Propeller Head Plaza

Touché. I'm just a little surprised at...

70.240.14.48

In Reply to: RE: "I guess nobody here... has AES membership." LOL! posted by clarkjohnsen on September 12, 2007 at 09:38:16

how hard everybody is focusing on the DBT itself, and not on the significant apology for SACD/DVD-A tacked on at the end of the article. That would only make sense to me if few people had actually read the paper.

I've listened to a few SACDs myself and found them mostly lacking in superiority to CD, but this paper is making me reevaluate that.

For Meyer to appear to be so focused on obtaining a null result - as JA and Todd allege - and then for him to backtrack and say that high rez *still* sounds better than CD, means to me that the BAS was not clearly on some sort of anti-audiophile or anti-high-res vendetta. Despite the shouting on this thread, they *were* trusting their ears on this one.

That said, the lack of detail on equipment used and test results is a damn shame.

Follow Ups:

I confess that I'm confused - E-Stat 15:53:34 09/13/07 (74)
- No contradiction, but I may have confused you - Axon 21:50:45 09/13/07 (72)
  - RE: No contradiction, but I may have confused you - Dan Banquer 06:45:22 09/14/07 (2)
    - RE: No contradiction, but I may have confused you - krabapple 09:36:17 09/20/07 (1)
      - RE: No contradiction, but I may have confused you - Dan Banquer 09:58:00 09/20/07 (0)
  - Convenient assumption - E-Stat 06:33:53 09/14/07 (51)
    - you got me. I need to retake logic 101. Round 3: - Axon 08:14:16 09/14/07 (50)
      - With any kind of test - E-Stat 08:36:48 09/14/07 (49)
        
        you're really struggling here - truthseekerprime 07:01:48 09/16/07 (48)
        
        "Demonstrated that FOR THE SAME RECORDING reducing the resolution did not have an audible effect." NO! - clarkjohnsen 10:49:26 09/17/07 (34)
        
        RE: That clears up a lot! - EBradMeyer 21:24:25 09/21/07 (33)
        
        "A CD would have sounded the same." Good to know, but bland assertions are not proof. Besides... - clarkjohnsen 08:42:46 09/22/07 (32)
        
        RE: "Memory Player that produces a sonic result superior to any other" - tlyyra 08:49:21 09/24/07 (0)
        
        RE: That clears up a lot! - EBradMeyer 07:01:54 09/23/07 (19)
        
        "I give you The Church of the Latter Day Saints." So that's what it's going to be, is it? - clarkjohnsen 08:54:32 09/24/07 (18)
        
        RE: "I give you The Church of the Latter Day Saints." So that's what it's going to be, is it? - EBradMeyer 14:18:08 09/24/07 (1)
        
        "The device we were using is a recording system, which passes a signal *through* it." Oh. - clarkjohnsen 10:13:34 09/25/07 (0)
        
        RE: "I give you The Church of the Latter Day Saints." So that's what it's going to be, is it? - EBradMeyer 13:53:30 09/24/07 (15)
        
        "It's not up to me to prove reviewers can't hear the huge differences." LOL! You made the assertion... - clarkjohnsen 09:59:20 09/25/07 (8)
        
        Still bullshitting? - tlyyra 10:21:25 09/26/07 (2)
        
        I be happy you continue to delude yourself. Couldn't happen to a more appropriate guy. - clarkjohnsen 11:22:48 09/28/07 (1)
        
        Done that - tlyyra 10:05:26 09/29/07 (0)
        
        RE: "It's not up to me, etc." - EBradMeyer 11:28:48 09/25/07 (4)
        
        "They're... way to risky for you." Oh geez, puh-leeze. - clarkjohnsen 09:16:22 09/26/07 (0)
        
        You're correct - it has been demonstrated. Don't bother arguing with him; it's an utter waste of time. /nt - truthseekerprime 20:01:22 09/25/07 (2)
        
        "It has been demonstrated" all right... that it's "a crock". That's if you pay any attention to... - clarkjohnsen 09:24:08 09/26/07 (0)
        
        RE: You're correct etc. - EBradMeyer 07:32:26 09/26/07 (0)
        
        Complettely OT - ABXing absolute polarity - Axon 22:32:57 09/24/07 (5)
        
        RE: Complettely OT - ABXing absolute polarity - EBradMeyer 01:33:16 09/25/07 (4)
        
        You underestimate the thickness of my skull - Axon 05:52:32 09/25/07 (3)
        
        RE: You underestimate the thickness of my skull - EBradMeyer 11:33:53 09/25/07 (2)
        
        No pain, no gain! - Axon 16:54:20 09/26/07 (1)
        
        RE: No pain, no gain! - EBradMeyer 07:40:47 09/27/07 (0)
        
        RE: "A CD would have sounded the same." Good to know, but bland assertions are not proof. Besides... - krabapple 16:24:39 09/22/07 (1)
        
        AA posts as "uncontradicted evidence" - tlyyra 03:30:22 09/23/07 (0)
        
        You're right Clark, but that's not the point. - rick_m 12:34:04 09/22/07 (8)
        
        Thank you. But even "going astray", while that does happen, is not the core of my argument. - clarkjohnsen 11:09:23 09/23/07 (7)
        
        RE: Thank you. But even "going astray", while that does happen, is not the core of my argument. - rick_m 13:09:12 09/23/07 (6)
        
        "They have eliminated [CD playback] as a variable," True; but then they try to tell us... - clarkjohnsen 08:26:14 09/24/07 (5)
        
        Having now read it... - rick_m 09:07:04 09/25/07 (1)
        
        "I wasn't missing much." Indeed not. Yet I got challenged for calling it a quick read! nt - clarkjohnsen 10:02:59 09/25/07 (0)
        
        OK,Ok,ok - rick_m 09:14:13 09/24/07 (2)
        
        This URL may get you to it. - clarkjohnsen 09:33:57 09/24/07 (1)
        
        Excellent, thanks! nt - rick_m 09:46:55 09/24/07 (0)
        
        Struggling for what? - E-Stat 09:11:00 09/16/07 (12)
        
        (See my post above.) nt - clarkjohnsen 10:50:12 09/17/07 (0)
        
        I guess basic reading comprehension - truthseekerprime 13:19:50 09/16/07 (10)
        
        So, professor - E-Stat 17:56:52 09/16/07 (9)
        
        "Our test results indicate that all of these recordings could be released on conventional CDs... - truthseekerprime 20:28:50 09/16/07 (8)
        
        Anecdotally, I think it may be true. - rick_m 10:17:47 09/20/07 (0)
        
        As have I - E-Stat 21:23:00 09/16/07 (6)
        
        RE: As have I - krabapple 09:43:44 09/20/07 (5)
        
        The common term for your explanation - E-Stat 09:56:29 09/20/07 (4)
        
        RE: The common term for your explanation - krabapple 16:19:26 09/22/07 (1)
        
        There is a difference - E-Stat 09:01:51 09/23/07 (0)
        
        A whole lot o' speculatin' goin' on in the paper too. nt - clarkjohnsen 09:05:42 09/22/07 (1)
        
        In stark contrast to your pamphlet that was so convincingly argued that you had to pay for it to get printed? - tlyyra 03:33:55 09/23/07 (0)
  - Hmmm, that's certainly an illogical conclusion - Ted Smith 22:08:08 09/13/07 (16)
    - Provably wrong - Axon 08:05:00 09/14/07 (15)
      - Baloney - Ted Smith 08:45:36 09/14/07 (14)
        
        RE: Baloney - krabapple 09:57:13 09/20/07 (10)
        
        RE: Baloney - Ted Smith 11:17:21 09/20/07 (9)
        
        RE: Baloney - krabapple 16:28:51 09/22/07 (1)
        
        Yep, Why haven't you addressed any of the points in my posts? - Ted Smith 16:36:19 09/22/07 (0)
        
        So... your opinion on the JAES paper is...? nt - clarkjohnsen 09:07:52 09/22/07 (6)
        
        A crock? - Ted Smith 10:47:03 09/22/07 (5)
        
        "It shows an unbelievable degree of unsophistication." Oh I believe it all right! - clarkjohnsen 08:37:07 09/24/07 (0)
        
        So you read the article, then? - tlyyra 14:09:42 09/22/07 (3)
        
        I do believe in good science and enjoy the result of the same (including DSD) - Ted Smith 14:56:04 09/22/07 (2)
        
        Can you believe that guy? "Maybe I read too much into your CV." - clarkjohnsen 10:22:39 09/23/07 (1)
        
        RE: Can you believe that guy? "Maybe I read too much into your CV." - Ted Smith 16:55:34 09/23/07 (0)
        
        I'll admit I don't have enough experience with SACD/DVD-A... - Axon 12:08:52 09/14/07 (2)
        
        RE: I'll admit I don't have enough experience with SACD/DVD-A... - krabapple 10:02:47 09/20/07 (0)
        
        RE: I'll admit I don't have enough experience with SACD/DVD-A... - Ted Smith 13:46:35 09/14/07 (0)
- Perhaps a key element of the test wasn't disclosed. - Bruce Kendall 16:00:11 09/13/07 (0)
Right. I'm not concerned about the DBT aspect, rather the really sloppy experimental procedures... - clarkjohnsen 12:07:29 09/13/07 (12)
- Yeah, I've read it. - Axon 12:36:04 09/13/07 (11)
  - Your observations are mostly well-taken. Still I have concerns. - clarkjohnsen 08:22:26 09/14/07 (10)
    - RE: That clears up a lot! - EBradMeyer 10:19:54 09/23/07 (0)
    - RE: "what the equipment was, esp. the speakers" - tlyyra 09:36:57 09/14/07 (8)
      - Are you involved in some sort of contest or something? - Bruce Kendall 12:10:19 09/14/07 (3)
        
        He's a bitter man, a bully, and an unworthy opponent -- misrepresentation is his only game. nt - clarkjohnsen 09:22:32 09/15/07 (1)
        
        Speaking of bitterness - tlyyra 12:23:57 09/15/07 (0)
        
        ??? - tlyyra 04:23:52 09/15/07 (0)
      - Frankly, My dear... - bjh 10:55:46 09/14/07 (3)
        
        RE: Frankly, My dear... - tlyyra 11:56:44 09/14/07 (2)
        
        Toots a simple, "No, I don't want to comment" would have been entirely sufficient. - bjh 12:36:05 09/14/07 (1)
        
        Sorry if it was too complicated - tlyyra 04:48:17 09/15/07 (0)

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