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Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???

66.74.191.120
Posted on November 5, 2009 at 05:29:05
Audiodyssey
Dealer

Posts: 512
Joined: November 7, 2004
 I've got 'em all, I mean all types of 6CG7's. I've been rolling them in and out of my preamp (wired for 6SN7, using an adapter) for two weeks now. I have about 300 of these; as a few years ago when I started buying up large lots of NOS tubes, you couldn't give them away, and well, I didn't WANT to give them away. I don't know what's wrong with the 6CG7, and I'm surprised they don't get discussed more often, but then I don't understand the technicals about Rp, curves, and such, so maybe there is a reason. I, for one, find they are always better than the 6SN7 in the few places I have swapped them in. I thought the old RCA blackplates were good, the Raytheon black plates were better. But then I found a single pair of Toshiba blackplates, with long thin rectangular getters. To those that say a tube "can't" change the sound, well you have to hear this for yourself. I'm looking for more, and anyone having a nice pair, I'll triple your trade with the 6CG7 of your choice. They seem a bit rare. What changed is all the dynamics, soundstage, imaging, and detail. Actually, it seems a little too good to be true and i'm just hoping the delusion lasts a long, long time.
"I KNOW you can hear it, but are you REALLY listening?"
RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 11, 2009 at 16:53:12
Ruinthere@sbcglobal.net
Audiophile

Posts: 247
Location: Chicago area
Joined: May 26, 2007
 Anybody who's ever raided old color TV's on the side of the road has alot of these. I know I do. Great Tube

DagW00d

Shhhh!, posted on November 6, 2009 at 07:37:57
Sondek
Audiophile

Posts: 1072
Location: Ft. Worth
Joined: May 17, 2000
 Quiet, or everybody will know about the Toshiba 6CG7's. And then they might discover thier M3624's (6DJ8) too!

Dadgummit! Listen to sondek......................such talk will drive the price up.. ~NT, posted on November 6, 2009 at 09:48:12
Cleantimestream
Audiophile

Posts: 1516
Location: Kentucky
Joined: June 30, 2005
 ~!
"The Sound of One Hand Clapping is Crashing by Design" HKM
RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 6, 2009 at 05:52:57
Dman
Industry Professional

Posts: 3842
Location: Southern Ontario
Joined: January 28, 2001
 My ARC D-76a uses 8 of them! No problems with the sound of these bad boys at all along with the four 12AX7 (actually two 12AX7s, and two 5751s- gotta use my stash of 5751s up since no one jumped on my Ebay sale a few months ago!) and five 6550s (two pair for power, one for neg bias reg)!

I'm currently using Electro-Harmonix 6CG7EHs. They sound VERY dynamic and punchy, with lots of detail and frequency width.

"We ask our artists to be true. Actually, we demand that our artists be true. When poets, storytellers, & singers lie to us for money, our culture is diseased & in decline."
-Robert Fripp
RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 5, 2009 at 12:22:38
tvr2500m
Audiophile

Posts: 1380
Location: Boston
Joined: February 2, 2003
 No beef from me on the 6CG7, or the 6FQ7, for that matter. I've typically had at least a couple of these in a system for the last 30 years. My recollection of the threads I've seen on this forum have typically spoken of this tube family in good words.

I had one of these big-change moments recently, too, with a Japanese-made 6CG7. I'm not entirely sure who the manufacturer was (unfortunately, this can often be kinda difficult with Japanese tubes). They're ITT-branded, long gray plates, proper 6CG7s with a plate shield. I can't find any identifying manufacturer marks of the types you can sometimes find on Japanese tubes. Of course, as as so often the case, the tubes we got in the US from Japan tended to be OE branded.

Who ever made them, yes, one of those major sonic transformations. Just tremendous, and tremdously wonderful. I'd like to have some more, too! I've got two new sleeves but it just isn't enough! ;)

I was fortunate enough to buy some sleeves of lovely long gray plate Hitachi 6CG7s, in lovely new boxes printed in Japanese (originally for home-market sale?), each still sealed in cellophane, and with neatly folded datasheets in each box. I have only a few early, black plate Japanese 6CG7s. Sadly, not enough to get my system glowing.

- SJ

RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 6, 2009 at 08:33:01
ironbut
Audiophile

Posts: 1115
Location: no california
Joined: February 21, 2004
 Hey TVR2500m,
The last time I heard, you were lovin' the Sylvanias. What kind of differences in character did you find with the Japanese 6cg7's?

RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 6, 2009 at 15:48:51
tvr2500m
Audiophile

Posts: 1380
Location: Boston
Joined: February 2, 2003
 Yes, I do like the late-'50s "flat"/"ladder" plate tube. Either the D-getter or the later O-getter ones will do. I've come to feel that this is a tube to always have clost-at-hand. The same with the RCA black plate 6CG7, though somehow liking this tube sounds like a cliche.

The character differences? Good question. I think that the most notable feature I might call "texture". That dynamic character that feels "real". That breathing, living, effortless, clear, articulated, reach-out-and-touch kinda thing. That thing that makes something sound modulated and flesh-out. Meat-on-the-bones, and of both vocals and instruments. And, tonal balance and extension are just right, at least to my ears. Performance elements are well differentiate both spacially and tonally. Instrument musical characters are distinctive from one another.

This is all from four 6CG7s, two each, in the phase splitter/driver sections of a pair of CJ Premier 12 monoblocks. Of course, muckin' around with related system bits mucks around with everything else. Partnering particularly well with the 6CG7s in the amps are some earlier Valve Art-branded 6550 output tubes, and 3M, GP, O-getter GE 5751s.

For the complete picture, in my CJ PV-12A a bunch of tubes are fitting in well - the Tesla ECC802Ss (which typically sounds on the lean and clinical, even hard, side), the GE 3M, GP, O-getter 6189s, the short plate Gf2 type Blackburn Mullard ECC82, and some others. This particular system is fed by a middling Marantz DVD changer and a nice MHDT NOS filterless DAC, and on the other end a pair of venerable Type C/Vs (which I've found to be a bit hard to tame - they're nicely dynamic and extended, but can also a bit "shouty").

- SJ

RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 6, 2009 at 16:21:55
ironbut
Audiophile

Posts: 1115
Location: no california
Joined: February 21, 2004
 Nice description SJ!
Thanks, I've been jumping between setups with either the RCA BP (that you sold me BTW) or Sylvanias.
I'll find myself a pair of those and give um a try.

RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 7, 2009 at 19:03:32
tvr2500m
Audiophile

Posts: 1380
Location: Boston
Joined: February 2, 2003
 Send me an email and I'll send you some pics of this 6CG7. And I'd like to hear how those RCAs have been working for. So, you've got a pair of those late-1950s Sylvanias? How would you compare them with the Sylvanias?

Ciao,

- SJ

RE: Toshiba 6CG7 with black plates! What's wrong with the 6CG7 anyway???, posted on November 5, 2009 at 07:32:21
FenderLover
Audiophile

Posts: 3309
Joined: July 31, 2007
Contributor
  Since: May 17, 2009
 6CG7 electrical data is very similar to a 6SN7. They are fine tubes. I like the Tung-Sol black plates, myself. They are pretty well known & have been discussed a bit on this forum. Glad you found some good Toshiba.

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