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Re: What do you listen for?

Jim,

Thanks I appreciate your candor. FYI Jump In The Water is an extremely difficult CD to locate. I've always been happy with my purchases of used CDs on Amazon, so I recommend you buy one of their "like new" copies for $.01. With shipping it will probably be less that $3.00

To be honest with you Jim at one time I didn't even realize there were objectivists & subjectivists. Many years ago when I first started getting serious about audio I believed wires couldn't possibly make a difference. I also believed tubed equipment was an obsolete technology. Yet at the same time I heard differences in amps and preamps etc. I guess I was an objectivist who demanded proof that wires effected the sound or that tubed amps weren't obsolete and easily bettered by solid state amps, but I listened subjectively or however you'd classify one with the beliefs I had at that time. I was quite taken aback when I joined the Asylum and felt animosity expressed by objectivists towards anyone who listened subjectively. Up till then in all my experience I had never met anyone who didn't believe audio components couldn't or shouldn't sound differently but I digress.

Getting back to when I listen for differences between components. When I first detected differences in the sound of the 2 drumsticks struck together I attempted to determine which I believed was the most realistic replication. When I made my choice later that same day I actually went and bought a pair of drumsticks to hit together and compare. IMHO what I selected as being the more accurate replication was indeed just that. What really surprised me is just how dynamically limited most audio systems are! I needed to hit the sticks quite a bit less hard than the drummer on Aja or else it was too damn loud.

Jim you mentioned when you attempted to detect differences in two IC's you were wrong both times. It's my contention that when people test to hear differences they listen to way too much info. Testing one's hearing acuity & listening to music are two completely different functions. Hence they need to be done completely differently. Try doing what I did concentrate on something simple like the drumsticks in the end of Aja being hit together. You want to listen for about 30 secs when testing, it way to easy to overload yourself with too much info. I honestly believe, and I AM NOT trying to toot my own horn, that I can teach ANYONE who doesn't have a hearing disability, and who truly wants to learn, how to differentiate between audio components withing an hour or so.

In any event these days I'm a subjectivist who believes there should be a measureable reason for everything we hear. The main problem I have with objectivists, at least the vocal objectivists here on PHP, is that they believe todays measurements are sufficient and complete within themselves. Then in order to make their religous dogma work they need to come up with statements like this idiotic remark from Peter Aczel "...a "properly designed" amplifier has no sound of its own." Thus following their belief if an amp does indeed sound different that simply means it's not "properly designed"! I often wonder how they'd react if an amp was reviewed by Aczel that sounded completely different from all his previously accepted "properly designed" amps. Being that this new amp sounded different from all Peter's previously accepted "properly designed" amps would mean it couldn't possibly be a "properly designed" amp. But what if this new not "properly designed" amp sounded almost indistinguishable from live music? Would they still reject it as being not being "properly designed"? That would be an interesting dilemma no?

The reality is today's accepted audio measurements do not correlate sufficinetly enough with what we hear! That belief on my part doesn't mean I think all measurements are useless as more than one objectivist here has suggested. Rather it means I realize that scientists and audio manufacturers haven't yet discovered exactly what traits in live music the human ear/brain uses to determine it is live music and not recorded. Once these measurements are discovered and implemented, we'll close the gap between all subjectivists and objectivists who honestly want to know the truth about whats happening in audio. Unfortunately those who simply want to be correct at all costs will find someway to claim these new measurements are bogus or wrong...

Thetubeguy1954

"If you thought that science was certain - well, that is just an error on your part.” Richard Feynman theoretical physicist, 1918-1988


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  • Re: What do you listen for? - thetubeguy1954 09:12:47 03/27/07 (0)


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