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GE 5751 Triple Mica Gray Plate - Surprise, Surprise!

108.18.182.44
Posted on February 26, 2011 at 13:28:35
45RPM@60Hz
Audiophile

Posts: 11
Location: East Coast
Joined: January 1, 2011
 I have read a few posts stating the 5751 tube does not have for what it's worth a haze or slight grain that some 12AX7s have. One of the drawbacks was losing a bit of gain, but you get a lowered noise floor, leading to better extension, dynamics and micro details. Being the curious type, I decided to try a set. I purchased a set of NOS GE 5751 triple mica gray plates - 1955.

I am using phono grade Telefunkens in my line stage and phono grade Amperex BBs in my phono stage (C2300). In my system the Tellies have always been a tad dark, just the slightest; sort of a looking out of a window with a screen in it, with your face pressed against the screen trying to see what is to your left and right, your field of vision is somewhat diminished.

I replaced the Tellies with the 5751's and the screen was removed, I was able to stick my head out of the window and clearly see to the left and right. My system just seemed to fully open up with astonishing clarity. Has anyone else had this experience? Based on the price I paid, this tube appears to be underrated. I am not saying the GE 5751s are a better tube than the Tellies, just better in my system.

45

 

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RE: GE 5751 Triple Mica Gray Plate - Surprise, Surprise!, posted on February 26, 2011 at 17:26:17
Aldovan


 
This tube have a fine sound, but the RCA and Sylvanias black plates are best, in my modest opinion.

Aldovan

 

5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 26, 2011 at 17:40:12
Interstage Tranny
Audiophile

Posts: 3063
Location: Eastern
Joined: October 4, 2006
 In some circuits, you will favor either version or one over the other. Clearly, this is the subjective factor. While the popularity of black plates is well documented, many peers choose the gray plates again and again.

In my listening trials, I rarely prefer the black plate over similar gray plates. My preference is depth and mellow sound over the usual forward and colder sounding black plates. Again, though, many folks love that forward sound; especially guitar players and listeners pretending to be onstage with the musicians. As a theater sound engineer in my previous life(LOL), I see the speakers as the front of the stage; thus I crave the sound to "appear" more behind the speakers. The search for our favorite illusion of reality continues...

 

RE: GE 5751 Triple Mica Gray Plate - Surprise, Surprise!, posted on February 26, 2011 at 17:58:13
Neff


 
Tube are fun to audition.

 

RE: GE 5751 Triple Mica Gray Plate - Surprise, Surprise!, posted on February 26, 2011 at 18:15:38
Mendel
Audiophile

Posts: 1207
Location: GTA
Joined: January 17, 2009
 I for one am not surprised. Enjoy your 5751s.

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 26, 2011 at 18:34:19
posbwp55@msn.com
Audiophile

Posts: 294
Location: DC
Joined: June 4, 2006
 Thanks for that sonic comparison (black plate vs gray plate). It is why I read the posts and rarely find. I have loads of Syl, GE, RCA and RAY blackplates (all triple mica, are the double mica in the same league?).
More comments on the sonic characteristics (I know it is system dependent) would be welcome. Although it is system dependent, when comparing tubes in the same system you can get a good idea of how they differ.

Bart

 

RE: GE 5751 Triple Mica Gray Plate - Surprise, Surprise!, posted on February 26, 2011 at 18:46:58
FenderLover
 I don't recall ever hearing a unit where the TFK ECC83 gave a "veiled" or unclear tone. Interesting. In general (and that's a very liberal use of general), TFK that I've used seem to have very good clarity maybe at the expense of bass. The 5751 forte is its midrange and bass. Just my experience.

So much of a tube's tone is dependent on the parameters of the circuit. For your system, the 5751 & circuit's syngery are favored by your setup. And the hands of the Great Audio Gods! 8^)

FWIW: My favorite 5751 is the black plate, windmill getter Raytheon's. They can actual generate their own power, if the breeze is strong enough! The first "green" tube [ok maybe not]. TungSol ain't bad either. I bet the NOS cost is somewhere around the GNP of some countries on this planet.

Enjoy those tubes. 5751 can last forever and ever.

 

Likely GE JG5751, posted on February 26, 2011 at 18:52:38
Jon L
Audiophile

Posts: 6065
Joined: April 6, 2000
 which is a nice tube. In certain instances, I do prefer it to the GE black plates.

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 26, 2011 at 20:34:44
45RPM@60Hz
Audiophile

Posts: 11
Location: East Coast
Joined: January 1, 2011
 My system is as follows:
VPI Scoutmaster w/SDS, Periphery Ring,Record Clamp and Gingko Cloud 11 Iso-platform
Dynavector XX2 MKII cart w/Bob's Devices SUT
McIntosh C2300 pre with MC275 amp
Harbeth Super HL5 30th Annv. Edition
Interconnects: Zentara
Speaker Cables: DH Labs Silver Sonic Q-10 Signature

In terms of the sound, the GE's really opened up my system, bloom if you will; there was amazing clarity and weight to the music you could feel. Bass had more layers, depth and texture, the sound-stage widened about 2' and had more depth. Imaging was pinpoint, no blurring of instruments, There was more extension in the treble and piano decay went on and on. Mids were glorious, Satchmo's voice never sounded better, you noticed every fluctuation and waver as if you were there in the first row. Micro dynamics were easier to hear, effortless comes to mind. All instruments seemed realistic, there was this amazing tonality across the board.

You could almost taste the wood from the bass clarinet, the thwack of a drum stick hitting the side of a drum had unbelievable timbre, easily recognizable. I was hearing everything from tape bleed to breaths being taken before singing, the most subtle things were easily heard without strain. On one of songs (Wood is a Pleasant Thing to Think Of) on Patricia Barber's album Cafe Blue, a female A Cappella group is singing "wood is a pleasant thing to think of" in the past I had to really listen to understand what was being said. Most of Patricia Barber's lyrics have been hard to understand overall, not anymore; all her words are now clearly distinguishable.

All in all, the 5751s made a great improvement in my system. So great in fact, that I am know contemplating not moving forward with upgrading to the HR-X, which I was totally set on! I just don't see how I will get a serious return on my investment now that I am dialed in. The laws of diminishing returns vs. the outright want for something will be a tough fought battle.

Sorry about rambling on, but I have been building and tweaking my system for over 3 years, adding the 5751s to it totally caught me off guard. I was not expecting to hear the type of improvement that would have me saying..."I believe I am finally there!"

m

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 27, 2011 at 10:43:47
Mendel
Audiophile

Posts: 1207
Location: GTA
Joined: January 17, 2009
 Try a 5751 in the 12ax7 spot in the MC275amp. I like both grey and black plate 5751s. I agree with Fender---a Raytheon windmill 5751 is my personal favorite. Really not that hard to find, and available at roughly the same cost as the current "boutique" Chinese 12ax7.

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 27, 2011 at 14:20:45
45RPM@60Hz
Audiophile

Posts: 11
Location: East Coast
Joined: January 1, 2011
 Great idea, I have a quad of the GE 5751 Triple Mica Grey Plates and a pair of Sylvania Gold Brand Triple Mica Black Plates coming in next week. It's tube rolling time.

One of the things I have been thinking about are the 12AT7s, I am currently using Mullard CV 4024s. Any considerations on a better 12AT7 and what improvements to look forward to?

Thanks.

45

 

RE: GE 5751 Triple Mica Gray Plate - Surprise, Surprise!, posted on February 27, 2011 at 16:09:50
SirAnthony
Audiophile

Posts: 2063
Location: No California
Joined: March 16, 2004
 Mazda 5751 silver plate are the best IMO but good luck finding any.

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 27, 2011 at 17:10:45
Mendel
Audiophile

Posts: 1207
Location: GTA
Joined: January 17, 2009
 Sorry RPM--I don't use 12AT7s. I do have a pair of Telefunken 12AT7s that I picked up at a hamfest just cause they were Teles---supposed to be a good tube. I am not really big on Mullard (except for their early EL34's). You can probably do better in that spot.
Let us know how the Slyvania 5751 work for you.

 

I too......, posted on February 27, 2011 at 20:11:34
amandarae
Audiophile

Posts: 2591
Location: So.Cal
Joined: November 30, 2004
 ....love 5751's over 12AX7's in my CD player by wide margin. I have tried plenty of 12AX7's (since my phono requires a pair) and 5751's, in my player, and nothing comes close to a Sylvania Gold Brand 5751 Triple Mica Gold pins after 20 hours or so base on my listening preference. The GE's and the RCA's are great too but I much prepare the Sylvanias.

One tube that surprises me in the 5751 family is the SYlvania JAN JHS Triple Mica Gray Plate 5751WA's. To me, it has the bass slam, and organic tone of the Sylvania GB, GE's, and RCA's but a little better in extension specially on the top end. Not to mention that it cost less than the other brands I mentioned too.

Here's a pic

Maybe you want to try it someday.
Yep, that's me on the reflection taking pictures years ago.

regards,

Abe

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on February 27, 2011 at 21:45:53
posbwp55@msn.com
Audiophile

Posts: 294
Location: DC
Joined: June 4, 2006
 45RPM,

Thanks for the detailed description of the GE gray plate 5751 in your system. I may have to try a pair. I look forward to your post when you hear the Sylvania 3M BP SG tubes when you hear them (they are very good, really hard to find any shortcoming in their presentation). That said, it doesn't mean that they will be the best in all or even most systems. I do have to agree (generally) with the findings in Joe's tube lore. There are only a short list of 12AX7's that don't suffer from smearing of detail (Joe never tried any of these, hence his condemnation of the entire family). There are several excellent 5751's and you should seek them out before deciding that any one that sounds ideal currently is the ultimate.

Bart

 

RE: I too......, posted on February 28, 2011 at 08:05:53
Mendel
Audiophile

Posts: 1207
Location: GTA
Joined: January 17, 2009
 Hi Abe:
I agree, those JHS green label Sylvania TM grey plates are fantastic tubes and my favorites after the Raytheon windmills. I prefer them to the Sylvania black-plate 5751.
5751s are very consistent. Although each type has a different flavor, I have yet to hear a really bad one---even the 1980's Jan Phillips 5751 are pretty good.
Posbwp55, I agree with your comments on 12ax7 and Joe's tube lore. Joe did miss out on some of the best 12ax7 (hint: Telefunken, Brimar and Mullard do not make the list despite their legendary status and high prices). I too had condemned the tube until I heard the tilted getter Phillips tubes from Germany and the Raytheon black-plates. Trying to aquire the Seimens and Mazda 12ax7 (and a good pair of the RCA long grey plate 12ax7) to see if they make the grade.

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on March 6, 2011 at 09:33:54
45RPM@60Hz
Audiophile

Posts: 11
Location: East Coast
Joined: January 1, 2011
 Wow! What a great week! My quad of 1961 5751 GE Triple Mica Grey Plates and a pair of 1960 5751 Sylvania Gold Brand Triple Mica Black Plates arrived.

I started with replacing the 1962 phono grade TFK 12AX7s in my MC275 with a set of the GEs, better clarity and a quieter noise floor. After two hours of listening I replaced 1960 Amperex Bugle Boy 12AX7s in my preamp's (C2300) phono stage with the 1960 Sylvania Gold Brand Triple Mica Black Plates and sat stunned at what I was hearing. An overall 10-15% increase in sonic performance. The noise floor is non-existent, I was able to hear the faintest macro and micro dynamics, more extension, bass was fuller, richer and tighter, a greater flow accompanied the 5751 change. My more foot tapped uncontrollably, I was more engaged and swept away.

In fact, during one listening session my wife walked up and startled me! There is plenty of open space leading up my listening spot and I had no idea she was headed my way!! You are literally transported to another time and place! Which I believe is the whole point. Things only got better as the tubes heated up and started to burn in. I simply could not tear myself from my system last night, I played LP after LP after LP!

Needless to say I am incredibly happy with the results of going with the 5751s. I want to thank everyone for their input.

45

 

RE: 5751 Gray Plates vs. Black Plates..., posted on March 6, 2011 at 12:06:42
Mendel
Audiophile

Posts: 1207
Location: GTA
Joined: January 17, 2009
 Hi 45:
It was a real pleasure to read your update on the new 5751s. That is what tube rolling is all about! Enjoy the music!

 

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