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Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?

67.81.107.133
Posted on June 22, 2009 at 09:05:53
Mike in NJ
Audiophile

Posts: 378
Location: Paramus, NJ
Joined: September 5, 2002
 I have a person from Italy interested in a pair of speakers im selling.
They are Magnepan 3.6's.
They are heavy and bulky, and tried to persuade him that some things could go wrong in transit to damage the speakers. He insists that is his problem and he has full faith in UPS.
He said he would pay via Paypal, so once I have the money in my account "that what may happen to the speakers thereafter is his problem so don’t worry”.
So my question is if I receive transaction funds in my paypal account is there still a way for me not to get paid?
Can he retract the money or can Paypal get fooled into thinking funds are sent, but then they are retracted?
RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on October 12, 2009 at 19:46:20
steve6
Reviewer

Posts: 739
Location: southern cal.
Joined: August 7, 2003
 Hi. If you're concerned about PayPal, there are alternatives now. One is www.alertpay.com. I used PayPal for years and switched. They offer all kinds of guarantees and protections. I've had a very good experience so far.
RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on October 6, 2009 at 09:01:08
shermanr@prw.net
Audiophile

Posts: 497
Location: Sunny San Juan, PR
Joined: June 8, 2004
Contributor
  Since: June 24, 2009
 Great question. Recently I was ripped-off along with 15 other Audiogon Bidders on a bogus Dutch Auction for (15) Denon DL-160 Cartridges.

Seller has my $91.01 and I never received the item.

Seller's Audiogon account was closed and his e-mail does not work.

This is the response I received from Paypal... Seller has my money.

You be the judge, from what Paypal says, the risk is on the buyer's side 100%. I don't feel the confidence using Paypal any longer.

But then again, aren't we simply "Dust in the Wind" to Paypal ?

A a $5000 preamp loss would be another matter, but the outcome tragically similar I must assume.

------------------------------------
Hello Richard Sherman,

After careful review, we have concluded our investigation of the Buyer
Complaint described below.

We have decided in your favor, however, we were unable to recover any funds from the seller's account. As stated in the PayPal User Agreement, recovery of funds associated with a Buyer Complaint cannot be guaranteed.

Please know that we will make our best effort to recover the funds in
question if they become available in the seller's account in the future and will take appropriate action against the seller. Such action may include issuing a warning, a temporary restriction, or terminating the account.

Keep in mind that PayPal uses a number of factors to determine when to take action, including member complaints. Due to privacy laws, we cannot discuss the details of any action taken. We hope you understand our policy and that it assures you that you are safe using PayPal.
------------------------------------
Ouch!, posted on October 6, 2009 at 10:54:55
GTShelby350
Audiophile

Posts: 454
Location: So Cal
Joined: February 23, 2008
 Richard, when you paid via Paypal, was it using a credit card? If you did use a credit card, you have further recourse to get your money by filing a dispute with your credit card company directly. People seem to have greater luck with that... might be worth a shot.

RE: Ouch!, posted on October 6, 2009 at 12:39:21
shermanr@prw.net
Audiophile

Posts: 497
Location: Sunny San Juan, PR
Joined: June 8, 2004
Contributor
  Since: June 24, 2009
 You are wise...:) Yes, I used my AMEX Card through Paypal and they are still investigating. I even have the sellers Physical address and a tack on his Vermont residence on Google Earth. One of the 15 buyers knows this guy from past purchases. Apparently the guy used a fake NY physical address.
RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on October 4, 2009 at 15:15:39
RZCK
Audiophile

Posts: 28
Location: Pepper Pike,OH
Joined: October 3, 2009
 Unfortunately there are people who pay for items using paypal,and once they get the the items they either claim they didn't receive it,or that it was damaged.They make away with the item and their money back,leaving the seller without their item and money.Whenever possible let UPS or FedEx pack your items,get a signature,and make sure you insure your item for what you sold it for.

RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on July 29, 2009 at 10:22:31
mcgjohn@yahoo.com
Industry Professional

Posts: 121
Location: Midwest
Joined: February 5, 2008
 Paypal is fine for overseas; just do not ship USPS. go to the extra expense of Fedex or UPS. Reason being, USPS can not offer del. Gar. or del. confirmation on overseas, esp. in Italy.

so you ship the Maggies to Italy. buyer in Italy claims he never got them; (even if he did) and paypal will refund his monies from your acct. so he will get speakers and full refund to boot.

RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on June 24, 2009 at 10:55:27
GTShelby350
Audiophile

Posts: 454
Location: So Cal
Joined: February 23, 2008
 I've not had this happen to me, but I have read numerous stories of people who accept Paypal from overseas buyers, who promptly file a dispute with Paypal claiming the products were never delivered, or arrived damaged. In these cases Paypal almost ALWAYS sides with the buyer.

Here's what you can do to minimize your risk: ONLY accept the funds if he is a verified Paypal member, and his address is a confirmed address on file with Paypal, and only ship to that confirmed address!

Using UPS is a good idea because they have reliable tracking. When you ship, require UPS obtain an adult signature. Also, ship your speakers double boxed. It may cost more but it will help reduce the chances that OOPS (I mean UPS) breaks them.

With insurance, it's imperitve that you insure the speakers for the full amount the guy is buying them for, and declare for the full selling price on customs documents. DO NOT agree to declare a lower value for customs. If he will not agree to this, back out of the deal.

Let's say you sell the speakers for $3000 (hypothetical price). If you only declare for customs at $500, that's all the insurance you can get. If UPS breaks them in transit, or they get lost, all you will be able to get back from UPS is $500. I don't care what the guy says... if they get lost or arrive damaged he will file a claim with Paypal and he will get his entire purchase amount back. You'll only be able to claim for $500 for insurance.

This is pretty much what Paypal requires in order for a transaction to qualify for their "Seller Protection." There may be a few other things, but as long as you adhere to this, you should be fine.

It will likely go wrong., posted on October 3, 2009 at 07:42:02
KT88
Dealer

Posts: 4830
Location: Roanoke VA
Joined: October 5, 2001
 This happened to me. I did a guy a favor by saving him some money on shipping as well as accepting a "promise to pay" which is all that PlayPal amounts to. He ended up with the product and his money with help from the crooks at PayPal.

Don't do it.
-Bill

Thanks to all, another question...., posted on June 24, 2009 at 14:35:28
Mike in NJ
Audiophile

Posts: 378
Location: Paramus, NJ
Joined: September 5, 2002
 Do you think it would be better to have payment sent via wire transfer to my bank account and then wait for money to clear?

Would that be safer?

Thanks agian to all who respond.

Mike

Yes, wire transfers are clearly the safest., posted on June 26, 2009 at 08:08:29
Norm
Audiophile

Posts: 14914
Joined: September 6, 2000
 It is not safe for the buyer, however. There is no way that the money can be taken back by the buyer.

On PayPal if you have a separate bank account for PayPal deposits and quickly transfer the money to another account, it is also safe. You might lose PayPal rights but your money is safe.

If the buyer is willing to trust you and wire the funds, I would do that.

RE: Thanks to all, another question...., posted on June 25, 2009 at 11:09:59
GTShelby350
Audiophile

Posts: 454
Location: So Cal
Joined: February 23, 2008
 If he's willing to do a wire transfer that keeps you pretty safe. Wire transfers are extremely difficult to undo once the funds clear (usually only takes a couple business days).
RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on June 23, 2009 at 22:15:42
Ben Van Dyk
Audiophile

Posts: 657
Location: idaho
Joined: February 9, 2006
 I use to sell on ebay.from what I remember if the speakers get damaged he can file first for talking to you.if that dont work a claim can start then paypal steps in and helps.that all I remember.he sounds like he wont file a claim.that would be done with ups any way.good luck.Ive bought 1000s of dollars from there mainly with cc.thru paypal with no trouble except once.I would read your papal site to see if anything can go wrong.what they will do ect.
dvd audio & multichannel sacds rule
RE: Paypal, if you recive a payment can it go wrong?, posted on June 23, 2009 at 01:00:33
becketma@yahoo.com
Audiophile

Posts: 958
Location: Sunny Tucson AZ
Joined: May 21, 2007
 PayPal ugh!

They aren't even a bank. My experience is that if there is a problem, count on having a problem with PayPal service. You have to give PayPal access to your bank account and give them permission to withdraw funds, even if the funds aren't there.

Best from Tucson

"He (R.M. Nixon) was a foul caricature of himself, a man with no soul, no inner convictions, with the integrity of a hyena, and the style of a poison toad." H. S. Thompson

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