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I don't see Savagegeese get amped up this much over an entry-level car.Costs less than my speakers - front runner when I get back to the west.
Edits: 11/22/21Follow Ups:
I doubt that configuration (with the stick) will be around much longer. They're a dying breed--nearing extinction.
"So I talk to the night, I head for the light, try and hold it on the road. Thank God for the man who put
the white lines on the highway"--a very dear friend for decades Michael Stanley (Gee)--RIP
In Canada, the top-of-the-line Civic is pretty close to a Mazda Miata RF in price.
When I return to Canada, I'll likely buy an automatic. So we'll see how these CVTs improve over the years - the thing is the Lexus E350 isn't that much more expensive than a top-of-the-line Miata or Civic. Different cars of course but Lexus with Automatic is the norm - people tend to moan about automatics more in cars like the Civic and Miata.
Lexus has finally fixed their crappy infotainment system apparently. My plan is to buy a 2-year-old car with plenty of warranty time left. In 6 years they should have the chip thing solved???
Here in the US at least, the base model entry-level Civic is CVT-only. You have to get the hatchback with sport trim, starts at $24K. If you want any color other than red, silver, or black, that adds $400.
Still not bad, but not exactly entry level.
In my mind, the Chevy Spark is entry level. It's about $10K less. With a manual.
Or the Hyundai Accent, also about $10K less, also with a 6-speed manual.
But otherwise, except for the annoying way the infotainment screen is mounted, I like the car. The new body isn't nearly as ugly as the old one.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
2021 dollars is double 1990 dollars. So a car in 1990 that was $20,000 would retail for $40,000 today - I bought a brand new 1996 Honda Civic Hatchback back then (with $1,000 mag wheels) that was around $22,000 and that car would be utterly blown away by the 2021 model. And the 2021 model isn't double - it's a few grand more. Back then the Civic only came in 4 colours - black, white, red, and lime green. It had 106hp and did 0-60 in over 9 seconds. The minimum wage in Canada back in 1996 was $7 an hour. Today it is $15.20 - So the minimum wage has more than doubled but the car did not. In other words, the Honda Civic Hatchback is a far better deal today in terms of bang for the buck than it was in the 1990s.
Albeit the USA is different than Canada but in general - as min wage increases so do all other jobs above minimum wage. A server/greeter at White Spot in Canada (sorta similar to an Applebees I suppose in the USA) makes $60,000 a year including tips. Albeit in Canada they get minimum wage and tips where I believe in the USA I think they get screwed over on the wage and rely more heavily on the tips. Canadians typically tip 18-25% - don't know in the USA.
I digress. Yes, there are very cheap cars like the Chevy Spark - in Canada, the manual starts at an insanely low price of $10,398 Canadian ($8,100 USD).
But then why not go further and buy a motorcycle and attach a sidecar for even less? My friend had a Mazda 323 in the early 90s that was dirt cheap and it felt like a go-cart. To be fair to my friend he was 16. A brand new 323 when you're 16 is pretty darn good - I should hope that if you're over the age of 35 you can afford more than an $8,000 car.
On minimum wage in Canada one would earn $31,600 a year.
The Taxes paid for that income would be $3,110 and CPP/EI (Canadian Pension Plan/Employment Insurance is $1,975 leaving $26,515 take-home pay.
A couple both earning minimum wage in Canada would be at $53,030 take-home pay. They should be able to afford a Civic Hatchback. Especially given various payment plan options.
But you're right - if you want to save like $15,000 you can get this thing and even Scotty thought it was pretty respectable.
Just disputing that it's entry-level. In fact, I'm not even sure it's an entry level Honda. The HRV might be less expensive.
The Civic is a decent value for $25K. Better than the Mazda 3.
But another point you brought up--I bought a brand new Civic GL in 1982. It only had 65 horsepower, no power steering, no AC, I didn't even have a radio installed.
But it was still a blast to drive. It didn't matter that it wasn't fast and didn't have infotainment.
For me, at least, overall performance isn't a factor when it comes to fun. A good seating position, responsive steering, a decent shifter, and a feeling that the car is willing to play is all it takes.
After all, traffic in most of our urban areas, even out into the countryside, is heavy and slow. I was all over the rural southwest corner of Pennsylvania this summer driving to and from bike trails. I managed to get an open road only once, even though I left home before the sun came up.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
Edits: 11/23/21
considered so, at least by those who don't want to buy a POS that falls apart around them after 5 years, or earlier, and that doesn't have a devaluation worse than a Brazilian Real.
Entry level in my mind equals Chevy Spark, Nissan Versa, Kia Rio, Hyundai Accent, and Mitsubishi Mirage. All of those care are substantially smaller and less expensive than the Civic or Corolla. Even the Chevy Trailblazer starts at a lower MSRP.
The Civic and Corolla aren't the basic econoboxes they used to be.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
The Civic isn't a subcompact - it's a compact and it's now as big or bigger than older Accords. Indeed a new Civic is probably more luxurious than a 2005 Accord.Honda did make a subcompact in the Fit - but they stopped making it - it was too good and lasted too long I suspect so people weren't paying more for the Civic :)
Depreciation is a factor to consider - if you take into account the NET cost over 5 years the Japanese cars tend to fair better used. You pay $27k for a Civic and in 5 years it's worth $17k perhaps You lose $10k
You pay $14k for a Spark and after 5 years maybe you get only $4,000 is a loss of $10k
So you paid $10k over 5 years either way but got a much MUCH nicer car for those 5 years. I would definitely explore those factors as well when buying these things.
Also with all the dumbasses looking at their phones and not the road - vehicle safety might be something to prioritize - the Civic is probably safer than a Spark as well - but one would have to look that up.
I think the gist of the video is that he has driven all the shitboxes over the years and very expensive cars and the Civic he felt was still one of the best cars regardless of price. I don't think after working all my life and being in my 50s I would be "thrilled" to drive a Chevy Spark. You live on this blue ball once - then you're dead. Buy some nice things while you're here. You don't get extra points for being a spend-thrift.
That's why I don't really blame the rich guys for buying a Lamborghini. They got the money and they only get one life so may as well enjoy it while they can.
Edits: 11/23/21
Sales in the US slid from a high of 70k + units in 2008 to less than half that by 2020 when it was pulled from market.
It's successor, the HR-V sold 84k units in 2020 and 95k in 2019 before Covid hit. Contrary to
Ghostie's tiresome and data-free tirades, folks here demonstrate what they prefer with their wallet.
It just doesn't sell the Fit in the US. Not because it cut into Civic sales, but because the HRV is basically just a jacked up Fit that sells for 30% more than the Fit did. US buyers aren't savvy enough to know the difference and they'll pony up an extra $6K for the same car as long as it looks different. Honda isn't the only car maker taking advantage of that.
Used car prices are up sharply and they won't be going down again. All the lost production due to Covid/chip shortage/magnesium shortage/shipping problems, all of that means far fewer used cars, too. A $15K Chevy Spark is probably still going to be worth $9500 five years from now. My car is worth more than I paid for it 6 years ago. Even my wife's car--she'd get more on a private sale now than she would have two years ago and it's not even in very good shape. Depreciation isn't something anybody should be concerned about these days.
There isn't much thrill left when it comes to driving anymore either. Too much traffic, too much construction, most of the time spent behind the wheel is wasted waiting for the light to turn green. Besides, a car sits in the garage unused 90% of the time. Buy a cheap car, drive it as little as possible, use the money you saved for something truly thrilling like a great vacation.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
The Fit is no longer sold in Canada but they are still here in Hong Kong - it's called the Jazz here but appears to be the same car. I've seen several over the years. Obviously, there are far fewer truck-sized vehicles in HK. A lot of "mini" minivans here like the Honda Freed pictured above. They sell the Odyssey but I don't see those too much.
Smaller cars for smaller people. Savagegeese reviewer is only 5'8.
Some people, especially in the US, are about the size of a Chevy Spark - "they're gonna need a bigger boa...car."
Especially, if they have rather large kids to squish into the back. And perhaps the bigger beefier shocks of an SUV to ride down the road.
Refrigerator Perry needs a car too - err not a car - a big vehicle SUV or Truck.
Just had a friend buy a 2020 Civic & he loves it.
But he upgraded from a Pontiac Volt.
: )
With slightly different sheet metal. Toyota built them both.
I wouldn't mind having a Vibe. Or a Matrix. Both useful hatchbacks.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
Fer sure, a very useful hatch. He always took it in for all regular & never had a problem. 2011, book on it with around 85000 mi. was around 5200. sold it to a neighbor's daughter for 4800.
My ex-wife's husband has or had one with a stick, Pontiac variety.
He's got a Golf GTi now, think he sold the Vibe. If I had been in the market at the time, I'd have made an offer on it.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
Oops, Vibe not Volt.
...except the way it looks. That's a big hurdle to get over, otherwise could be my next car.
Dean.
reelsmith's axiom: Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.
Wait for the revitalized Acura Integra due for 2023 model year.
...19" wheels ?
Yikes.
Dean.
reelsmith's axiom: Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.
"So I talk to the night, I head for the light, try and hold it on the road. Thank God for the man who put
the white lines on the highway"--a very dear friend for decades Michael Stanley (Gee)--RIP
Is the new Integra also based on the Civic? If it is, a person so inclined could have an Integra disguised as a Civic for $25K.
The problem is not that there is evil in the world, the problem is that there is good. Because otherwise, who would care?
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