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Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs

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Posted on November 8, 2009 at 10:01:38
Monchi
Audiophile

Posts: 265
Location: Cork, Ireland
Joined: June 4, 2007
 I just wondered if anybody here has any experience with 'fixing' warped or misshaped LPs that are like that due to a pressing defect?

My copy of the MoFi 2LP set by Alison Krauss & Union Station 'So Long So Wrong' is a case in point. Disc 2 is warped/misshaped/uneven, not at the sides but towards the centre of the disc which makes it plain ugly to watch on my SME 20 and my Skala looks like something that is riding white water rapids as opposed to a record surface. It's best described as uneven or lumpy even. The disc will play. Disc 1 is fine. That is the way Disc 2 was when I bought it.

If I were to put this disc between 2 thick sheets of glass , say for about a year or so, under pressure by putting something very weighty on top of the glass, is it possible that this disc will flatten out?

I have a few more LPs that I may have to do something like this with as everything else has failed .. even the Axiss Disc Flatter device which is not designed to fix these types of problems anyway.
RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs - cooling is important too, posted on November 9, 2009 at 04:54:00
ianm0
Audiophile

Posts: 88
Location: AU
Joined: June 1, 2006
 It has repeated by many that putting the LP between two glass blocks under the sun will flatten warped records. Actually it is important that the LP should be cooled under load as well. I leave the LP in the sun for 20 minutes and then bring it indoor to cool for an hour or two before removing the weight on top of it. That works nicely. Times cited are quite arbitrary.

If you don't have heavy glass blocks, use the glass top of your garden table.

RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 8, 2009 at 11:28:43
HI FI BOB
Audiophile

Posts: 155
Location: NE. USA
Joined: December 9, 2004
 Many years ago I bought King Crimson's Lizard lp.It had a nasty edge
warp.Not enough to send the stylus airborne but it did get woofers flap-ping.So,I simply shoved the album in between some tightly packed lps,which meaning vertical storage of course.After less than a month,the warp was noticebly lessened,if not entirely so.
No longer had a problem with flapping woofs.I have tried this with dish
warpage.Sometimes it works.

RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 8, 2009 at 10:39:11
cactuscowboy@bresnan.net
Audiophile

Posts: 2879
Location: Powell, Wyoming
Joined: July 23, 2007
 I've had mixed success with placing mildly warped LPs between sheets of 1/4" glass and leaving it in the hot sun for an hour or so. Don't expect miracles. At best you'll take a barely playable disc and make it playable.

I've experimented with the oven and a drymount press, with mixed results and usually disappointing results. If you use the oven, be careful. There's a fine line between flattening a record and melting the grooves. Start at about 130F and work up from there.

If you've got a bad edge warp that causes the stylus to launch, yes the record can be flattened, but you'll also 'push out' the vinyl in the process. So, although the record is now flat, you've got a vicious flaw that will launch the stylus sideways out of the groove.

If your record plays OK without audible flaw (that's how I read it), then I'd suggest leaving it alone.

Totally agreed..., posted on November 10, 2009 at 19:26:25
DanWKW
Audiophile

Posts: 458
Location: Hong Kong
Joined: June 17, 2009
 These diy flattening process has to be experimented and may put your records at the risk of totally unplayable. Not to mention that I don't believe it can do anything for uneven thickness of record which has been caused during the faulty lacquer pressing and cooling processes.

If you record could be played with no audible flaws, leave it alone:)


Good luck, buddy.
Dan







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RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 8, 2009 at 11:02:50
Monchi
Audiophile

Posts: 265
Location: Cork, Ireland
Joined: June 4, 2007
 There would be no question of using heat. I would hope that the pressure exerted on the disc over a long period (1 year maybe?) would do the trick. Vinyl has a 'memory' so over the period it may just take a new shape, i.e. flat.

The limitations of the professional disc flatters is that they deal with edge warps only and cannot tackle warping farther in on the record. There is a Mark 2 model in Japan that may just address this, but the available translations I have seen so far have been inadequate.

RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 8, 2009 at 13:09:34
Ian L
Audiophile

Posts: 1208
Joined: July 5, 2002
Contributor
  Since: September 11, 2008
 I was just wondering about the memory elasticity thing. A few days ago I opened a reissue of Everybody digs Bill Evans and it had a bump high enough to make me stand and wait as the first few revs played, thinking that it might flip the arm up. It didn't and so I listened to the side as I got ready for work. When I left I switched everything off in a hurry leaving the disc on the platter and I forgot about it until the next morning. When I went to take it off, the bump was gone. It was then I remembered the shrink wrap on the unopened cover had been really tight, pulling one corner over and dishing the whole thing. Amazing that it moved so quickly when released. It makes me wonder if you just left a warped record, laying it flat on a flat surface in a warm room, for a longer period of time whether it would take care of itself. Probably depends on the conditions that warped it in the first place I guess. If it was warped by heat it likely wouldn't go anywhere.

RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 10, 2009 at 22:20:04
littlebobby
Audiophile

Posts: 253
Location: Dallas
Joined: November 28, 2008
 I think your example might have been a case of a record that was in bending rather than warped. Its memory was probably still of a flat shape. A warp aided by heat would move molecules around while bending might not.

RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 8, 2009 at 14:00:04
Monchi
Audiophile

Posts: 265
Location: Cork, Ireland
Joined: June 4, 2007
 Shrink wrapping is a major cause of warpage in my experience, although some here will disagree. Great, that your record came back to normal shape so quickly! I think heat damage is terminal for LP records. Some members here flatten problem discs under controlled conditions but it needs care .. and experience.

If vinyl has a memory and it is stored under pressure such that it is flat for a long period, then it may just remain flat when removed. I think what you say is right though, in that what caused the problem in the first place is important. I would really love to get that Alison Krauss disc flat if that proves possible. I think that the problem emanates from a pressing defect rather than storage or heat.

RE: Fixing Warped/Misshaped LPs, posted on November 8, 2009 at 18:05:35
Ian L
Audiophile

Posts: 1208
Joined: July 5, 2002
Contributor
  Since: September 11, 2008
 "I think that the problem emanates from a pressing defect rather than storage or heat."

I've bought a couple of discs from a local seller that were bad from the factory and when I told them about it they said "Gee, that's the first time anybody's ever complained about discs from THEM.", as if I was simply mistaken. They had no notion whatsoever of returning the disc. Their stance was sort of "Wow man, bummer . . . . oh well better luck next time".
It's not so long ago that if you took a bad pressing back the store would give you a new one without a second thought. It's probably because people aren't familiar enough with the medium to know how common a mispress can be. I wonder what would happen if you called Mobile Fidelity.

A seller should know his product, posted on November 10, 2009 at 12:32:42
beach cruiser
Audiophile

Posts: 2605
Location: so cal
Joined: September 24, 2003
 Some records are warped. they come defective from the warehouse, nobody is surprised at this.

Sounds like you are dealing with some slack jawed low skills guy who wouldn't do anything for the customer because they can barely function at their primary position and a customer problem is too advanced for them to handle, from lack of effort, or, lack of pay. (Lack of pay was the problem for me in Florida. No counter person made more than minimum, so extra effort was largely unknown, it lead to nowhere, no raise, no promotions, so, no effort. Glad I'm out of there. )

Perhaps if you dealt with someone at the shop with the power to refund the sale, say a manager you might get results. I never had any problems from any record shop with reasonable satisfaction after the sale.

It's the same deal with any defective product. The product is supposed to represent the value you paid for the produc. A warped record has less value than what was agreed to at the time of sale. It is assumed it is a normal record when priced and sold. Spoiled milk, a radio that doesn't play, any defective new product all go back for an exchange, or refund if no other copies of the record are in the store.

If your retailer insists that you keep defective product find another store. At higher price points, the D. A. office could be called, it's called customer fraud, and people get in trouble.

When I worked at Circuit City, they were under D.A. probation for customer abuse the entire time I was there, from various DA 's around the country. I would think a less lawyered up store would consider better policies if called about fraud from the local civic attorney's office.

Some people call the cops right from the store. I wouldn't. I would carefully explain my compliant, avoiding any argument, just presenting only the facts. If the store fails to satisfy my concerns, I walk. IF enough money is in dispute to make it worth my time, I would fight.
The laws consider the seller a knowledgeable professional, so gives the consumer all the breaks.

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