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the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-))

68.1.131.10

In Reply to: RE: this seems to work posted by Dawnrazor on October 04, 2011 at 07:37:44

I have a notebook in which I have a range of setups that I've tried. Putting things back where they were isn't a problem, so why not experiment? Having tried the sideways (of which, I guess, I considered the Rooze a variation), I knew better than to doubt this. My only doubts were about my room configuration, but it doesn't seem to be a problem.

As I mentioned, when I get this 'nailed down', I want to put the 3.7s back where they were for a comparative listen. There's something more 'relaxed' about the sound of this arrangement. I rather like it, but then I also liked the sound of my MMGs turned sideways - that was just impractical for the living room. This is workable - actually seems less crowded too.

"Information is not knowledge.
Knowledge is not wisdom.
Wisdom is not truth.
Truth is not beauty.
Beauty is not love.
Love is not music.
Music is THE BEST." FZ

Follow Ups:

RE: the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-)) - josh358 18:24:20 10/04/11 (17)
"There's something more 'relaxed' about the sound of this arrangement."

There is, isn't there? Less of a sense of -- for want of a better word -- stereo glare. More like being in a real space.
- absolutely (new hardware 'installed') - wazoo 19:06:05 10/04/11 (12)
  It came. I assembled it. It kicked my ass.
  
  Honestly, rowing is one hell of a workout. I only did a couple 15 minute sessions, but I'm definitely feeling it. I think I'm going to like this machine. I have about six months until my next birthday, by which time I want the physique I had ten years ago. Somehow, I think rowing will help get me there.
  
  I went to see Leland (my Maggie dealer) today, but all I bought myself were three power cords, some RCA caps and a set of Q-feet. I ordered a new system for my daughter: Marantz UD8004 universal player, Marantz PM8004 integrated amplifier, Definitive Technology Mythos STS, and some Audioquest cables. I think she'll like it - ought to be a decent system (I blew my $5k budget, but that's nothing new).
  
  "Information is not knowledge.
  Knowledge is not wisdom.
  Wisdom is not truth.
  Truth is not beauty.
  Beauty is not love.
  Love is not music.
  Music is THE BEST." FZ
  - RE: absolutely (new hardware 'installed') - Utley1 16:12:29 10/10/11 (1)
    I'd never thought we would get to rowing machines. At last I have something to contribute. I use the German KETTLER KADETT, which is really a fantastic machine, and with full extension rowing oars, it really provides a great workout. . It offers an experience that simulates the real thing. It is also beautifully designed.
    - tit for tat - wazoo 08:01:11 10/11/11 (0)
      You can more accurately replicate the rowing motion while I can more accurately replicate the resistance of water ;-).
      
      I looked at lots of machines, but wanted something that looked less like a machine and had a low profile. It isn't documented anywhere, but a neat thing I discovered about the WaterRower is that I can sit facing the other way, lean forward and push the handle (over my head) - thus working the opposing muscles.
      
      I've only just begun, but I can definitely say that rowing is a great workout. I started with 15 minute sessions, then a short sprint. That's about all I can muster right now. I feel it everywhere. The worst part is the whey protein drink afterwards - disgusting!
      
      How long have you been rowing?
      
      "Information is not knowledge.
      Knowledge is not wisdom.
      Wisdom is not truth.
      Truth is not beauty.
      Beauty is not love.
      Love is not music.
      Music is THE BEST." FZ
  - RE: absolutely (new hardware 'installed') - josh358 19:17:02 10/04/11 (9)
    Maybe you can hook it up to a generator, and power your system from it. Incentive to row!
    
    Just learned I had a second dental abscess after $2800 in dental expenses last month. At this rate, the only new audio equipment I'll be able to afford this year is a pair of earbuds . . .
    - ouch - wazoo 20:49:00 10/04/11 (8)
      That hurts physically as well as monetarily. Somehow, I've never had that experience. Sorry to hear it. Of course, there are worse things. I'd really rather not deal with any of the worse things.
      
      "Information is not knowledge.
      Knowledge is not wisdom.
      Wisdom is not truth.
      Truth is not beauty.
      Beauty is not love.
      Love is not music.
      Music is THE BEST." FZ
      - RE: ouch - josh358 07:19:37 10/05/11 (7)
        
        In Reply to: RE: ouch posted by wazoo on October 04, 2011 at 20:49:00
        
        LOL, yeah. I've really been lucky, never had a serious illness, so I can't complain. But it's been a frustrating month -- abscess, surgery, strep throat, now another abscess. I haven't been able to get much done, just sitting around bored.
        
        RE: ouch - Satie 00:42:14 10/06/11 (4)
        
        In Reply to: RE: ouch posted by josh358 on October 05, 2011 at 07:19:37
        
        Had a cracked tooth, that developed into an abcess, it took nearly a year to get diagnosed correctly and I got a few not really necessary cavities done. Multiple doses of antibiotics till the abcess would die down.
        
        Take things easy, and lay about. Read Dostoyevsky's "The Prince" or the Brothers Karamazov.
        
        RE: ouch - josh358 05:00:50 10/06/11 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: ouch posted by Satie on October 06, 2011 at 00:42:14
        
        Thanks. I'm supposed to be reading War and Peace. I did put it on my Kindle! Surely, that counts?
        
        Glad to know I'm not the only one who's had trouble getting abscesses diagnosed. I'm actually glad they found these, I've been complaining about intermittent pain in those two locations for years, now I may finally get some peace.
        
        Bad 1.7s - tyu 03:57:06 10/06/11 (2)
        
        In Reply to: RE: ouch posted by Satie on October 06, 2011 at 00:42:14
        
        So this is why my 1.7s suck the life out of the sound!If i put them in the other room an got a big amp an left the door open, an pulled some teeth that would have work for what a day,an some here are going on an on about the sound an have not even done the setup?
        Satie what about that room....this is why none of this works for me i have a room made for sound.To bad i dont feel like i have miss anything..
        Keep up the work, dont no were your going but get to it...
        
        RE: Bad 1.7s - Satie 09:50:26 10/06/11 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Bad 1.7s posted by tyu on October 06, 2011 at 03:57:06
        
        Working out the physics of it, there is a likely improvement in one aspect of sound that I had not been able to address effectively. That is that of the venue acoustic being recreated "within" the listening room - though the apparent soundstage expands beyond the walls, there is a distinct feeling of it being inside another acoustic. So rather than have a sense of being there, you have a sense of observing yourself being there. There is one more layer of the sense of unreality that I am hoping to remove.
        
        The setup as it is now does convince me most of the time that I am in the event and I often find myself disoriented when I open my eyes since I was fooled into expecting to be in a concert hall or a living room with a chamber ensemble.
        
        RE: Bad 1.7s - tyu 09:59:51 10/06/11 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Bad 1.7s posted by Satie on October 06, 2011 at 09:50:26
        
        We all no it never ends, most say if i could just get the sound i wont that would be that.
        I get away from them as soon as i can....I well get there one day an it well sound the best ever...the day i die...
        
        RE: ouch - Dawnrazor 22:21:00 10/05/11 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: ouch posted by josh358 on October 05, 2011 at 07:19:37
        
        Sorry Josh,
        
        I know a guy who served in the army and did a few years in the middle east. He said he had all kind of injuries from ankles, to knees, hips, shoulders, etc.
        
        He said he thought he was tough until he got an abscess. Said that was the worse pain he ever had.
        
        Hang in there man.
        
        No one here remembers the bending of our minds
        
        RE: ouch - josh358 04:52:10 10/06/11 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: ouch posted by Dawnrazor on October 05, 2011 at 22:21:00
        
        Thanks, DR. I can believe him, I've had them that were that bad. Luckily, this one didn't get that that bad -- I've learned over the years to go to the dentist when you get the first signs. They put me on an antibiotic until the surgery and it's quieted down.
        
        Also, they can stay silent until you get septicemia, that happened to someone I used to work with -- she was rushed to the hospital, didn't even know she had one.
        
        I'm just glad that they finally found these, I've been having intermittent toothaches for years now and couldn't get them to do anything.
- RE: the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-)) - ahendler 18:45:38 10/04/11 (3)
  "Less of a sense of -- for want of a better word -- stereo glare. More like being in a real space." Well said that is exactly what it sounds like. By the way I just tried speakers parallel to the side walls and lost bass doing it. The speakers sounded a little bright this way . Back to the edge on position
  Alan
  - RE: the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-)) - josh358 19:11:27 10/04/11 (2)
    The sideways configuration worked actually pretty well for me upstairs, I think I'd rate it 2 or 3 out of the placements I tried, but it didn't have the special magic of the edge on arrangement. I'm glad to hear that others are hearing the same things that DR and I did -- it's nice to know we aren't totally nuts. :-)
    - RE: the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-)) - Dawnrazor 17:10:14 10/05/11 (1)
      What would account for the bass disappearing?
      
      I dont know. I ran subs mostly but I dont think the bass had problems.
      
      Every room is different I suppose.
      
      Anyhow I like that description of lack of stereo glare. The Rooze really does sound less like speakers than it does live music.
      
      How do you explain Dr. Chaos' experience where the midrange was lessened?
      
      I never had that and Waz is not mentioning that kind of experience. Must be a room thing. Mine is pretty reflective with hard wood and no treatments. Just some curtains, a chair and a bed.
      
      No one here remembers the bending of our minds
      - RE: the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-)) - josh358 17:16:35 10/05/11 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: the only cost is time (and I have lots of that (I hope ;-)) posted by Dawnrazor on October 05, 2011 at 17:10:14
        
        I don't know, I was wondering about the midrange loss too. Typical construction materials shouldn't do that, if anything they'd cause bass loss.

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