Propeller Head Plaza

RE: I am convinced that is what is already happenning.

160.62.4.10

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"How in the bloody hell else you going to explain the recent resurgence in popularity of flea powered SET amps? Especially considering half the folks using this type of equipment are running those 8 foot tall ultra inefficient foil speakers. Seems like a not to much of a leap to get to the conclusion these folks like the sound of a soft limiting tube"

Interesting question: Now first I will tell you that the amps I am using manage 25 watts at 1% THD. Now given that it is the KIND of THD that at least the article I linked to says that distortion of even 5% is often not audible my guess is that I have well over 30 watts of "audible distortion" free sound.

The speakers I own are nearly 8 feet tall and have a sensitivity of 87db/watt. As a line source in a relatively small room there is maybe 3 or 4db drop from the speaker to the listener 3.5 meters away. Given these parameters and the fact that a stereo pair would give about 3db more output than a single 87db speaker we have the following outputs at the listening position:

87db = 1 watt
90db = 2 watts
93db = 4 watts
96db = 8 watts
99db = 16 watts
102db = 32 watts

So, it seems that I should be able to get approximately 100db at the listening position (not at the speaker) with these speakers. Seems to be enough for me, what about you? As my average listening levels are significantly lower than this doesn't seem to be much of an issue.

"Most distortion types will sound terrible in significant amounts"

Agreed but define "significant amounts". It turns out that the highly non-linearity of the systems means significant has drastically different thresholds depending on the type.

"With all due respect Morricab, the point of my posts was pretty much making fun of some folks around here who think this is some big new discovery...this is not exactly fresh news. Guitar players have known about bitchen tube distortion for decades. Hopefully though no one takes it personally since I'm just giving a hard time is all.
"

Well some of this has been known this is true but metrics to actually understand it beyond anecdotal evidence is new. Again, I have heard guitar amps with tubes and without and they actually sound much cleaner and clearer than SS guitar amps, especially when not being overdriven. This purity of tone is what attracts musicians and it strongly suggests LESS audible distortion even if the measureable amount is more. I am not quite sure why you want to give a hard time though, there is more than enough of that kind of behavior on this forum.

"I just haven't had it proved to me that there are desireable distortions that should be designed into the circuitry"

I don't think this is what is happening. I take the position that all distortion is bad but some kinds are much worse than others. Either its audible or its not and if its audible it is degrading the sound. This goes back again to the question of "significant amounts" and the answer seems to be "it depends".

"where I state my distortion comparison file listening preference, the no distortion reference file"

I agree with you again, however, there is not a real world device that fits this. So you have to pick the one doing the LEAST damage to the signal. By least damage I mean simply least audible damage. IMO, all distortion is damaging to sound but the degree to which it is damaging is highly non-linear.

"However I predict if I like it it will be running out of clipping on some really efficient speakers. I'd love to be proven wrong sometime if I ever met someone local with that special tube based system.

"

Do you listen so loud? I have had many people at my place come away impressed with the sound and finding it hard to believe that I don't need their 500 watt behemoths to drive my speakers to more than satsifactory levels for them and me. 100 db is more than enough for me.

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