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In Reply to: Re: Misc observations posted by Rich H on September 19, 2001 at 15:49:46:
The only thing left is the single pole crossovers. You said you heard other speakers that also got instruments right. Where these single pole crossovers too? If not we seem to be back where we started...If you wish, I would appreciate it if you would email me the name of that mega speaker. I am really curious. I won't divulge its idenity.
Follow Ups:
Brian,I have heard other loudspeakers that I felt portrayed instrumental timbres in a fundamentally correct way (nothing I've heard is perfect). And several of these used high-order crossovers. The Hales
Transcendence series (before they went under) amazed me. Paul Hales' first design goal was always correct timbre, and it was his view that high order crossovers achieved this more easily than low-order designs. I don't know that to be true, but I was amazed by the Transcendence 5/8s when I heard them. Excepting a *very* slight metallic aftertaste or glaze to the presentation, it was amazing how they managed to weave a sonic rainbow of correct sounding instruments. I confirmed their timbral authenticity at my own home, tested against my instruments and recordings.That said, I can't help but notice that virtually every phase/time aligned speaker design I've heard seems to make it to my list of "right" sounding speakers (and that, of course, is a very small number of manufacturers in the audio world).
When I listened to the Dunlavy Aletha a while back, I first listened to a track by saxophonist Joshua Redman. Normally as soon as I hear an instrument through a loudspeaker I quickly recognize that speaker's "take" on the sound - e.g. how it colors the sound of a saxophone. Through the Alethas the sax played and, well, I was sort of baffled. All I could think of was: "sh*t that sounds like a real sax!" I was taken aback at how hard it was pin pointing coloration to the sound. The Alethas did much the same for many other instruments.
It's interesting that REG of TAS also lauded the Aletha for outstanding timbral accuracy, and he is self-admittedly "obsessive" about instrumental tone/timbre. Not saying the Dunlavy speakers must therefore be perfect, of course. But they have been impressive in my brief encounters with them. Which makes the Cantata a very tempting product, I must say. (Sounded excellent at the last CES).But, back to the question. The fact that high-order speakers have also sounded correct to me does perhaps put us back at square one. I'm intellectually attracted to the idea of pulse-coherence, but I refuse to be seduced by theory only. I'm holding out for some form of proof (personal or otherwise) that it is meaningful. I wonder: if we could make well controlled, direct comparisons would the phase/time coherent designs show any advantage? Hmmm....
Rich H.
(I'll try and email you about the "mega speaker").
I share your enthusium with Dunlavy's. I agree they are accurate. That is why many don't like them. They call them clinical, unforgiving, or harsh. Actually they are simply letting you know what your're feeding them, as they should. Sure I have listened to some poor recordings on my speaks and noticed the problems, but then I thought, hey, despite these problems with the recording, doesn't this song sound better then ever? Can't you hear more of the music? The answere is yes and I would rather hear all of a favorite song, warts and all.I went to the factory and listend to the Cantatas. A remarkable speaker no doubt. My speakers are even better though, the Dunlavy Millenniums. Please give these a listen. The bass is to die for, plus all that extreme timbre accuracy.
Rich,Re crossovers and rightness:
I'm running a 21 year old set of KEF 104aB speakers and things sound right, especially voices these days. That "rightness" also seems associated with a "matter of factness" that doesn't leap out and grab you, so it's easy to pass that kind of sound by but it really holds up for years and years.
I'm going to buy new speakers when I finish work some time in the next 10 months or so, and the ones that are really high on my list prior to starting serious auditioning are Vandersteen 2CE sigs. They strike me as having a similar sense of rightness to the KEFs, and also sound matter of fact.
The KEFs aren't phase coherent and I think they have 4th order crossovers so I'm in the same boat as you on the crossover question,
David Aiken
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