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In Reply to: Who owned Maggies and went back to non-planar drivers? posted by cfraser on March 23, 2001 at 02:31:07:
OK, the room is especially critical, and seems to be the most common reason so far for getting rid of Maggies. And then their large room-dominating size. But I noticed, once again, that nobody ever says anything really disparaging about Maggies. Makes a guy curious, because I haven't found anything "wrong" with them either, considering the limitation of their physical characteristics. I was planning on getting the 1.6's tomorrow anyway, but thought there might be some initially subtle characteristic that becomes really annoying over time that the inmates could alert me to pay attention to. To see if it might bother me too. I'm just not a very critical listener, and tend to just go for the overall listening sensation and experience.
Follow Ups:
Did you read my posts? I hinted at some of their problems. I don't like to put them down, because they are great speakers in many respects. But their problems are the following3.6
Very audible mismatch between the magnificent ribbon tweeter and the other to panels. Listen to a soprano climb up its range and you will hear it. The ribbon outclasses the rest of the speaker. In my house the speaker sways around alarmingly when I walk around the room. Its costs a fortune to upgrade the components, and a fortune in amplification.1.6
No true ribbon. Crossover is internal.All of them
Cheap components internally - wire, inductors, caps. Used to be prone to breakdown, I don't know about now. Fabrics are ugly, IMHO. Generally big and ugly. Require to pulled FAR away from back wall - REQUIRED. This is a problem in most listening environments. Since they are also very wide require a lot of distance around them, especially if you put wings on them (recommended tweak). Very picky about amplification - sorry Myles, if your listening. Maggies do NOT 'luv tubes'. I listened to others on this and regretted it. They require lots of current, high power, low output impedance and bi amplification, at least bi-wiring. Why does Jim Winey biamp with Brystan amps? At loud volumes they compress and distort, worse than many box speakers. Regarding soundstage, they both magnify performers (plane wave effect, I believe) yet place the musicans at a distance, like your sitting in middle or back seats. Very odd. They don't have the 'presence' that good boxes, and horns achieve.
The high power requirements place more importance and stress on all the rest of the components of the speaker. Worse, they are prone to getting burned out, requiring a fuse on each panel. High power, and prone to getting burned out, huh? I was always worried about ruining them with my OTL amp, which is why I sold the lot. Also, they all have weird, cheap binding posts.
Sorry about this if your a Maggie fan, this is all IMHO. I still like them in many ways, but as I say elsewhere - I wouldn't go back if you paid me.
Dan, are you telling us that while the 3.6 problem is having
a true ribbon, the 1.6 problem is not having it? :)come on.... BECAUSE the 1.6 does have a quasi ribbon, which
is implemented onto the SAME panel than the woofer wires, you
get an AMAZING, seamless integration between treble, mids and bass!!!
that's why 1.6 is sooooooooo good; if, in addition, you upgrade
its xover componentes (very easy, no technical knowledge needed),
or, still better, if you bypass them all by vertical biamping
then BINGO! you get impressive results, well beyond the stock 3.6
best, paco
Well, I guess its an advantage and a disadvantage! I wish I could hear a modified 1.6 - I'm sure its glorious. But a modified 3.6 must be better! even if you lose some from having three drivers as opposed to two.You bring up an interesting point - perhaps its better not to have a ribbon tweet at all, because of the mismatch with the rest of the speaker. I don't know.
I must admit that I've always found it hard to believe that a tweaked 1.6 could be better than a stock 3.6 though - but you may have a point.
My 3.6 still has the best bass I've ever heard - even if it lacks a bit of Oomph. I need a couple of bass panels to go with my horn, I wish Magnepan sold them separately.
Best Regards -Dan
But I posted this comment before you did! I want to hear for myself, over an extended period. All I've ever owned is box speakers. Circumstances allow me to experiment a bit now. I think I have an acceptable space and amplifier to see what 1.6's can do. I have lots of electronics, but had only one set of half-decent speakers. Because of my listening habits, this required me to set my better gear up in a very restricting space. I think the Maggies qualify as half-decent at this point, so having them allows me to rearrange my stuff in a more purpose-oriented way. For one thing, they made me get off my butt and set up a listening room. I am not in any speaker camp because I just don't have the experience.And as I mentioned, I want to get some horns too. The Oris is out of my price league. None of my local dealers sell horns, and none of the local dealers I frequent even sell any tube gear - no demand, they say (?). So, if you've tried any horns in the (very preferably) under $2k range, and found them not too bad, I'd be pleased to hear about it. So far, I've found The Horn (Listener mag), the Jericho, and the Heresy. I might be able to hear the Heresy locally. I'd really hate to buy a speaker without well hearing it first, but I might have to. Thanks, and I do appreciate your comments.
Forgot one important thing - their touted 'mellow' quality. Yes they are mellow, which is a coloration. You need bright amplification to offset that - I suppose thats one reason SS works well with them. But I didn't like that mellow quality - bored me eventually, and made me always searching for ways to add dynamics, and brightness, and reality. Also forgot they don't 'slam' very well, and have somewhat poor dynamic qualities. I ended up just listening to chamber music, as that was what that could do best (in my room, situation etc etc) IMHO ;) ;)Dan
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