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Posts: 5109
Location: Brisbane
Joined: September 25, 1999
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I never thought that the 2 systems would be used at the same time.
The simplest and best compromise in my view is a single system. Make the front channels your stereo music system. Use an AV receiver for the HT system and pass the signal for the front channels from the receiver's pre outs to an input on your audio system that provides a HT bypass function. That way you can use your music system normally without having the HT system on at all. When you use the HT system, the amp for your music system simply works as the power amps for the front left and right channels of the surround system rather than using the amps in the AV receiver for those channels.
The advantages of that sort of setup are:
-room symmetry is maintained for both music and HT
- you can optimise the acoustic treatment for the music system and that treatment will work equally well for the HT setup as well.
- you reduce the number of unused speakers in the room when playing music. Unused speakers can affect the sound since the drivers are going to move with pressure variations in the room and that can affect the sound at some frequencies, usually bass frequencies. You also save on the cost of a pair of front speakers if you don't already have a surround system.
- surround systems take up a lot more space than stereo systems but stereo also benefits from a larger space. Integrating the 2 systems in this way makes the most constructive use of the total space available for both systems.
The downside is that the surround channels may not tonally match the L and R front channels which may be a problem with some soundtracks. You can avoid that by using similar speakers for all channels but if you've got good speakers for the stereo setup, matching them for surround and the centre channel can be expensive.
Treating the room in order to balance that displaced wall for the system facing across the end of the room is going to result in an asymmetrical treatment addition in the system facing down the length of the room. Sure, you can balance that by adding more treatment for that system but treatment for that system will probably also require some treatment in the centre of the rear wall, the right wall for the second system, that you normally would not have or want for that system. I can't see any way of coming up with a treatment strategy that deals with both systems that doesn't include some element of compromise for both systems.
If you integrate the 2 systems as I initially outlined, you avoid those problems. I don't know what sort of screen you're using for HT but if it's a large flat screen and you run into reflection problems from the screen, the simple solution is simply to cover it with a quilt or blanket while playing music. In my view that's going to be much less of a compromise than the compromises that you're going to have to consider if you run the 2 systems as shown in your drawing.
Read a book like Toole's "Sound Reproduction" and/or Everest's "Master Handbook of Acoustics" and take a look at their recommendations for treatment, then try to map those treatments to the layout shown in your diagram and see if you can make the treatment placements for each system overlap. If you can get them to overlap and avoid adding any additional treatment locations for either system while maintaining symmetrical placement for the system firing down the long dimension, then you can have a no compromise solution with the 2 system layout.
If you can't get the treatment locations for both systems to overlap and if you find yourself placing treatment for one system in a location that isn't necessary or ideal for the other, then the sound of that system may well be compromised. If you've got treatment where you wouldn't normally have it for both systems, then the sound of both systems may be compromised. That's the situation I think you're going to find yourself in with the 2 systems set up as shown in your diagram.
Even if you can avoid treatment placements that result in compromised sound you're going to have 6 additional speakers (including the sub) in the room when you play music vs 4 additional speakers if you integrate, plus no extra speakers in the room when you're using the HT setup if you integrate the systems. You get extra space for surround placement and seating if you integrate the systems plus the second system gains the benefit of symmetrical placement in the large space. Those are going to be plusses in terms of sound quality for both systems, even without considering the treatment advantages.
Alternatively, if you have to have 2 separate systems and it's an option, I'd run a wall between the 2 spaces shown in your diagram. That gives you 2 separate spaces in which you can run symmetrical setups and each of which can be treated ideally, plus you avoid any issues from the stepped ceiling height you mention in your other post. Yes, adding the wall will be more expensive but I think the results in terms of sound quality for both systems will also be better. I don't know whether that approach or integrating the systems will offer the best "bang for the buck" for you, part of the answer to that question depends on your tastes, but I do think either will give you better results than setting up 2 separate systems in the same space as shown in your diagram.
I know you can make asymmetrical setups work and work well because I've done it, but it's trickier to do that than to make a symmetrical setup work well and it takes a fair bit of experimenting to come up with the best results in an asymmetrical setup. There are no simple rules of thumb when it comes to asymmetrical setups and every asymmetrical setup is different in different ways. You have to find what works for your case. There are some basic rules of thumb for symmetrical setups and while you may still have to tweak things a little, it's a hell of a lot easier to do so in the symmetrical case because both sides of the room are going to behave in a similar manner.
That's my take on things. I'm sure you might be able to find some people who disagree with me but after years of living with asymmetrical setups and dealing with the problems of finding ways to make them work well, I'd rather go for a solution that avoids asymmetry if I could get one and your 2 systems in the one room setup doesn't do that. Integrating the systems and separating the addition from the current space with a wall both maintain symmetry for both setups and avoid the problems arising from asymmetry. I'd go for either of them before I went for the setup shown in your diagram. My preference would be to have 2 separate systems and rooms but that's also the most expensive option in some ways and you probably end up with the bigger space going to the HT system in order to get good placement of the surround speakers when I'd rather give the bigger space to the music system.
As I said, you can probably find some people who would go with your proposed setup and they will obviously see things differently from me. If you can find such a person and they've got experience with that kind of setup and dealing with the asymmetry issues, then I'd give a lot of thought to their advice if you're going to go down that road but my advice is to put up with asymmetry only when the room itself forces it on you. If you have options which avoid it, then they're the options I personally would go for first.
David Aiken
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RE: Acoustics for different room types - Brad225 08:18:58 11/21/09
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