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In Reply to: frequency response curve posted by tmsorosk on August 15, 2012 at 17:28:37:
I think Tony's point is that frequency response depends on the entire chain, from microphone location to the listener's seat. If recordings were neutral and listening rooms were neutral, this wouldn't be an issue -- the speaker that had ruler-flat frequency response and perfect polar response would sound neutral. But in practice this doesn't happen, for many reasons. Even a good two-channel cardioid recording made in a good concert hall requires a playback target curve with a 2-6 dB downslope, largely I think because the microphones capture too much of the direct sound and not enough of the hall ambiance, with its attenuated highs. To make matters worse, this isn't true of small ensemble works recorded in small spaces. It becomes impossible to make a speaker "right." J. Gordon Holt wrote some excellent articles on this that are up on the Stereophile site.
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Follow Ups Full ThreadTopic - Thin-skinned Art Dudley - the old school 22:33:51 08/11/12 (118)
- Yes but - kev313 09:49:14 08/15/12 (1)
- RE: Yes but - the old school 11:08:33 08/15/12 (0)
- John Atkinson: looks like Art needs a raise. Lol! - Plinko 20:11:42 08/14/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - Inmate51 20:07:54 08/14/12 (9)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - John Atkinson 07:22:39 08/15/12 (8)
- RE: Art Dudley - Telynau 16:46:57 08/17/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - Alan Sircom 16:27:02 08/17/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - Inmate51 08:05:32 08/15/12 (5)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - John Atkinson 10:24:45 08/15/12 (4)
- Setright wrote about audio too - Rob Doorack 08:37:58 08/17/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - Inmate51 13:12:50 08/15/12 (2)
- I still miss... - Jim Austin 06:54:48 08/17/12 (1)
- RE: I still miss... - Inmate51 07:41:34 08/17/12 (0)
- I thought it was one of his best articles. NT - billsfan62 17:51:33 08/14/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - RC Daniel 03:03:11 08/14/12 (0)
- Art Dudley has good ears - it's the half deaf who need measurements... - RGA 21:48:16 08/13/12 (2)
- RE: Art Dudley has good ears - it's the half deaf who need measurements... - the old school 09:44:29 08/14/12 (1)
- RE: Art Dudley has good ears - it's the half deaf who need measurements... - RGA 13:06:49 08/14/12 (0)
- I'm with Art - lokie 05:32:41 08/13/12 (3)
- RE: I'm with Art - josh358 17:16:38 08/13/12 (2)
- RE: I'm with Art - the old school 09:51:47 08/14/12 (1)
- RE: I'm with Art - josh358 10:09:07 08/14/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - Vinyljh 05:03:58 08/13/12 (0)
- Grow up! - stereo5 21:33:50 08/12/12 (0)
- Who is thin skinned? - mkuller 20:11:35 08/12/12 (3)
- RE: Who is thin skinned? - the old school 10:09:53 08/13/12 (2)
- Wrong! - RGA 15:03:20 08/14/12 (0)
- It is not "just" personal preferences - Frihed89 21:34:14 08/13/12 (0)
- RE: All I know - Gregg 15:04:07 08/12/12 (1)
- RE: All I know - RC Daniel 03:22:30 08/14/12 (0)
- You seem to have an ax to grind with Art. It's fine - BillyBenBilly 13:36:59 08/12/12 (0)
- "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Analog Scott 11:33:49 08/12/12 (20)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Tony Lauck 11:10:32 08/13/12 (8)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - John Atkinson 14:20:20 08/16/12 (3)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Analog Scott 21:40:15 08/16/12 (0)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Inmate51 16:20:51 08/16/12 (0)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Tony Lauck 14:55:17 08/16/12 (0)
- "There is no such thing as "truth to the source" - Analog Scott 10:05:19 08/14/12 (1)
- RE: "There is no such thing as "truth to the source" - Tony Lauck 10:14:38 08/14/12 (0)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - andy_c 21:29:20 08/13/12 (1)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Tony Lauck 08:20:43 08/14/12 (0)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - the old school 10:14:32 08/13/12 (10)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - josh358 17:06:14 08/13/12 (9)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - the old school 21:08:22 08/13/12 (8)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - josh358 06:36:01 08/14/12 (7)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - the old school 10:01:07 08/14/12 (4)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - josh358 10:48:42 08/14/12 (3)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - the old school 11:47:07 08/15/12 (2)
- It might be instructive... - RC Daniel 00:28:51 08/17/12 (1)
- RE: It might be instructive... - the old school 10:34:02 08/17/12 (0)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - Tony Lauck 10:00:29 08/14/12 (1)
- RE: "truth to the sources or to TAS" - josh358 10:35:14 08/14/12 (0)
- Neutrality is a fiction. nt - viridian 08:01:57 08/12/12 (47)
- Correction: Strict neutrality is a fiction - plantsman 09:42:51 08/12/12 (46)
- Relative neutrality is patently absurd....... - viridian 13:45:39 08/12/12 (45)
- Allow me to simplify this for you - plantsman 14:37:30 08/12/12 (44)
- "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - Joe Roberts 15:52:40 08/12/12 (43)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - josh358 16:02:39 08/17/12 (2)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - Joe Roberts 16:19:53 08/19/12 (1)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - josh358 18:27:12 08/19/12 (0)
- Please DO get started on transparency. - Dave Pogue 05:19:24 08/13/12 (12)
- RE: Please DO get started on transparency. - bjh 13:56:54 08/13/12 (11)
- That's the conventional "wisdom" all right. - Dave Pogue 14:44:29 08/13/12 (10)
- It is obvious all right. - carcass93 09:43:56 08/14/12 (9)
- RE: It is obvious all right. - Tony Lauck 09:46:33 08/14/12 (8)
- Stepped attenuator, which is VC on the passive pre. - carcass93 10:31:20 08/14/12 (7)
- RE: Stepped attenuator, which is VC on the passive pre. - Tony Lauck 10:40:17 08/14/12 (6)
- Yes, selecting taps on the transformer(s) - link inside. - carcass93 10:50:40 08/14/12 (5)
- RE: Yes, selecting taps on the transformer(s) - link inside. - bjh 11:37:17 08/14/12 (4)
- Is it an ultimate preamp? Of course not. - carcass93 11:52:21 08/14/12 (3)
- RE: Is it an ultimate preamp? Of course not. - bjh 14:43:00 08/14/12 (2)
- Next time... - carcass93 16:13:29 08/14/12 (1)
- Owwww ... Ok tough guy LOL nt - bjh 16:24:11 08/14/12 (0)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - Frihed89 23:40:58 08/12/12 (3)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - josh358 11:30:20 08/18/12 (0)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - Joe Roberts 06:20:44 08/13/12 (1)
- Yup, absolutely see my posts here at AA about 'Objectivity' - Timbo in Oz 01:32:03 08/17/12 (0)
- Great, propose an alternate model - plantsman 17:09:56 08/12/12 (20)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - the old school 10:23:22 08/13/12 (0)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - Joe Roberts 20:18:06 08/12/12 (18)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - josh358 16:17:45 08/17/12 (0)
- Exactly Joe, "neutrality" is a fiction that the insecure use to justify their buying decisions. nt - viridian 08:55:02 08/13/12 (6)
- RE: Exactly Joe, "neutrality" is a fiction that the insecure use to justify their buying decisions. nt - Joe Roberts 10:12:58 08/13/12 (5)
- RE: Exactly Joe, "neutrality" is a fiction that the insecure use to justify their buying decisions. nt - josh358 16:21:43 08/17/12 (4)
- RE: Exactly Joe, "neutrality" is a fiction that the insecure use to justify their buying decisions. nt - Joe Roberts 16:13:12 08/19/12 (1)
- Much here, but - josh358 18:01:21 08/19/12 (0)
- RE: Exactly Joe, "neutrality" is a fiction that the insecure use to justify their buying decisions. nt - the old school 11:03:11 08/18/12 (1)
- RE: Exactly Joe, "neutrality" is a fiction that the insecure use to justify their buying decisions. nt - josh358 11:16:59 08/18/12 (0)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - rdf 08:50:54 08/13/12 (4)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - Joe Roberts 10:08:42 08/13/12 (3)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - rdf 18:18:25 08/13/12 (2)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - Tony Lauck 09:45:06 08/14/12 (1)
- RE: Great, propose an alternate model - josh358 16:26:05 08/17/12 (0)
- Signifying what? - plantsman 02:16:13 08/13/12 (4)
- RE: Signifying what? - Joe Roberts 06:47:29 08/13/12 (3)
- RE: Signifying what? - josh358 16:32:03 08/17/12 (0)
- Don't neglect instinct ... - bjh 12:48:55 08/13/12 (1)
- RE: Don't neglect instinct ... - Joe Roberts 18:30:56 08/13/12 (0)
- RE: "Neutral" --Another bogus metaphor - pdownard@fasken.com 16:08:23 08/12/12 (1)
- '... I lose the plot completely with "continuousness"' - Metralla 18:07:25 08/12/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - fstein 07:20:21 08/12/12 (1)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - tmsorosk 08:38:04 08/12/12 (0)
- Is This Rant In Response To ..... - abs1 06:52:48 08/12/12 (0)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - tmsorosk 05:54:59 08/12/12 (9)
- RE: Thin-skinned Art Dudley - the old school 10:11:40 08/12/12 (8)
- Accuracy - tmsorosk 10:35:52 08/12/12 (7)
- ? - josh358 18:06:09 08/14/12 (6)
- RE: ? - tmsorosk 21:06:51 08/14/12 (5)
- RE: ? - Tony Lauck 10:16:27 08/15/12 (3)
- frequency response curve - tmsorosk 17:28:37 08/15/12 (2)
- RE: frequency response curve - josh358 11:38:13 08/18/12 (0)
- RE: frequency response curve - Tony Lauck 18:04:03 08/15/12 (0)
- RE: ? - josh358 04:25:51 08/15/12 (0)
- You conveniently forgot to mention... - Frihed89 02:13:36 08/12/12 (4)
- RE: You conveniently forgot to mention... - the old school 10:26:21 08/12/12 (0)
- RE: You conveniently forgot to mention... - geraldm121 05:16:07 08/12/12 (2)
- The Devore Orangutan costs - Frihed89 23:42:14 08/12/12 (1)
- RE: The Devore Orangutan costs - the old school 10:33:54 08/13/12 (0)
Follow Ups
- RE: frequency response curve - josh358 11:38:13 08/18/12 (0)
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