|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
71.203.126.20
Speaking of ruSSian mobilization, the often repeated number of 300,000 recruits has no base in any reality, it was simply pulled right out of some hairy ass.If you look at the document, on Page 2, and come to paragraph 7, you will see a very brief message: "For official use only".
This is the secret paragraph that actually contains the numbers, and, according to the inside sources, it mentions 1 million recruits.
I guess it was considered too hot for public consumption, so 300.000 was "officially leaked out".
Someone has forgotten that this is not the Alexander the Great time, when troops numbers were often a decisive factor. Today it is mostly the armor and artillery, plus the fighting spirit, that determine the outcome.
So if you throw ten tons of beef into a meat grinder you are still not going to get a car... just more Spam.
There are cries all over Russia... with recruits marching away, yelling "I will come back, mom!!!"... scenes directly from The Cranes are Flying.
The sad part - they did not question their fascist leader then... they are not doing it now.
The shithole nation of dumb f@@ng slaves.
Edits: 09/22/22 09/22/22Follow Ups:
Nothing new about that.
My grandfathers fled partitioned Poland to avoid being impressed into the Austrian and Russian armies circa 1914. In the U.S. they became brothers-in-law. In the old country, they would have had front row seats in the trenches dying for dying empires.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
UN experts say evidence shows war crimes, including torture of children, committed in Ukraine.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
"UN experts say evidence shows war crimes, including torture of children, committed in Ukraine."
That's very sad to read.
On the other hand, that's a very serious charge. Do you have a source or any evidence? Since you mentioned the organization, start with the UN. "UN experts say"? Who? What have you read, and what have they reported? And don't give us the "look it up" BS.
Otherwise, this is just more Internet bullshit.
*********
We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
In the meantime we have plenty of solid information to form our opinions. It is not like we don't know who we are dealing with.
One should simply stay away from RT and Fox News and use his brain.
"In the meantime we have plenty of solid information to form our opinions. It is not like we don't know who we are dealing with.
One should simply stay away from RT and Fox News and use his brain."
****
Where can a person read or see this solid evidence?
And, specifically, what's wrong with Fox News? ABC, CBS and NBC produce as much BS as a person can take for one day. How are they "better"?
*********
We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
I usually go home for lunch and turn on TV, which is pretty much tuned to just two channels: Fox and CNN.
It rubs me very wrong way that with a major war under way you mostly hear some third-grade news on Fox.
CNN is predictable in its presentation, and it has never been, and never will be my significant source, but they are far, far more... shall we say, "balanced". It is easy to see their bias, but it is not blinding, as it is with Fox, which is today nothing more than an endless parade of political prostitutes.
So my 20 minutes of lunch time viewing is split 8:1 in favor of CNN. And those two minutes I end up watching the CNN I do so with strong feeling of disbelief.
Between the two networks, there is these days only one program that we try to watch, and it is the CNN's Jake Tapper on Sunday.
Just one program, yes (OK, 1.5, if you also count Zakaria), but that is still whole lot better, than an absolute ZERO on Fox.
I saw plenty of that growing up...drunken scum, barely able to stand up, fighting each other.
.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
with the exception of the Korean War, 85% of all KIA's on the battlefield are from artillery. This is why it's often called "The infantry's queen."
Other's often refer to it as the infantry's fist of God. Aircraft (one form or another) do about 10%, and in some areas 25%. Infantry to infantry really doesn't show any thing like most think it will. Yes the paper work shows up with great big numbers, but that's because the typical infantry platoon counts every kill as their own. If you've been there and done that; you know better. What the infantry does do well is to control ground.
A typical 155mm HE round has roughly a 70 meter killing radius (much closer to 55 meters!). A 500lb. dumb bomb is about 120 meters (50% kias in that circle). Some rounds are better at the game and some are horrific. A 155mm
cluster round breaking apart at 70 meter aerial burst is closer to 85%. Do the Ukrainians use them? I don't know, but with 300K new targets they'll get them in the inventory if they don't have them. Napalm comes to light should the guys wearing blue get control of the skies. Perfect weapon for today's fast movers, but even more important is the little known factoid that seeing that burning ball gets into your head. Next spring is gonna be real bad with all the rotting bodies laying around!
Gary
"How to leave Russia", and "how to break your arm at home".
Reservists under 35 who thought they were done with their mil service were handed written notices.
In that regard I fully support the Estonian position - they are not letting any ruSSians in, telling them to stay and fight for a change in their country.
Those leaving now deserve no compassion. They were all perfectly happy while the Ukrainians were slaughtered, but now that their asses are in danger they run like filthy rats.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
That is our most fundamental and important core belief. We shouldn't judge people based on their nationality, because we believe in individuals.
Throughout the Cold War, we took in Russians. It didn't matter whether they were dissidents, ideologues, refugees, or just people looking for a better life. Every one of them left out of self-interest. We took them in, and we're a stronger country because of it. We should take them now. It's been our tradition from the beginning, it's literally how this country came to be.
Even though we don't live up to our ideals all the time, we can't just walk away from them, because then we're just another shithole on a map.
There are a lot of groups we let in that we'd be better off without. Just saying we're stronger for it doesn't mean we actually are. How likely is it that they've all been a net gain?
I don't believe everyone has the right to live in whatever country they want. Just to be clear about that.
The US is literally a country of immigrants. Each wave of immigration built part of this country, and built its wealth.
Interesting news coming from Georgia.Their border patrol did not let in a car with a Z symbol.
There was a panic, and a protracted discussion among the "refugees" on that subject... most were just asking whether they should remove the symbol and the shitty "St. Georgian" ribbon.
Some were advocating "pride" - "Don't remove it!"
So here is the scum you are saying we should just take in.
Edits: 09/23/22
During the Cold War, we didn't take people in who wrapped themselves in the Soviet flag.
As always, when we take people in who are fleeing from an adversary, we expect them to let go of any loyalty to their former nation, and we vet them. Spies sometimes get in, but that's a problem we've always been able to manage.
Categorical rejection of all Russians because they might have formerly supported the regime is just wrong. Individuals are individuals. It's an authoritarian state where people are routinely assassinated for speaking up, so staying silent is not evidence of support for the regime or this war.
This is a TOTALLY different situation. If someone applied for a refugee status months or years ago then you would be correct - vetting and approval.This is NOT what the current wave is about.
Hundreds of thousands of ruSSian citizens left because they disagreed with the war in previous months. But this stampede has nothing to do with it.
Edits: 09/23/22
Most refugees had no intention to emigrate until something happened that they are now fleeing. They show up in waves and backlog the system. You contain them, process them, and either accept them or turn them away. We've been doing this for a couple centuries.
Contain them? Are you kidding? Who is containing them??? Nobody.They simply come as tourists, there is nothing "refugees" about those hordes.
Do you really not see any difference between the Vietnamese boat refugees, people escaping through the Berlin walls under machine gun fire, and the drives of Z-marked cars, going to Georgia for vacation???
Are you aware that anyone applying for a refugee status is supposed to provide some proof of persecution?
Try to make the case that a chance of being drafted by the government you yourself elected is such a case.
Try to spot some poor refugees in that line... I see mostly nice late model cars.
And this is the road to Mongolia... which is normally considered an armpit of the world.
Edits: 09/23/22 09/23/22
Nobody is suggesting Georgians simply open the border and let them roll through. I'm certainly not.
Here's what I'd say. You want to come in? First, go home and get that Z off your car. Then complete this application and wait in line until we get to you.
If this turns into a mass exodus, people are going to end up in camps, either on the Russian side of the border, or the other side. That's where they will be processed.
And simply being a conscientious objector can qualify for refugee status depending on the particulars.
I was talking about the reality - thousands of cars crossing borders, and I said that should be stopped. No one in that stream applies for refugees status.
I would have no problem with applying and waiting for an approval... but that is NOT happening. Your ideal does not exist in nature, sadly.
So the Estonians are 1000 times correct in apparently stopping that flow.
So should the Georgians, the Mongolians and the Kazakhs, possibly others too.
...as an example--and those folks don't have cars, and barely more than the clothes on their backs. Yeah, just get in line, sign this application and wait in one of our "reception areas"...
"So I talk to the night, I head for the light, try and hold it on the road. Thank God for the man who put
the white lines on the highway"--a very dear friend for decades Michael Stanley (Gee)--RIP
There's not one person in this country who thinks our de facto, non-sensical, lost or in perpetual limbo, sorta lawful, not by statute but by case law, leaky bucket immigration non-system is an example that anyone else should follow.
Strangely though, when we take in refugees from abroad, like from Iraq, or Venezuelea, Afghanistan, former Yugoslavia, we seem to have an efficient system of placing them.
...that unlike the "free-for-all" that we see EVERY DAY at the southern border, these other folks are being brought here, mainly via organized humanitarian efforts, with a plan, and in controlled numbers. Evelyn and I are sponsoring/housing 12 Ukrainian refugees here on my little farm complex.
I have no idea what rules were bent or waived to get them here--Evelyn, the church, and the agencies that they dealt with handled all of that, but it was a relatively straight-forward process (I'm not going to call it "easy"). Ukraine to Poland to Germany to NYC, US to Cleveland, OH. And once here, they were not just abandoned--assistance was immediately made available.
OTOH, southern border-towns are innundated with thousands of "uninvited" migrants on a daily basis. I recently saw a news-piece regarding one town of 29K residents with Border Patrol surveillance video documenting over 55K illegal border-crossings through that town alone this year. It's no wonder the residents are pissed.
"So I talk to the night, I head for the light, try and hold it on the road. Thank God for the man who put
the white lines on the highway"--a very dear friend for decades Michael Stanley (Gee)--RIP
Before that Afghans and Syrians
And Venezuelans
And former Yugoslavs
Rwandans
Libyans
South Asians after the partition of India
And from the rise of fascism all the way to the end of WWII
By "we" I mean all the parties of the Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees, which includes Russia, and Georgia, and Estonia, but not Mongolia.
Show me the process in regards to them.You are just obfuscating. There were no Afghans arriving here freely on cars loaded with stuff.
Please stop calling them "refugees", that is insulting to the real ones.
These are TOURISTS.
Edits: 09/23/22 09/23/22
All I will say is that I'm a U.S. born American citizen, and it takes longer for me to go through the international terminal at most U.S. airports than to go by car at the Mexican border.
Just sayin'.
*********
We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
Please don't equate the current wave with the Soviet refugees, who often took great risk escaping.There was no risk of any kind for the current wave. They stayed through the worst years of putin's regime because they liked it that way or just didn't mind, because it didn't affect them directly. Only now, when their lives might be at some risk, they decided to leave. They are simply opportunists.
Seven months of murderous war was, apparently, not enough.
They let hundreds of thousands of their countrymen take part in the war, tens of thousands killed... that was all OK, for as long as they were allowed to go on with their comfortable lives.
Edits: 09/23/22
In Yakutia's isolated settlements, which often lack high-speed internet, Russian state television remains the most important source of news for many. Mr. Shadrin, the Yukaghir community leader, described the members of his Indigenous group as scattered in small villages across the vast region and as overwhelmingly supportive of the Kremlin. But after fielding panicked phone calls from mothers this week, he suggested that might change.
Support for Mr. Putin "was off the charts" in rural Yakutia, Mr. Shadrin said. "Now I think a sobering-up is starting to happen."
At one reindeer herding enterprise, he said, four of the 20 herders had already been drafted. Among the Yukaghirs, he said, he already knew of seven men who had been called up, and he expected the number to rise as hunters and herders return to their villages and receive summonses. The total population of the Yukaghirs numbers about 1,600, he said, including just 400 men between 18 and 45.
Several community organizations published open letters requesting that the draft be suspended for the region's ethnic minorities, asserting that even in World War II, the Soviet Union's Arctic Indigenous peoples were not mobilized because there were so few of them.
(A local woman said).. Yakutians had been following the war on television and knew Mr. Putin's argument that it was a war to protect their country. But until now, it had all been very abstract.
"On television they say that this is about defending the Fatherland," she said. "But the threat is now not so much to the Fatherland but to our own lives."
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
...not every new neighbor on the block was viewed as a potential terrorist or spy--foreign or domestic. Immigration wasn't necessarily associated with infiltration.
"So I talk to the night, I head for the light, try and hold it on the road. Thank God for the man who put
the white lines on the highway"--a very dear friend for decades Michael Stanley (Gee)--RIP
This project of ours has been a perpetual struggle since the beginning, and it's always going to be a struggle, because our learned wisdom is in conflict with our genetic programming.
if Russians wanted to have a successful and quick military operation.
Success of the West and Nato will be scrutinized after a few consecutive winters and economy. Lets hope Russia will collapse first.
Overall I have but ONE contra-point.
Better armies frequently beat more numerous foes in ages past.
Alexander The Great? Or even when the Spartans, whose army were the Hoplites....The semi-mythical 300 of Sparta, held off a VASTLY superior-in-numbers foe by means of superior location for defense and a no-prisoners attitude.
Romans improved organization and technology. I suspect THEY would prevail even with a 3:1 disadvantage in numbers. This against the Hoplite style of organization.
Napoleon's Grand Army was maybe 600K men at arms at its peak. Bonnie was quick, knowledgeable and had a well trained group at his heels. He chose his ground to good effect.
Today? The Russians have NONE of that going for them, still fighting the advanced version of the 2nd World War. To that, I must agree. More deaths without meaning. Maybe somebody in Russia will Nut-Up and do the right thing......vis a vis Pukin.....
Too much is never enough
Where did you get that idea?
From reading history........?
Defenders are a 'plus' and those on th offense are a minus......
So it takes fewer defenders than those who want to storm your walls.
but in 'the old days'......smarter commanders WERE able to defeat larger armies....Sometimes a piece at a time.......
Link is just ONE example. Alexander outnumbered but the Persians under Darius screwed up and partly negated their numerical advantage. Alexander won and went on from there.......He spent the first couple years of his reign (his father was assassinated) trying to unify Greece / Thrace and the area.....
Too much is never enough
Shooting yourself in the foot gets you in prison, so they invented better way of escaping.
They dig a very shallow trench, and lie in it on their back, sticking their legs or arms up, in a hope that a piece of shrapnel is going to wound it in a "more natural" way.
Dead men walking...
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
Conscripts could be used to increase the defense workforce and produce more weapons. They could also be used to operate logistics, which seems to be a weak spot with the Russian army. Or they could be deployed out to posts around the country, freeing up the regular army folk there so they can be redeployed to Ukraine.
Pushing untrained conscripts right to the front lines to be slaughtered would be an incredibly stupid thing to do. It would kill troop morale, hurt public support, and the gain in combat effectiveness would be minimal unless they are trained, equipped, and supported.
Dictators always do.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
Good observation Dave.
Denial is not a river in Egypt-Alfred E. Neuman
But ruSSia is anything but.So point by point:
They don't need more workforce, they are already idling a lot of theirs, due to shortage of parts. For instance, their main tank factory Uralvagonzavod is idling for lack of bearings, that used to come mainly from US, workers have been sent home with pay.
The same is true of other high tech production plants, including their plane and missile production. Their unemployment is huge.
To operate logistics they need trucks and other vehicles, which are also in short supply due to high losses. So yes, more hands to load them would help a bit, but that is hardly a noticeable contribution.
I suppose they could command and use a lot of small civilian cars.
Now... the army is not controlling the interior, the Rossgvardia does, and that one is still largely there, it is a huge, 200,000 strong internal army. And you DEFINITELY don't want untrained guys do crowd control and unrest suppression.
OTOH, they pulled all the soldiers from the Finnish border. Do they need anyone there? Only a total idiot would think so, but they could put some there, basically, just to continue their training.
Your last point - you are grossly underestimating their stupidity. YES, the plan is to have those new troops on the frontline in just a few days, believe it or not... some say - in just three days.
PS. You might know the name of Kruhunischev design bureau - one of the main developers of their missile technology.
So now their employees also get the mobilization papers.
Go figure... a nation of assholes and idiots.
Edits: 09/22/22 09/22/22
Actual bears have better groomed asses.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
But those joining the front lines will have already been poorly trained as they have previous military experience. Well that is what thinking leaders would do, send experienced forward while training the newbs. All they will be is more mouths to feed. A week or two at the front and they'll be wishing they had some spam.
Hopefully this call up and resulting increased losses will cause enough citizens to turn against the govt and get that scum out of office.
in the game of mortal combat, your first six weeks will make or break you. After about 90 days you go into a survival mode (thought process). You hit the six month mark, and you're a journeyman at both staying alive and killing folks. You're right and left hand men know they can trust you, but by then you're looking 60% of the guys you came in with. Many of them have been returned after going thru the meat grinder once or twice. Those kids really go into the survival mode. Now and then you'll get a letter from home with Mom telling you what your old friends are doing while you have lice, fleas, and ring worm eating at you. They're Mom and Dad had the money to buy their way out of the draft. That really gets into your thought process. About that time Eddie or Bill take a 45 out back and get a trip home in a bag. You move along and your hitting the ten month mark. You wake up scared stiff as it all hits you at once. Now your afraid to do anything.
Gary
When CfL volunteers.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
. . . just like that POS Malcolm Nance, who volunteered his fat ass to fight for Ukraine, yet hardly ever ventures out from the safe confines of Lvov, near the Polish border. LOL!
Malcolm Nance is a retired Navy CPO with specialties in intelligence, cryptology, and terrorism. As a 61 YO man with that kind of resume, it wouldn't be surprising if he had been assigned somewhere that could use his particular talents.
. . . the Kiev regime is not going to risk getting him killed or injured, and he's nowhere near the action. He's there purely for propaganda purposes.
They already have 60+ old farts in sneakers... I kid you not!
They also lost at least 65yo pilots - recruited out of desperation.
They are going through severe shortage of pilots. The front line ones have been largely killed or imprisoned, and the fresh ones can barely take off and land, so they become easy pray to Ukrainian fire.
You can take a bum from the street, give him a rifle and tell him to shoot in the general direction, but it takes many months to train a pilot.
So the f##ers were hoping to get some pilots in the recent exchange, but their scum boss had different idea - so they exchanged 200 Ukrainian fighters for one piece of human shit - putin's relation through marriage, I believe.
von Lavrov walked out of the Security Council. What a piece of work he is.
Denial is not a river in Egypt-Alfred E. Neuman
.
But succeeded in fracturing the CSTO, and driving Kazakhstan toward the adults in the room (PRC & NATO)
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
Call up a million and actually get only 300k?
The official announcement mentioned only the reservists, people who had some war experience, or at least served and have been trained.In reality, there are tons of stories of people with none of those qualifications ordered to show up "TODAY AT 3pm"!!!
How is anyone supposed to make all the needed arrangements in just a couple of hours???
One guy in a video, in his late thirties, was first told to stop by to verify his information. As he did, he was given that 3pm order.
He never served, had a wife and mortgage, working in IT field. He had maybe 2-3 hours left to his civil life.
When asked what he was going to do he responded rather sheepishly: "Go, I guess... what else could I do?"
And if you don't show up on time you are subject to a seven years prison term.
Edits: 09/22/22
Spam is a pork product, not beef.
Along with armor, artillery and spirit, those troops need living supplies, clothing, bullets, guns and communications equipment. Almost none of which pootin can supply in a timely manner and training which takes time.
Training without live ammo isn't the same as what is done in many other countries, using live ammo training. I half expect their short training will be with wooden weapons.
Then we have winter around the corner so that troops will not have enough clothing for the front unless they bring their own from home.
Since they can't be supplied with proper gear of any kind for the 300,000 claimed that 1 million man call up is going to be even less prepared.
Where is that sniper rifle when we need it?
well, perhaps, technically.
If so, Spam's the porcine equivalent of the buffalo part above. :-|
all the best,
mrh
k.f.f.
Please do not forget that Cannibals call people.....'Long Pig'...... So the spam thing might still work...
Too much is never enough
The rest - you are 1000% correct, as I also pointed out below.
And let us not forget another important element - the fighting spirit. The Ukrainians are fighting for their land and their lives, and the lives of their loved ones.
I was hoping that, given the pressure Putin's been under from "allies"/trading partners and his representations about ending things asap, this troop build up or mobilization is merely posturing for eventual negotiations.
And considering how poorly his current troops are equipped (fighting in their winter uniforms in July, 1943 steel helmets, boots that fall apart after a rain...) a reasonable question is - how can he equip these additional ones?
The most modern tanks in the remaining inventory is probably their 60yo T-64, and those are already in Ukraine.
FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: