|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
47.188.98.98
In Reply to: RE: you've never heard of "cupped hands" distortion? posted by tomservo on February 24, 2017 at 16:09:27
"First, "non-flat" amplitude response is not distortion, it is non-flat amplitude response."
I understand what you mean, but that is incorrect.
A deviation from the input signal is, by definition, distortion.
:)
Follow Ups:
THANK YOU!ugh! people and their misguided attempts at quibbling with semantics
ANYTHING that changes an original waveform in any way is a form of distortion and, according to the laws of thermodynamics, any attempt (maybe short of direct nerve induction) to reproduce a sound wave will inherently be distorted, simply by SOME energy being converted to heat. the only thing that can be done is to try an minimize distortion as much as possible, BUT that often means little in the audio world where a majority PREFER distortion (that's right, i'm talking about you 90% of bass reflex lovers and your intentional "one note bass" aka TUNED FREQUENCY RESONANCE, phase distortion, timing delays, overhang, port chuffing & loss of woofer control etc.) along with bottleheads who find the warm fuzzy distortions of tube gear comforting.
even as a fan of "minimize all distortion... especially in the time & resonances domain" clinical sound school, still accept that you can get too much of a good thing (resolution) and that it can get too dry and sterile and require some sacrifice of accuracy to lower listening fatigue.
i'm just glad someone else pointed out the "don't look here, there's nothing to see here, nope... no distortion *whistle whistle whistle*" equivocation. there's more to distortion than THD and what *cringe* julian "if it measures well, it sounds well" hirsch has to say.
it gets frustrating trying to hold a discussion with people who "think emotionally" (i'm "afflicted" with a rare logic first, your feelings are irrelevant, personality type) and confuse what "sounds best" to them as being the least distorted.
back to my slight against bass reflex, as an acoustic suspension fan, i love the tight minimally distorted sound of preferable smaller & faster woofers snapping quick and resonance free, BUT, if i truly AM going to be objective, have to admit that even my preferred sound has an inherent form of distortion... namely, decreased bass extension which IS a distortion of the frequency spectrum.
ahhh... the truth... it will set you free and can be quite liberating when you stop thinking with your feelings and start embracing reality. i know... it sounds scary... doesn't it? LOL
Edits: 03/10/17
My point is / was that the normal operation corrects the magnitude response which IS what gives the horn a "cupped hands" sound.
Yes there are other kinds of distortion too but they are all related to alterations of the input signal which can't be corrected while the mag response is easily corrected as it is mostly minimum phase and like i said the magnitude response is a product of the drivers power response and the horns directivity.
My view of a horn system's strengths and weaknesses has not changed much since the Trio Compact days. Oh, I've certainly heard great-sounding horn systems at various trade shows, including several in Munich just a few months ago. (And once again I'm not denying the unique virtues of horn-loaded drivers.) But I've also invariably heard traces of the "cupped hands" colorations and driver-to-driver incoherence that eventually wore me down and out when I owned the original Avantgardes. (I guess I should also note that because of the various phase, time, and frequency-response issues I've already mentioned and the sheer aggregate size of their wavelaunch, horn loudspeakers don't image with great precision— nor, since they don't disperse their sound hemispherically the way point-source direct-radiators do, do they typically soundstage "outside the box." Although the severity of these problems depends on the design of the horn and the level it is played at, certain horns can be as much the poster children for "six-foot-wide" voices and violins and guitars as vintage planars were.
Jonathan Valin (who has a LOT more experience with horns than i ever will, and, unlike me, he actually LIKES THEM)
again... i still don't see how this ENTIRE effing thread has been HIJACKED with talk about horns when i asked about RIBBON TWEETERS! (which, BTW, at 95dB or more also happen to be HIGH EFFICIENCY, and this isn't the "if you don't like horn tweeters, you suck STFU forum, is it?)
My view of a horn system's strengths and weaknesses has not changed much since the Trio Compact days. Oh, I've certainly heard great-sounding horn systems at various trade shows, including several in Munich just a few months ago. (And once again I'm not denying the unique virtues of horn-loaded drivers.) But I've also invariably heard traces of the "cupped hands" colorations and driver-to-driver incoherence that eventually wore me down and out when I owned the original Avantgardes. (I guess I should also note that because of the various phase, time, and frequency-response issues I've already mentioned and the sheer aggregate size of their wavelaunch, horn loudspeakers don't image with great precision— nor, since they don't disperse their sound hemispherically the way point-source direct-radiators do, do they typically soundstage "outside the box." Although the severity of these problems depends on the design of the horn and the level it is played at, certain horns can be as much the poster children for "six-foot-wide" voices and violins and guitars as vintage planars were.
Jonathan Valin (who has a LOT more experience with horns than i ever will, and, unlike me, he actually LIKES THEM)
again... i still don't see how this ENTIRE effing thread has been HIJACKED with talk about horns when i asked about RIBBON TWEETERS! (which, BTW, at 95dB or more also happen to be HIGH EFFICIENCY, and this isn't the "if you don't like horn tweeters, you suck STFU forum, is it?)
Post a Followup:
FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: