waste money on. I think either Fremer or Harley had NBS as their cable reference at that time, as well. Anyhow, cables are always way overpriced...to the extreme. Even the cheapest Monster cable is overpriced...and the CEO has a collection of Ferraris...as do most people who live in the SF area. And yet they want the government to tax them more, all the while driving up deficits higher...what absurd stupidity, hahahah.
Not exactly sure why you limit yourself to 2.5 and 3 ways.
As for the Zu Audio - HE speakers do not suffer in the midrange - that's where they tend to be best sacrificing the frequency extremes a touch if anything. One could argue that Zu Audio and Teresonic excel in the midrange though dynamics at high level may be an issue. I get your take on the driver materials since I share it but the LE speakers tend to sound shut in boxy and dynamically inept with a requirement to play loud (and then you just get slamm (boom and sizzle) from many.
I'd be looking at bigger two ways. Devore Orangutan, Audio Note J or E, Harbeth SLH5, ATC speakers, Zu Audio Essence and Superfly, Tannoy Kensington SE (and other models depending on price).
If it must be a two+ way or more - you could look into the Studio Electric T3 (off the beaten path I admit).
RGA, So you're suggesting speakers with higher efficiency, then? I admit they intrigue me also, but I've not heard any really good ones.
3 way speakers have inherent advantages that 2 ways don't, so that's why I'm sort of more interested in a 3 way. I've owned several 2 way speakers over the years, so just wanted to try a 3 way.
I don't know how I could ever hear the ones you suggest, since there are no dealers in my immediate area, and I'm not all about travelling all over the country to visit audio shops anytime soon. Auditioning speakers via mail order is a hassle...I've done that briefly in the past.
.
Yea if you had read my initial post, you would have seen where I don't want panel speakers. I've had the smallest Magneplanars for 16 years now...they actually still sound better than new. I know the larger ones are better still, but I don't want to spend that much on "panel sound", no offense. The dipolar radiation is annoying at times (even though I control mine), the large wavelaunch isn't always welcome...and the tonal color in the midrange isn't lifelike enough. Sure there is tons of detail, and the sound can be delicate, nuanced, beautiful and addictive...I admit that. But it's not what I want. The better cone speakers can do enough of that for my taste, and yet they do things panels can't.
Sure:
a) it's a matter of what presentation you like, and
b) cones do different things from planars.But a mate of mine who had 'statics for quite a few years (plus a pair of subs, to give him some very decent bass :-)) ), recently built himself a pair of Orions ... and, subsequently, has just bought some 3.7s (after coming round to my place and listening to my 3-way "Frankenpans") after seeing what cones don't do! :-)) (The problem with the Orions seems to be in the treble.)
REegards,
Andy
Edits: 06/23/12 06/23/12
Andy, I can see you like your system, and I don't doubt it sounds great.
Like I said, I'm aware of what Magneplanars can do. That's why I've kept my small ones for 16 years now. I will never sell them. I'm also aware of the quality of the ribbon tweeter in the 3-series. I just don't like the dipolar radiation, and the large wavelaunch. It's too fussy. Someday I might own a larger Maggie, but I'm in no hurry...and I'd certainly not want to be without a quality cone-based speaker, to use when I want to hear what they can do.
I've heard ESL's of several brands over the years. To me they all sound like a plastic film rattling in the wind. They are perfect for very quiet listening, because they come to life dynamically so easily (the nature of physics)...but not for moderate to loud listening.
Most guys who are happy with their system, tend to think what they have is better than what many, or even most other people have (or can put together). It's all a matter of time spent, taste, personal expression, personal opinion, experience, knowledge, judgment, wisdom, choices, hearing ability, and disposable income.
I mean, I feel I can dial a system's imaging in, relative to room acoustics and placement...as good or better than all but the best can do. Years ago, even without the quality room acoustic treatments I added later...my little Maggies combined with the (at times despised) Sunfire Subwoofer (this was like 1999)...easily outperformed a dealer's setup of Wilson Watt Puppies...so that gave me a sense of confidence in my own knowledge and ears. A speaker/subwoofer system costing $1600 or so, bettering an $18k system...Certainly the Focal titanium tweeter that will always be used by Wilson Audio is very flawed, and it will always hold his speakers back...no matter how well they sell, or how many new technical gizmos he comes up with...or how nice the auto paint finish is.
Regards,
Carl
Sounds like a description of the
Reference 3A MM deCapoi. My Grand Veenas are a blessing with either my Marsh A400 ss or Quicksilver 88s.Either that or buy my Dunlavy SC IVs! (On sale here on AA).
Edits: 06/23/12 06/23/12
Vienna Acoustics speakers tend to be rather weak in bass even when you pump them up, although I would never consider getting rid of my Strauss speakers. I just paired them with a good sub. They're just too musical to get rid of.
I'm less worried about weak bass...in fact, I don't mind it. I have subwoofers also, when necessary.
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