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microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics

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Posted on August 20, 2016 at 22:58:40
AbeCollins
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I created two listening scenarios.

Setup #1 - Mac Mini:
This setup uses a minimally tweaked headless Mac Mini to the Intona USB isolator driving my PS Audio NuWave DSD DAC.

The headless Mac Mini (quad-core i7 16GB RAM + SSD) is powered by an external regulated 12VDC 10AMP linear power supply. The space inside the Mac Mini that once contained its switching power supply has been replaced with a LC filter network on a slim PCB to provide additional filtering of the external 12VDC source. Several applications and unneeded processes have been disabled in Mac OS X 10.11.6 "El Capitan". I'm running Roon or Roon+HQPlayer on the Mac Mini out to the DAC and controlling it all with the Roon App on my iPad.

Setup #2 - microRendu:
Here the microRendu streamer is on a hardwired network direct to my cable modem / router.

The microRendu drives my PS Audio NuWave DSD DAC. The Mac Mini is also on my hardwired network as it contains my music library to be streamed to the microRendu over the network. It is the same Mac Mini that I described above but in another room a few dozen feet away. Power for the microRendu is supplied by the iFi iPower 9v power supply, one of many power sources on the microRendu recommended list. I ran the microRendu with Roon or Roon+HQPlayer, again using the iPad as the controller.

What I heard:
The microRendu sounds noticeably better than a stock Mac Mini running straight iTunes. It probably sounds better than a stock PC. The microRendu sounds much more like the tweaked Mac Mini running decent player software like Roon, Audirvana Plus, Pure Music, or HQPlayer. So out of the box the microRendu is clearly the winner over a stock Mac but with a tweaked Mac Mini they're much closer.

Against the tweaked Mac Mini running Roon, the microRendu sounds a little 'lighter' and more 'agile' but not quite as full bodied or dynamic. The difference is minute. I like the transparency and detail I'm hearing in the microRendu which is very similar to the tweaked Mac Mini but with a less bold presentation. Soundstage and imaging are comparable with a very slight soundstage advantage to the microRendu.

I have to conclude that I hear larger differences among the player software tested on both platforms vs the differences between the platforms themselves. Roon sounds excellent. Roon+HQPlayer are even better.... regardless if coming thru the microRendu or the Mac Mini directly to DAC.

For it's size, convenience, and reasonable price (in audio terms anyway) the microRendu is a real winner. I'd really love to get someone's take on it against streamers at 2x - 20x it's price. Features aside, what more do $1200 - $17,000 streamers have to offer sonically? I couldn't tell you but the microRendu is outstanding!

I have since kept the Mac Mini in my office listening setup and moved the microRendu down to the basement. All I need to control it is my handy dandy iPad Mini.

Because fmak hates pictures....

microRendu network streamer. $640 USD + the cost of a power supply, $6 - $600+ your wallet your choice.

microRendu out of its aluminum case

microRendu with SolidRun Processor board removed

The System on a Module by SolidRun (green computer PCB) with Freescale Semiconductor ARM Cortex-A9 dual-core processor 1GHz, Samsung DDR3L memory chips x4. The microRendu carrier board in blue includes a Linear Technology switch mode voltage regulator micro-module at its input plus a couple other voltage regulators, crystal oscillator, USB hub chip, microSD card for the OS, Ethernet jack with magnetics by Pulse Electronics, and a few other goodies. There's a significant amount of engineering on the microRendu carrier board (blue PCB) unlike some other streamers that put an Intel NUC in a fancy box or other mini-ATX motherboard or Raspberry Pi. Pretty impressive approach to use a general purpose System on a Module made by SolidRun placed on top of the microRendu carrier.

The software interface is also pretty cool and very simple for setup and changing modes. Just input the microRendu's DHCP assigned IP address in your web browser's URL field. Some screen shots of the BUI are shown below.

Because fmak hates pictures.....




 

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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 21, 2016 at 02:19:52
soundchekk
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Seems like you fall in love with someone.
Sonore will appreciate your feedback.

By looking at the boards I'd say most of the "cost" go into
SW design, maintenance and marketing.
Don't believe that such a board is much more expensive -
if produced in China - then a PI.


To be honest. If your MAC mini is able to compete soundwise,
I'd rather go for that one.

Why should I buy such an expensive black-box "gadget", which is probably outdated sooner as you'd imagine?
As you know, SW maintenance, is usually a key issue for manufacturers.
That, e.g. all Android users (except Nexus users) had to learn the hard way. Do you expect it to be any different with such a device?

A MAC and even a Raspberry PI or any other $50 ARM board give me ten times
more flexibility at a much lower cost.
Your MAC can even be used for other purposes as well( That's what I do with my NUC). That'll make it really cheap as transport.

I'd love to compare my $100 RPI + $100 iPurifier2 setup against a MicroRendu! Just to see where I am at.

Bottom line. I'd never buy that device. That's for sure.
And the nice thing is, you actually pretty much confirmed (MAC vs. Microrendu) my position. Thx for that.

Enjoy.

PS: IMO such a device shouldn't cost more then 99$-129$.


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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 21, 2016 at 03:36:30
Mercman
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I'll be writing down my sonic impressions of the microRendu today. It has been a bit difficult since my Ayre amps are breaking in. The sound changes as they burn in.

The only hint I will share with you now is Power Supply :-)

Thanks Abe.

 

For me, posted on August 21, 2016 at 06:36:44
E-Stat
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the only remaining question has to do with the effect of using stiff linear power supplies. I found using a good linear provided a good deal of refinement to the Touch vs. switching wall-wart.

It appears, for example, that a good 75% of the real estate of the DSD Nu Wave DAC is devoted to its stout linear power supply.



 

I hear ya...., posted on August 21, 2016 at 08:03:12
AbeCollins
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I had the $50 iFi iPower 9VDC wall wart on the microRendu and I also tried a couple 6VDC cheapies from Amazon ($9 and $12). They all worked fine and sound about the same which tells me there's nothing really special going on in the $50 iFi.

I may try a couple 18650 or 26650 Lithium Ion batteries in series when I have the time. I already have a few of them plus the battery holders. I'm gone all next week on travel for work so that will cut into my play time. ;-)

 

RE: For me, posted on August 21, 2016 at 08:06:07
Cut-Throat
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Here is what I have been using for my SBTs.. They have a 'Signature Edition' which is what I use.



 

Understood, posted on August 21, 2016 at 08:23:11
E-Stat
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I've used a similar Welborne Labs linear with mine. For the µRendu, I use an HD-Plex unit which considerably dwarfs the red Welborne. Like the ARC DAC8 (large box), the HD-Plex uses a low noise R-core transformer.



 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 21, 2016 at 08:27:22
AbeCollins
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I wanted to use the $50 iFi iPower this time around because it is on the recommended power supply list for the microRendu, but I understand that a better power supply could make a difference. It will have to wait about a week when I get back from a trip.

I'm looking forward to your review Steve.

 

A Proper Review published in June, posted on August 21, 2016 at 09:19:13
fmak
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Posts: 13158
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http://www.audiostream.com/content/sonore-simple-design-microrendu#EMuIvM66h8ccRMsr.97

''Inside there's a micro computer running the company's Sonicorbiter operating system, built in conjunction with Small Green Computer, while the hardware, including the proprietary printed circuit board, is also the product of a collaboration between Sonore by Simple Design, Small
Green Computer, and John Swenson (of Uptone Audio REGEN fame). There's am improved REGEN inside every microRendu since it also houses a USB hub that "generates a completely new USB data signal to feed your device."


This is a much more informative and wide ranging review that puts the uRendu in context by way of usage in systems.

There is also an inbuilt version of Regen in the product, which you sold because it made 'little difference' to sonics.



 

OK, maybe not all power supply...., posted on August 21, 2016 at 09:19:50
Ivan303
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but mostly power supply.

Audio-GD DAC pictured above.


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

I'm aware of other reviews...., posted on August 21, 2016 at 09:25:41
AbeCollins
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...but I haven't seen much on the microRendu here on the Asylum where I spend most of my time so I posted my review here. Thank you very much.

Oh, and I posted a bunch of microRendu photos just to annoy certain people. Some I have not seen anywhere else on the net. Enjoy!

Yes, my REGEN had little effect in my system whereas the Intona made a difference. Others here have stated the same. I'm not the only one. Since I can't remove the REGEN from the microRendu I guess I'll have to live with it. ;-)


 

RE: A Proper Review published in June, posted on August 21, 2016 at 09:33:12
Mercman
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Yes, Michael did a terrific job reviewing the microRendu. I will not be rehashing the info he provided, but primarily my experiences with this product.

 

This is what I'm sayin'! :) -nt, posted on August 21, 2016 at 09:39:34
E-Stat
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.

 

Hmmm..., posted on August 21, 2016 at 09:59:15
E-Stat
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I may try a couple 18650 or 26650 Lithium Ion batteries in series when I have the time.

You'll note there are no recommended conventional (non-ultra or supercap) battery supplies for the unit.

My understanding is they do not offer particularly low impedance.

 

April Full Review, posted on August 21, 2016 at 11:27:04
fmak
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in two parts in CA as well.

It will be quite right for you to post about it in your system.

But you have 'lost' your reference and will need to re-establish a starting point.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 21, 2016 at 14:42:04
Cappy
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Nice review Abe. And excellent pics too.

I've had my microRendu for almost four months now and I'm still extremely impressed with it.

 

RE: Hmmm..., posted on August 21, 2016 at 19:56:42
AbeCollins
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I'm sure there are hundreds of power supplies and batteries that will work wonderfully with the µRendu that are not on the recommended list.

As for Lithium Ion batteries I suspect you are correct. Relative to a NiCad or Ni-MH battery the ESR of a Lithium Ion battery is higher, but I don't know how much higher. So I'll try some Ni-MH batteries. ;-)


 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 09:05:18
AbeCollins
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To be honest. If your MAC mini is able to compete soundwise, I'd rather go for that one.

No argument here. You get a good amount of Mac Mini for the price of a µRendu & a decent power supply. But we're talking 'audiophile' goodies where even the 'bargains' are expensive. In the manufacturers' defense the sales volumes are tiny in this niche within a niche.

A MAC and even a Raspberry PI or any other $50 ARM board give me ten times more flexibility at a much lower cost. Your MAC can even be used for other purposes as well( That's what I do with my NUC). That'll make it really cheap as transport.

Again, no argument from me but some folks have been brainwashed into thinking that ALL commercially made streamers sound better than ALL DIY tweaked PCs, Macs, or DIY streamers.

The audiophile media and manufacturers have done their job well. There are no incentives for either camp to have PCs, Macs, or DIY streamers to come out on top. Can't advertise it, won't review it, can't sell it, so lets discredit it. Maybe that's a little extreme, almost conspiracy theorist, but not completely implausible. And of course there are those who want a turnkey appliance that just works out of the box. Nothing wrong with that.

I'd love to compare my $100 RPI + $100 iPurifier2 setup against a MicroRendu! Just to see where I am at.

Better yet, compare your DIY RPI setup to the new $1295 Bryston BDP-π. It uses the RPI board and Hifiberry Digi+. Theirs has a nice front panel driving a LCD screen but I wonder how it sounds.

Funny thing is, there's an 'expert' inmate here who claimed that RPI would never be good for audio applications. I guess Bryston didn't see that thread. ;-)

Bottom line. I'd never buy that device. That's for sure. And the nice thing is, you actually pretty much confirmed (MAC vs. Microrendu) my position. Thx for that.

I am completely happy with both the µRendu and the Mac Mini. A streamer NEEDS a computer (or NAS) anyway so now I have both. The Mini is back in the office, the µRendu is in the basement.

IMO such a device shouldn't cost more then 99$-129$.

That may be true if we're talking about hardware cost only. But some* streamer manufacturers actually optimize their hardware, develop software, have chassis / enclosure costs, facilities overhead, payroll, etc. As a DIYer you don't have those issues.

*Others more or less stuff a Raspberry Pi or NUC in a fancy box and call it a day.


 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 10:34:51
soundchekk
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HW cost > $100? Without a power supply??

No way.

They intend to play in the traditional audiophile audio league.

That's a strategic decision you take.


At 129$ you'd sell ten thousand(s) like Logitech did.
Or you sell a couple of hundred/thousands pieces at best at that high price.
I'm wondering if anybody seriously buys that $1400 power supply?
Ok. Ok. You never know. I've seen people spending 1500$ on software. ;)




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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 11:03:15
AbeCollins
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Maybe, but Logitech must have dropped the Squeezebox product line for a reason. Maybe they weren't selling enough, or maybe they weren't profitable selling at those prices. Who knows.

Might be easier to sell fewer high-priced solutions to the niche audiophile market vs low priced to the masses.





 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 12:35:32
Isaak J. Garvey
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What a bunch of self serving blather.

Unless I missed it, you have never heard the Sonore microRendu, and you never will.

Designing such an excellent product is so above your pay grade it is comical.

There are those that do, and those are armchair engineers on message boards. You and your ilk are the black clouds floating around who can judge products they have no experience with. Not.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 16:19:05
Mercman
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It was $1000 for the software :-)

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 17:29:15
Archimago
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HW cost > $100? Without a power supply??

Soundchekk: "No way.

They intend to play in the traditional audiophile audio league.

That's a strategic decision you take.


At 129$ you'd sell ten thousand(s) like Logitech did.
Or you sell a couple of hundred/thousands pieces at best at that high price.
I'm wondering if anybody seriously buys that $1400 power supply?
Ok. Ok. You never know. I've seen people spending 1500$ on software. ;)"

I agree with you Soundchekk. While I'm sure a number here will disagree with me that I do not believe (and have seen no evidence) that the hardware is capable of making the playback sound better through a good asynch USB DAC, I can appreciate the software and its flexibility.

Assuming there are no issues with software licensing (since a bunch of it is open source), I think if they sold a microSD card with the software for something like $100 would be reasonable for those who want to buy their own Raspberry Pi 2 or maybe Pi 3. Perhaps a whole package for $200 with Sonore Edition Pi hardware (with a nice metal case) and a reasonable SMPS power supply.

But at >$600 without power supply? Looking the way it does? Clearly they're aiming for the "audiophile audio league" and not to the sensible audiophile looking for actual value IMO.

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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 18:37:11
Isaak J. Garvey
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What a joke of a post. Birds of a feather....

Another arm chair engineer who could not market a viable product if your life depended on it. So you lash out.

"Clearly they're aiming for the "audiophile audio league" and not to the sensible audiophile looking for actual value IMO"

This about a $640 product?????? How many Roon ready products do you know of that are less expensive. I know of one or two.

Hysterical. The Sonore design team, Jesus R, John Swensen, etc. could have you for breakfast. Like your friend, you are a knat they will flick away

EDITl The most comical part is you also have never heard or seen it.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 18:56:55
Archimago
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Speaking of "birds of a feather".

As if "The Sonore design team, Jesus R, John Swensen, etc." and other cults of personalities have any magical abilities to change the laws of physics and bend the truth of computer science in engineered products.

A wise man knows that he doesn't *need* to experience everything to be able to be skeptical when he has experience and tested other things and can extrapolate the knowledge.

If Jesus, John, etc... can come up with some engineering evidence, then it's worth a look. Swenson's commentary when he posted on the Regen last year was enough for anyone to read between the lines to question the principles of his beliefs. $640 isn't a big deal but why not spend money elsewhere - like on good music!?

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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 19:04:50
Isaak J. Garvey
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You don't even have the conviction back your rants. And you are a helluva bore.

Design and market your own player. Don't be envious of a company that sold 1000 units in 3 months. Envy is not becoming.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 22, 2016 at 19:27:33
doak
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Just an FYI Abe: I thought the IFi iPower sounded better than the HDPlex and that my ancient Argilent/HP sounded better than either or a battery PSU.
I'd gotten into dual PC's to run Roon and HQP, then was going for the optical network stuff when I called a halt to it all.

Auralic's beta 4.06 beta firmware for the Aries (major SQ improvement) along with changing out the Regen for a Wyred Recovery brought that simple and seemingly bulletproof setup within a hair of the overly complicated and terribly fussy mRendu/dual PC stuff, so I bailed. Sold it all and am SO glad for it.
Back to listening to music again with a system that's instantly available and nearly 100% reliable. That's how I spell RELIEF.

ps: Think you may have voided your warranty. ;-)

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 01:34:56
Archimago
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Isaak writes: "You don't even have the conviction back your rants. And you are a helluva bore.

Design and market your own player. Don't be envious of a company that sold 1000 units in 3 months. Envy is not becoming."

Gee what conviction are you looking for? Taking out a credit card and spending $640 dollars to compare every time Swenson claims something he never proves ? Anybody around here can do that.

It takes more conviction to not be swayed by every hyped product out there and truly stand by one's beliefs and call a spade a spade because it's *obvious*. It's like arguing with folks who have faith in all those Synergistic products!

Anyhow. I stand by the principle that what the uRendu does can be replicated by anyone with a Raspberry Pi and a little knowhow. The software looks good and intuitive. And if they sold just the software at a price like $100, I'd be happy to buy it as I stated above.

Trust me. I have no envy for Mr. Swenson et al. I know not how many they sell nor really care. Good luck to him for making money. It's a tough business and marketing is part of the game. Just interested in what is or what isn't...
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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 01:43:05
soundchekk
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Selling 1000 units in 3 month. Great argument !!!!

Proving what!?!? 1000 audiophile nuts with big wallets running after the next gadget?

I know John Svensson quite well btw.

He's IMO not the most innovative guy. He's pretty much a quality guy.
He pretty much just takes what's there or already known stuff and
applies a little tweaking.
Basically he built a high quality USB hub and now he built a quality Raspberry Pi or rather a Pi Zero.

This all is no rocket science my friend. And for sure not worth 640$ - IMO.

Obviously John has quite convincing communication skills - at least towards his target group "the audiophiles" and "audiophile press". He even managed
to survive the rather tough squeezebox forum.


Don't forget John S as well as e.g Thorsten L. never really built up
their own long lasting businesses as far as I've been able to follow that.
It's one thing to be an excellent engineer and another to run your own business.

On the other hand, try to recall what G. Rankin - the Great - has been selling you audiophiles for years.
"Asynchronous USB Audio - The holy grail"

Some of you/us had and most of you should have realized by now that "Asynchronous USB Audio" wasn't the holy grail of computer audio.
We had quite some arguments about that for quite a while during those days.
And I do think that that marketing myth even slowed down the evolution
of USB audio for quite some time.

All these great engineers, bound to a business, are selling you, what's on the table. Nothing more and nothing less.
Most of them are even aware of the flaws and weaknesses.
Obviously business interests prevent from talking about these.

The (audiophile) industry sells and lives from "Progress" and not "Perfection".

Even if some of us ask for perfection, they argue around it and sell you progress.

Which is fair enough!!! Many people are happy with that. It's a free market out there.

Enjoy.

PS: I'm not defending Archimago btw. I do have my problems with his methods and conclusions myself.


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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 01:59:55
Archimago
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Hey Soundchekk.

Right. We have our disagreements but it's good that we can also agree to disagree on some things while other thoughts resonate. Life's complex.
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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 02:10:26
soundchekk
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Ah yes.

You've been one of the very very very few who received a 30% discount (later on?).

And that even without being an official Reviewer during those days.

Lucky you. It was just a grand. ;)

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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 05:22:46
AbeCollins
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I'm not understanding what your dissatisfaction was with the µRendu. I find it a breeze to setup and use so your comment, "overly complicated and terribly fussy mRendu/dual PC stuff" has me scratching my head.

I run Roon+HQPlayer on the Mac Mini that resides up in my office. It also contains my music library. I run the tiny µRendu in the basement setup and control it with the iPad. Doesn't get much simpler than that and it sounds great.

Warranties are useful only if something breaks. ;-)

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 05:31:16
AbeCollins
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Just for the record the µRendu is not based on the Raspberry Pi. It is based on a SolidRun System on a Module (SoM) with a lot good engineering work on it's carrier board where all the audiophile related optimizations occur.

There might be others but the Bryston BD-π is the only audiophile streamer that I am aware of that uses the Raspberry Pi.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 17:17:23
Archimago
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Right, thank Abe for the clarification. Also thank you for the pictures of the guts of the machine!

IMO, the SolidRun SoM is nothing special and costs something like $65 at most (surely less than that in bulk with just 512M RAM). As for the carrier, good engineering perhaps but I have doubts that this leads to audible difference from say a reference implementation of USB, low power infrastructure, communications bus made with good quality parts. I assume this was probably an custom design with both Swenson & SolidRun's input to interface with their processor board?

I maintain that the best part of this whole system is the software... And wouldn't mind buying that separately.
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RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 18:20:13
AbeCollins
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  Since:
February 2, 2002

Since you claim to own the excellent microRendu, Aurender W20, and the Antipodes DX Reference Server, we'd sure love to get your sonic comparison of each..... or any one of them on it's own merit.


 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 20:47:56
Bibo01
Audiophile

Posts: 648
Joined: December 18, 2008
Furthermore, let's not forget that Solid Run Clearfog is $90!
Have a look at its carrier board.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 21:43:08
Archimago
Audiophile

Posts: 820
Joined: January 18, 2002
Thanks Bibo. ClearFog - nice looking board. USB3 and dual gigabit ethernet on board is interesting and novel in a little computer like this...
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Archimago's Musings: A 'more objective' audiophile blog.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 21:57:41
Bob_C
Audiophile

Posts: 2667
Location: NY
Joined: July 31, 2000
Bibo01,

Very COOL... SFP!

Bob

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 23, 2016 at 22:21:45
Bibo01
Audiophile

Posts: 648
Joined: December 18, 2008
If ClearFog Base had a TDM header like the Pro version, it would be capable of I2S/DSD output too.
Try to imagine: a ClearFog + reclocker added internally to a DAC which would have SFP input.
That would be REALLY cool!!!

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 24, 2016 at 03:10:26
Archimago
Audiophile

Posts: 820
Joined: January 18, 2002
Nice Bibo.

BTW: Anyone here running an optical home network?
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Archimago's Musings: A 'more objective' audiophile blog.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 24, 2016 at 10:14:48
Bob_C
Audiophile

Posts: 2667
Location: NY
Joined: July 31, 2000
Yes many people do. Read CA tons of posts of the subject

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 24, 2016 at 11:35:17
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 37466
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since:
April 5, 2002
$640 isn't a big deal but why not spend money elsewhere - like on good music!?

It all depends upon your objectives. I was skeptical too, as to how its sonic performance compares to my linear power supplied Touch.

Results? I find it offers a worthwhile level of improved transparency, low end response and low level dynamics. The Touch remains a great product, but mine is now used in the garage system.

Total investment closer to $1000 using HD-Plex linear supply.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 24, 2016 at 17:38:37
Archimago
Audiophile

Posts: 820
Joined: January 18, 2002
Thanks Bob,
Will look into that. Does seem to be a lot of expense for the infrastructure as well as the converters. Hopefully things have become more reasonably priced since I looked into this a couple years ago...

-------
Archimago's Musings: A 'more objective' audiophile blog.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 24, 2016 at 19:14:19
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
Do you pride your self on being out of touch? For someone who presents them selves as an "authority", you leave a lot to be desired.

Total expense for optical isolation should be no more than $120..$200 if you go nuts.

You had egg on your face after being schooled on the microRendu, so this was a lame attempt to pivot. Try again.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 25, 2016 at 14:08:35
Bob_C
Audiophile

Posts: 2667
Location: NY
Joined: July 31, 2000
Not costly at all, Ebay is a good source for surplus and generic fiber gear.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 03:29:55
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
Nice review. I'm curious are you using a PS Audio DS DAC? Never mind I found it.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 04:09:15
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
What you don't see by looking at the board is the intense work that went into the design of that unit. That work took 4 US based engineers about 2 years. We had one US based engineer going through the 3000 page manual of the processor looking for ways to improve things. This is expensive work. The microRendu is our flagship product and we do offer a lower cost solution with the Sonicorbiter SE so you have options.

BTW You should know that part of our R$D we tested all kinds of inexpensive ARM boards. Unfortunately, most of them do not have the features we require to meet our goals even in the lower cost offering. For example: The Pi does not utilize a USB hub and this caused issues with high sample rate playback via USB in our tests.

Anyway, I appreciate that this product is not for you and that there are alternatives. However, your opinion of what the mciroRendu should cost are not based on the realty of the situation.

 

RE: Hmmm..., posted on August 28, 2016 at 04:19:01
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
The power supply list on our website is just intended to be a good starting place. Feel free to try other power supplies as long as they meet the minimum requirements of the unit.

 

RE: I'm aware of other reviews...., posted on August 28, 2016 at 04:41:43
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
Michael said the unit had an improved Regen in it because audiophiles would understand what that meant. I'm not sure that they understand that a USB hub on a computer board is really pretty common. Sure John S designed the Regen and also designed the USB hub circuit on the microRendu so his influence there is well noted. However, the requirement of the USB hub circuit on the microRendu was spec'd independently and as a necessity to remove the associated load from the processor. This goes back to my comment above about the Pi.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 04:54:05
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
We don't always do a good job at explaining our products, but you should know some of this. These units are assembled by hand in the USA from very high quality components. For example: The case is ~400 USD and is also custom made for Sonore in the USA. We only make this PS for reviews and for our most demanding customers who want the best. The PS is not our main product and we openly endorse lower cost options for those who can't afford it.

 

RE: I'm aware of other reviews...., posted on August 28, 2016 at 07:47:43
AbeCollins
Audiophile

Posts: 46200
Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since:
February 2, 2002
I am thoroughly enjoying my microRendu.

You have to understand that a couple of my comments are in the context of much earlier posts in this forum. I took a lot of flack for not hearing much benefit in the REGEN I had and subsequently selling it after a couple months.

The photos to 'annoy certain people' is kind of an inside joke as there's an Asylum inmate here who always complains about my posts with pictures. We all know who he is. ;-)


 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 08:01:21
AbeCollins
Audiophile

Posts: 46200
Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since:
February 2, 2002
Although a lot of clever engineering went into the microRendu, especially on the carrier board, is it accurate to say that the microRendu contains one of the Freescale ARM Cortex-A9 dual-core processor "system on a chip" (SoC) that resides on the SolidRun "system on a module" (SoM), running a variant of the Linux operating system booted from the removable microSD card?


 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 08:43:30
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
Jesus:

I want to thank you for all you have done for the computer audio community. Not only the micro Rendu and other products, but your free apps, one of which has allowed me to populate my server with over 1000 SACDs all split and tagged like CDs. :)

For record all the pseudo engineers, "IT Pros", and other wanna bees that populate this forum are not fit to shine your shoes.

Thanks again.

P.S. I believe the SonicOrbiter SE is the least expensive Roon Endpoint on the market, unless I am mistaken. Cheers.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 10:40:18
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
The microRendu replaces whatever streaming device you already use in the audio room. If my customers feel the unit is as good or better compared to whatever they were using before...I'm satisfied.

In regards to making our software available for the Pi...this is off the table for reasons already discussed above.

You comment about value is rather offensive. On Friday night I logged into a unit from remote and helped a customer setup JRiver. I removed his library, loaded it again, checked his settings, and confirmed playback. This was free support and nothing related to the microRendu. I think there is some inherent value there that you overlooked.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 10:56:58
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
I'm not against people doing this. In addition, when we work on projects that are open source everyone in the open source community benefits from it. For example: All the native DSD work we have participated in is available to everyone including our hardware and software competition. Anyway, IMHO if you are going to do a DYI audio project you really are better off using a CuBox.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 11:05:09
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
This does not need to get personal. John is not here attacking anyone.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 11:12:07
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
I posted this in the AudioStream review of the micro.

Optical fiber to Ethernet isolators can result in connection issues. Some users have reported connection issues resulting from firmware deficiencies on the devices and compatibility issues between the various components from different manufacturers. As such, we don't generally advocate the use of these devices. However, I understand that need for some to go "to infinity and beyond." That said, we are sponsoring Ted Brady (CA member) to develop a how to guide related to the use of these devices. The how to guide will show recommended setups and suggest components that work together well. I'll post a link when the guide is complete.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 11:14:55
soundchekk
Audiophile

Posts: 2424
Joined: July 11, 2007
From engineer to engineer.

"These units are assembled by hand in the USA"

What is this supposed to mean!?!?

I can tell you.

That'll most probably mean that you don't have your cost under control.

Guess why Apple builds phones in China!?!?

You might have a chat with T. Loesch.

"The PS is not our main product"

That's absolute ridiculous. On one hand you strive for perfection, spent thousands of hours on reading manuals, and on the other hand you just let one of the most important parts of that solution alone!?!? You gotta be kidding me.

And then there is that 1400$ ??? PS. No words. I'm speachless.


A 300$ Squeezebox Touch should act as kind of role-model reference to you guys what can be done for the money. I mean the Touch had numerous more features a display, remote, power supply... But we can leave that alone for the time being.
And don't forget these squeeze-guys even wrote their own software from scratch! I don't really know exactly: Are you guys using squeezelite as
player engine?? Freeware??

A hint.
As far as I remember the Squeeze Touch folks hired an engineer who didn't have to spent 3000h on reading manuals. This guy knew what he was doing from day 1.



Good luck with your business. All the best.




-----------------------------------------------------------------

blog latest >> The Audio Streaming Series - tuning kit pCP

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 11:16:55
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
That is a mouthful so I'm calling it a SOM for simplicity.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 11:19:31
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
Your welcome. It takes all kinds to make the world go round. I think it is the least expensive Roon Ready endpoint with USB output and I think it was the first.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 11:47:48
sonorejr
Manufacturer

Posts: 14
Location: FL
Joined: May 14, 2011
I'll be sure to take all that under advisement.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 12:22:21
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
You are way out your league.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 12:23:17
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
You are a better man than I...LOL. God bless you man.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 28, 2016 at 12:26:02
Isaak J. Garvey
Industry Professional

Posts: 1207
Location: Hollywod, CA
Joined: January 7, 2016
Thorsten? Hey I like iFi products a lot. But some of his views are so off kilter it is comical.

Designing a streamer is above his pay grade, otherwise he would have done it by now. iFi has every other conceivable component on the market including a phono stage. So leave him out of it.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 29, 2016 at 07:00:26
AbeCollins
Audiophile

Posts: 46200
Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since:
February 2, 2002
Yes, System on a Module (SoM). We had a debate about that in another forum. Thanks.

 

RE: microRendu review & snapshots of its internals (the guts) - pics, posted on August 31, 2016 at 11:55:22
blownsi
Audiophile

Posts: 14
Location: Ohio
Joined: January 29, 2006
Sonore's own Sonicorbiter SE is a cheaper solution.

 

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