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Speculations on rocks

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Posted on April 20, 2011 at 15:33:04
unclestu
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Posted here, because of the speculative nature of the content.


Fact: Diamonds have good bass but rolled off highs

Fact: Citrine follows in the similar sound quality.

Fact: Amethyst has very good top end and upper midrange energy.

Fact: Diamonds and most other crystals, are thermoluminescent, whereby the crystals pick up stray electrons, trapping them in their latticework, and can release them later along with a photon (QED). This fact is utilized by archeologists to date buried artifacts ( flint and other material normally not datable by carbon), by heating the crystals up to 900 degrees and having a photomultiplier present as they do so to count photons released. Apparently, exposure to even light purges the stray electrons within the crystal thus "resetting" the crystal back to zero, giving a rough time line as to when the crystal or rock was reburied., as the natural radiation i the earth "recharges" the crystal.

Fact: Amethyst transforms itself into clear quartz when heated to 450 degrees C and into citrine when hated to 550 C.

Fact: Clear quartz does not quite have the openness of amethyst.

Fact: In addition to the trace amount of iron, amethysts are supposedly to obtain the darker shades of purple by exposure to natural radiation contained in the soil in which they are buried. The darkest shades seem to come from deeper within the earth.

Speculation: Being that the piezo effect means that an EMI field hitting a piezo electric crystal can generate movement and thus help dissipate energy, could it be possible that the citrine and diamonds have their unique sound signature because they are absorbing some of the electrons?

Perhaps amethysts have a lattice work which is "full" and thus more energy is transformed into mechanical motion. While some mineralogists warn that prolonged exposure to sunlight will bleach out the coloring of stones, most amethyst is fairly stable color wise.

I have tried heating some matched amethyst beads with an alcohol lamp and have succeeded in creating clear and a slight citrine coloration. The experiment was interesting because I could listen to the purple application and then heat the crystals up and reevaluate. One caveat: the crystal can "pop" like popcorn and they are very hot! Theoretically, the crystals remain unchanged except for the application of heat. The molecular structure is supposedly unchanged, but there are distinct differences in color and in sound when applied, with the top end distinctly being rolled off.

Incidentally, if you missed it over on Tweaks, sugar is also piezo electric and using a sugar cube certainly makes an effect. The cool thing about sugar cubes is that you can shape the cube and it most certainly has an effect upon the sound ( see the post on Tweaks for more information, a reply to FidPup's query about crystal alternatives).

Again YMMV.

Stu

 

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Although, posted on April 20, 2011 at 17:33:53
bartc
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I got no change from treated and untreated granlulated pure cane sugar, some claim to get it from rock sugar crystal. OK, so sugar is piezoelectric, which should put some of Geoff Kaitt's "nyah, nyah, nyah" comments about it not being a piezo effect to shame!

 

Bearing in mind, posted on April 20, 2011 at 18:28:32
unclestu
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the attraction of sugar to ants, we did coat some sugar balls with nail polish, both clear and a colored one. The sound got progressively worse, losing dynamics and transient attacks and generally increasing in muddiness as the colors darkened. The naked sugar cubes seemed to work best.

Sugar cubes are simply granulated sugar set up into a set shape, so I suspect your negative results may be due to the fact that the sugar crystals may be simply too heavy for the piezo effect to display itself when allowed to simply sit without out an elastomeric base.

Again YMMV

Stu

 

RE: Although, posted on April 21, 2011 at 18:31:29
You said you got no change from sugar, which is piezoelectric. That actually supports my position. Nyah, nyah, nyah.

 

RE: Speculations on rocks, posted on April 21, 2011 at 20:15:51
Tony Lauck
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Have these observations been applied to live musical instruments, or just recorded playback?

Tony Lauck

"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar

 

Thanks Stu n/t, posted on April 22, 2011 at 15:58:31
Awe-d-o-file
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ET

"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936

 

only on, posted on April 25, 2011 at 11:38:53
unclestu
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on electronic playback systems, although I have come to similar conclusions when applied to mixers and such.

Stu

 

RE: More Speculations on rocks, posted on May 2, 2011 at 12:52:26
unclestu
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Ran a whole host of back to back experimentation last night. had not really tested tourmaline and rose quartz, but did so. Previously I had only experimented with some cut and faceted jewelry findings, small stones faceted about 2 mm across.

Rose quartz has a darker presentation, with more muted top end, and a definitely murkier presentation as a result. Tourmaline is much better but has a slight upper midrange hump and is not as extended in the top end as the amethyst.

Surprisingly a reshaped sugar cube (spherical) proved to be overall superior to the above two, having a slight upper bass hump but good dynamics and a fairly even frequency response. Lumps of rock sugar sounded terrible, BTW. However, a cubical sugar cube also sounded very bad so a lot may have to do with the actual physical configuration of the crystal structure itself.

In light of some later comments about the Stein which somehow involves a blue LED and a crystal, I tried a bit of experimentation utilizing an white light led flashlight and a a cathedral spear of citrine that I had, about 1/2 inch in diameter and about 2 inches long. New Agers consider this spear to be very "powerful" and I have never found another spear quite like it.

Shining the led into the base of the crystal yielded an improvement in the system top end, extending the top end a bit more. Shining through the sides yielded no noticeable improvement and in fact there might have been a slight degradation in sound. Shining through the crystal top yielded quite a noticeable improvement in sound: harder transient attacks, yielding a crisper sound, and greater details in tonality which gives a firmer soundstage and greater depth and general placement.

It made no difference holding the crystal or placing it upon a firm or infirm surface. Covering the crystal and light with a pillow diminishes the top end slightly. The Stein uses a blue light led ( about 420 nM) and I suppose perhaps a higher and shorter wavelength light may through more energy into the crystal. It is interesting to note that the crystalline latticework of the quartz based items is a spiral, thus perhaps accounting for the difference in sound from shining the light through the sides vs the top. The bottom of the spear, it should be noted, had been attached to the matrix and thus was partially occluded, perhaps accounting for the difference. Unfortunately my only double terminated quartz crystals, ( Herkimers) are imbeded in matrix.

I am going to purchase an UV led flashlight and grab my laser pointer for further experimentation.


Stu

 

RE: More Speculations on rocks, posted on May 2, 2011 at 13:06:10
pixelphoto
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I'm really learning a lot from your posts. I like to experiment, but you have really got a handle on things.

 

RE: More Speculations on rocks, posted on May 4, 2011 at 01:49:11
edbk
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Great findings Stu!

I've been experimenting a lot aswell lately and got about 20-30 more crystal types coming. However I did notice a recharging effect on clear quartz when put in the sunlight for an hour or 2, it brightens the top end which diminishes again over a 2-3 days period.

My current favourites by far are natural selenite wands on anything signal path related, they do seem to keep their tonal balance. I use golden labradorite to tame them down a little when the top end gets too hot.

Led lights up next.

 

Mpost interesting! (nt), posted on May 4, 2011 at 16:47:05
unclestu
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STU

 

Follow up, posted on May 10, 2011 at 15:18:34
unclestu
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I am wondering if the intense UV from the sun has anything to do with the effect you have noticed. To that end, I've ordered a UV flashlight to check. UV borders on the "softer" x ray range and should produce a tremendous amount of energy and possibly a source of ions.

They're on their way so I'll follow up with the results of experimentation.

Thanks for sharing the comments.

Stu

 

RE: Follow up, posted on May 10, 2011 at 23:54:56
edbk
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Nice! My experiments are currently holding for the enormous batch of crystal types coming in. I should have 50-60 different types in stock over the next few days. I do wonder about crystals losing their effect over time and if they need "recharging" at that point.

 

I notice, posted on May 11, 2011 at 15:40:44
unclestu
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that you're in Europe: good place to be for collecting various minerals. Haven't been to the Netherlands, but I've been in France, Italy and Switzerland and there are a large number of mineral specimens available. I went to a little store in Chamonix and they had loads of amethyst geodes, with the darkest purple crystals imaginable: almost black, and throughout Paris I saw the most interesting specimens of pyrite, apophrolite, and many other crystals, sometimes in the most unlikely of places (like a train station). I'd be very interested in hearing more of your findings.


Thanks again,

Stu

 

RE: I notice, posted on May 17, 2011 at 09:28:46
edbk
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I'm gonna be busy ;)

 

Innocent question...., posted on May 17, 2011 at 10:02:20
I'd be curious if you notice any physical or "psychological" effects, good bad or indifferent, from being in proximity to all those crystals. Yes, I'm being serious.

Cheers

 

RE: Speculations on rocks, posted on May 17, 2011 at 11:40:14
Are you guys putting these on top of your equipment or what?

 

RE: Innocent question...., posted on May 17, 2011 at 12:58:13
edbk
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funny you mention that since I was indeed getting a little lightheaded, dizzy, was a bit uncomfortable so I packed em all away for later evaluation. Still a bit nauseous.

 

RE: Innocent question...., posted on May 17, 2011 at 14:00:08
Interesting, isn't it? After all, they're just rocks.

 

RE: Innocent question...., posted on May 17, 2011 at 14:02:39
edbk
Audiophile

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Joined: March 25, 2011
Could be a coincidence ;) I guess I should take em all out again tomorrow and see if the same thing happens ;) Btw with all the rocks on the table I had a bigass midrange suckout for the few minutes I listened.

 

RE: Innocent question...., posted on May 17, 2011 at 15:56:28
I have noticed similar things. One needs to be careful when arbitrarily putting the crystals on a table or on the floor. Maybe best to take them out of the house entirely.

 

RE: Speculations on rocks, posted on May 19, 2011 at 15:41:28
unclestu
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Yes I do. The crystal work particularly well above (or below) motors: TT and CD spin motors generate quite an EMF field. They work well over transformers, and when placed in the center of a toroidal transformer add a bit of sweetness to the sound taking away an edgy quality sometimes heard. For the piezo effect to be utilized, you need to place the crystals above ares where there are high EMF fields.

Stu

 

Wow, posted on May 19, 2011 at 15:46:49
unclestu
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That's a lot of rocks.

Incidentally following up on your physical effects, in my very first post on the subject, I became interested because as a collector of mineral specimens, I had a medium sized quartz cluster centered between my speakers. My system, had a perpetual upper frequency edge to the music, which could not be eliminated no matter what I tried.

Finally as the cluster was getting very dusty I took it out and hosed it down, leaving it out to dry in the sun. To my surprise the upper "edginess" disappeared. Replacing the cluster back in the old position brought it back. I suspect that the cluster was receiving RFI and simply reradiating back into the room.


Stu

 

RE: "I suspect that the cluster was receiving RFI and simply reradiating back into the room.", posted on May 19, 2011 at 16:11:02
Geez, Louise, it couldn't possibly have been the sound pressure peak centered between the speakers that was to blame. It always has to be RFI with you. LOL

If the quartz cluster was re-radiating RFI back into the room, as you "theorize", the RFI was already there in the room to begin with! LOL I foresee a new theory from you - quartz crystals as magnets and radiators for RFI. They attract and repel at the same time! Using the principles of quantum mechanics. LOL

 

RE: "I suspect that the cluster was receiving RFI and simply reradiating back into the room.", posted on May 20, 2011 at 04:01:38
edbk
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Joined: March 25, 2011
Didnt get back on this yet but the effect this large amount of crystals has on my phsysical being is repeatable. I had to store thw whole lot of them away in a box because being close to them makes me nautious/dizzy, whenever I enter the room where they are and get close to the box I get dizzy/nautious. It feels colder in the room aswell, funny enough I have one of those air purifiers with negative ion generation and it struck me that sortoff gives the same "cold/fresh" feel in a room. So maybe I've got some mayor negative ion production going on. Anyway I'm a bit baffled by this, bought them for better sound but there's obviously something going on with these "rocks".. Next time somebody dares to enter my home I will direct him to the room and see what happens to him ;)

 

RE: "I suspect that the cluster was receiving RFI and simply reradiating back into the room.", posted on May 20, 2011 at 05:37:13
Some folks report negative physical and/or mental "side effects" from the Schumann Frequency generators similar to the effects you descibe for the crystals. Difficult to say if there's any connection, or to why everyone doesn't experience these side effects with crystals and the Schumann Frequency generator. Or with batteries or magnets, for that matter.

 

RE: "I suspect that the cluster was receiving RFI and simply reradiating back into the room.", posted on May 20, 2011 at 09:29:57
May Belt
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And if you were listening to music with all of the crystals in the room, you would experience the music to be sounding worse – along the lines of it being much more “harsh, aggressive and shouty sound”

I don’t think you could guarantee that another person would react with the same PHYSICAL reactions to the presence of all those crystals in the room but I would feel quite confident that they would be able to HEAR the same deterioration in the sound as you would.

I am afraid it will have to be the laborious technique of introducing the different crystals – one by one – into the room and seeing how you both react physically and also what the music sounds like.

I would like to make it quite clear. I do not challenge people’s observations and the descriptions of improvements in the sound of their audio. I recognise what they are hearing.

Nor can your physical symptoms be because of auto-suggestion, bias, imagination etc because no one had suggested to you that you would feel physically worse with the crystals in the room.

Stay on the path of observing your physical reactions Those observations will get you further along the path of understanding than thinking how the audio signal or the room acoustics might be being affected by the crystals.

Regards,
May Belt,
Manufacturer.

 

F- for comprehension, posted on May 20, 2011 at 12:57:44
unclestu
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You just don't know how those quartz oscillators work, do you, Mr. "rocket scientist" and "theoretical physicist"?

Your cup of ignorance simply overflows.

Stu

PS Ran out of your prescription for Ritalin, did ya?

 

The Haldol must be kicking in, posted on May 20, 2011 at 14:46:35
Hey, I'll do the pharmaceutical jokes here, if you don't mind. Geez, try to come up with some new material.

 

RE: Speculations on rocks, posted on May 30, 2011 at 07:27:39
Rob Brown
Audiophile

Posts: 58
Joined: June 4, 2000
I tried putting an obsidian crystal on my preamp and a piece of amethyst on my power amp transformer. Not sure if it helped but it certainly didn't make anything worse. This is an interesting thing to experiment with. Somewhere I have a piece of citrine as well. There used to be a new age shop in town that sold these rocks at reasonable prices. Now they are a small fortune at the shops here.

 

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