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Look what I found in my woofer boxes.

76.90.39.24

Posted on December 20, 2016 at 16:13:12
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 11859
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002



I wonder how all that stuff got in there? :-)

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

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RE: Look what I found in my woofer boxes., posted on December 20, 2016 at 22:22:46
amandarae
Audiophile

Posts: 2225
Location: So.Cal
Joined: November 30, 2004
Cool!

 

RE: Look what I found in my woofer boxes., posted on December 21, 2016 at 08:53:11
moray james
Manufacturer

Posts: 1385
Location: Calgary on the Bow
Joined: May 19, 2002
those are special. They were designed to be used with the louvre style lenses but I much prefer them without as the lense screws up the image but does for dispersion exactly what they say it will. I have a set of L200B with similar drivers and trumpets. these were sota of the day and still sound spectacular today. congratulations on your very special find. moray james.
moray james

 

RE: Look what I found in my woofer boxes., posted on December 21, 2016 at 09:23:45
Inmate51
Audiophile

Posts: 8490
Joined: July 6, 2005
Clearly, you're not very organized, 'cause those are not woofers.

:)

 

By way of explaination...., posted on December 21, 2016 at 16:36:01
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 11859
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
I've been listening to the JBL 4331A speakers for 15 years now but only using the woofers as part of my bi-amped system.

I've been meaning to remove the unused drivers/horns and the crossovers for all these years and finally got around to it.

It's time to re-tune the boxes now that I've increased the internal volume.

I guess I should listen to the 2420/2312 horns just for fun before I ebay them.

From what I understand the 2420 is the exact same driver as the le85?

Thanks for playing along. :-)

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

RE: By way of explaination...., posted on December 22, 2016 at 14:01:50
Uncle Mike
Audiophile

Posts: 2174
Location: Eastern Pa.
Joined: June 20, 2003
I have a pair of L200 speakers modified to L200b (136 woofer & crossover mods) I have played with making them 3 way adding different horn tweeters over the years. The L77 (I think the 2403-2405 are similar) glass radiator is among my favorites.
BTW I just love the design of the L200 cabinet.
All that being said I think you owe it to yourself to put the horns back in and have a listen.

 

RE: By way of explaination...., posted on December 22, 2016 at 19:27:09
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 11859
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
I use the JBL woofers in the 4331a enclosures with a SS amp crossed at 200Hz.

The mids are JBL 2118 passively crossed at 2500Hz into a Heil AMT and driven by my DIY 300b SET amps.

I don't want to play the JBL 15's all the way up to 800Hz and I know the horns won't play down to 200Hz.

I was thinking of trying the 2420/2312 crossed at 2500Hz in place of my Heil AMT tweeters.

What do you think?

Tre'


Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

RE: By way of explaination...., posted on December 23, 2016 at 00:58:33
Uncle Mike
Audiophile

Posts: 2174
Location: Eastern Pa.
Joined: June 20, 2003
Now your over my head.... What I did was with Zilch's(God bless him) mentoring some years ago.
The guys at Lansing Heritage are the ones you want to discuss those particulars.
I drive my L200's with either a Citation II or an LK150, both updated and somewhat modified. They are efficient, as you know, so there is plenty from either amp to drive them. I'm happy with where I have gotten them now.
I guess what gets me is why break up a fine set of speakers? Why not use them as intended or at least put them back and reevaluate.

 

RE: By way of explaination...., posted on December 23, 2016 at 08:06:10
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 11859
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
"I guess what gets me is why break up a fine set of speakers? Why not use them as intended or at least put them back and reevaluate."

Because I'm not a gear head.

I'm not interested in owning a classic speaker just because it's a classic speaker. I want the best sound I can get and IMO using the JBL 15s the way I do gives me the best sound.

IMO a 15 woofer doesn't sound good playing higher than 100Hz but it's hard to find a really good midrange speaker that is both efficient and will play properly all the way down to 100Hz so I have to cross at 200Hz.

I need really efficient speakers for the midrange and highs because, for that range, I use single ended 300b amplifiers (not a lot of power) because I think they sound much better than push pull amplifiers but they don't have enough damping factor to play bass so I bi-amp with SS for the woofers.

I could put the 4331As back together and sell them and then buy some 2231s or 2235s and build woofer boxes but I'm lazy these days and I already have the (very well built) 4331 cabs.

It's not that I don't understand where you're coming from but if I hang on to the horns and crossovers my wife and daughter can sell the complete 4331As after I'm dead but life is too short to worry about breaking up "a fine set of speakers".

Thanks for your input.

Tre'





Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

try the 2480, posted on December 23, 2016 at 15:35:55
merdy
Audiophile

Posts: 1017
Joined: July 25, 2001
I had a similar rig like you way back and I used the 2480 in a large 200hz first octave audio horn crossed at 300hz and then at 6k it was awsome with my 300b
I think this is the best jbl midrange driver ever ,i moved on to altec and the 515b with 288g tickles me silly

 

RE: try the 2480, posted on December 23, 2016 at 19:32:31
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 11859
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
I have thought about going all horns on top.

At one time I had 416s in a Karlson enclosures with 511s (I can't remember what drivers) and 075s.

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

RE: if you have the room, posted on December 27, 2016 at 14:26:34
bean
Audiophile

Posts: 325
Joined: November 4, 2003
you could try John Inlow's 135hz horns, you get low enough in the mids and nice efficiency. Cross the 2420's around 1000 or so.

The Inlow horns are pretty deep, tho. I thought about adding between my 136a and 2420/tractrix, but it's physically just too deep for my room.

[edited for typo]

 

RE: Look what I found in my woofer boxes., posted on January 11, 2017 at 20:40:25
DominicPorter
Audiophile

Posts: 18
Location: Montreal
Joined: August 9, 2016
That looks awful familiar!
I've just been reevaluating my uh, collection as it were and have been wondering in my head what is the best way to put the components of my own 4331As into service.
I'm curious what kind of sounds can be gotten out of the 2420s, especially bi-amped with a horn designed for sound quality rather than flatness and dispersion.
Also looking at a PP bass with my 300b up top.

 

RE: Look what I found in my woofer boxes., posted on January 11, 2017 at 21:00:44
DominicPorter
Audiophile

Posts: 18
Location: Montreal
Joined: August 9, 2016
Iwatas maybe?

 

RE: By way of explaination...., posted on January 15, 2017 at 07:28:24
weltersys
Industry Professional

Posts: 670
Location: NM
Joined: September 28, 2004
In Reply to: RE: By way of explaination.... posted by Uncle Mike on December 22, 2016 at 14:01:50

I use the JBL woofers in the 4331a enclosures with a SS amp crossed at 200Hz.

"The mids are JBL 2118 passively crossed at 2500Hz into a Heil AMT and driven by my DIY 300b SET amps.

I don't want to play the JBL 15's all the way up to 800Hz and I know the horns won't play down to 200Hz.

I was thinking of trying the 2420/2312 crossed at 2500Hz in place of my Heil AMT tweeters.

What do you think?

Tre'"

Tre,

I think the 2420 on the exponential horns you have, without the lens, is perhaps the most musical sounding HF driver I have ever listened to, on axis. They have only a 10 degree (or so) pattern at 16 kHz, but the narrowing pattern flattens the falling HF response of the 2420.
I used them in my 1979 sound system stage monitors.
For around 8 months while building that system, I used a clock radio to drive one of the active two-way monitors, which had an EV-15L (I preferred the EV woofers over the JBLs of that era) and the 2420/horn had a protection capacitor (18 MFD, IIRC) which passively put it in around 800 Hz or so, the 6 dB per octave transition worked well with the EV-15L raw response.
With less than a watt, the speaker was loud enough to "get over" the noise of saws and belt sanders, yet was very "high fi" on axis. Since most of my work was done at a bench, the narrow HF dispersion was fine, and also made life more livable for my friend who worked at a desk 30 feet away in the same basement.

Art "Memory Lane" Welter

 

RE: By way of explaination...., posted on January 17, 2017 at 10:35:32
DominicPorter
Audiophile

Posts: 18
Location: Montreal
Joined: August 9, 2016
That's confidence inspiring.
I mean, taken with the caveat that you were working in a noisy environment it's hard to say, but at least it gives me the confidence to stick with what i have and try and work with it rather than just dump everything and try something else. Resale on used 2420's isn't quite enough for me to recoup my costs if I cannibalize my 4331s.

 

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