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Problems getting a good 3-way x-over for home

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Posted on October 23, 2009 at 09:39:46
Max Caliber
Audiophile

Posts: 17
Location: North of MTL
Joined: September 2, 2002
 I hope someone can answer this easy question.

What would be a good 3-way electronic crossover for a really big home theater system?

I have purchased many different devices over the years of which none seem to perform well and I am looking for something that gives the best sound for the dollar. The units I have used with my system at one time or another are:

#1 An early JBL 5234, 2 way unit with fixed x-over frequencies which didn’t match well with the Hiels air motion transformers I’m using for the mids & highs.

#2 A Nady 3 way unit (I think it was a CX2314) that was distorting and crackling whenever a signal got moderately high (however the peak was still far below the rated maximum output level approximately -10db).

#3 2x DBX 234 units that are supposed to have TRS balanced in & outs. However they only produce an output signal on the cold (inverting) output line of each output (no signal of any sort on any of the outputs on the hot + side on any of the outputs).

I was thinking of buying two DBX 234XL units hoping that they would function better than the regular DBX 234 TRS units I already own, or perhaps a Behringer CX-3400, but I have a sneaky feeling that the Behringer might not have as good sonic quality as the DBX units.

So my easy question is what would be a good 3-way electronic X-crossover for a home theater system?
RE: Problems getting a good 3-way x-over for home, posted on November 2, 2009 at 12:45:48
Pro Sound Guy
 Rane AC-23S

Stereo 2- or 3-Way, or Mono 4- or 5-Way
Linkwitz-Riley Alignment with 24 dB per Octave Slopes
Adjustable Driver Alignment Delays
Infrasonic, Ultrasonic and RFI Filters
Low & Mid Output Muting (3-Way)
Mono Sub Output Option
Constant-Directivity Horn EQ Option
Input & Output Level Controls
Fully Active Balanced XLR Inputs & Outputs

Or in almost the same price range the DBX driverack would work well
The driverack gives you bandwidth conrol and much more
Rane AC-23S, posted on November 2, 2009 at 20:01:20
bassbinotoko
Audiophile

Posts: 88
Location: Vancouver Island
Joined: January 27, 2009
 There's a heck of a lot of op-amps in the signal path, if you care about such things. A lot of them appear to be TL072; those have been around over 30 years now, and are probably perfectly adequate, but they weren't SOTA for audio even back then.

Still, it uses ganged pots for frequency determining, not VCAs in a state-variable filter. Presumably the pots are laser-trimmed to track very well.
Marchands would be my choice, posted on October 26, 2009 at 20:32:12
JoeKool
Audiophile

Posts: 426
Location: NYC
Joined: May 9, 2003
 for a simple crossover, and IMO maybe more transparent than the pro models.

http://www.marchandelec.com/
RE: Problems getting a good 3-way x-over for home, posted on October 24, 2009 at 08:11:41
b.l.zeebub
Audiophile

Posts: 810
Location: 52deg 28'N,1deg56'W
Joined: April 17, 2006
 I'm using two modified BSS FDS360.

There might be a couple of points against these: Firstly they are not being made anymore so s/h is the only option.
Secondly, you would need to at least swap out the op amps to make them really good.

On the other hand they offer 360deg phase adjustment on all bands, decent limiters, etc.
Best of all the xover frequencies are set by plug in cards which carry the appropriate capacitors and resistors and all the values are public on the net. This means that with a soldering iron and a bunch of more or less cheap components you can make up the frequencies and slopes best suited to your system.

If you want to go digital the Behringer is the cheapest option by far but while the convertors are actually quite good the analog circuitry surrounding them is quite, quite poor indeed!
Modification are possible but fairly complex and therefore not cheap.
I've got no idea about the quality of the algorithms used in the DSP.

XTA and Quested make high-quality digital ones but these are far from cheap!

more info, posted on October 23, 2009 at 10:07:26
Max Caliber
Audiophile

Posts: 17
Location: North of MTL
Joined: September 2, 2002



I forgot to mention in my earlier post that I also tried 2x Samson S3 3-way x-overs where one unit did ont function on one side and the other unit had a bad case hiss. Also I just added a photo of my system.

DBX Studio, posted on October 27, 2009 at 10:44:24
morrisonic
Audiophile

Posts: 29
Joined: October 25, 2009
 I'm currently using a DBX Studio, which is a DBX PA with different presets,.
I'm mainly using it for the XO funtions, however I also use the RTA and EQ, which works wonders to "fix" my terrible room. As far sound quality I'm very satisfied. However I haven't a/b any other active crossovers. I have used other EQ's Yamaha, Berhinger, etc and the DBX was by FAR the best. The Yamaha was a total shock...even in bypass it degraded the sound tremendously.
Kelly

Behringer DCX2496?, posted on October 23, 2009 at 22:14:49
bassbinotoko
Audiophile

Posts: 88
Location: Vancouver Island
Joined: January 27, 2009
 I suspect that the frequency adjustments on the CX3400 aren't very precise. And, while I've never had the cover off my CX3400 to check, tuning is probably done by sticking VCAs inside state-variable filters. VCAs have a hard time doing variable gain without introducing distortion; there are some very good ones now. Still, I suspect that filters made with fixed R and C elements and conventional op-amps will be better. But, the CX3400 was a steal for all the features it crammed into one box, and I had no problems when I was using it in my party setup. But, I've replaced it with something much better...

The Behringer DCX2496. It's arguably more of a "speaker management system" than a mere crossover. There's limiters, EQ, delays, and some features I've been unable to figure out a use for. It accepts digital or analog inputs. You can program it from a PC through a serial cable, maybe the easiest way to get started, but the front-panel LCD is fine with practice. Plenty of audiophiles like it, although some modify the heck out of it.

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