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inexpensive small footprint universal player?

50.101.70.203
Posted on December 1, 2016 at 15:57:39
Jim Pearce
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Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 I'm looking for something for my bedroom "system" - just a 51" plasma TV and a Polk MagniFi Mini 2.1 speaker/sub. One dealer I know in Waterloo ON has a Cambridge Audio 651bd w/ new laser for $375. Sounds like a good deal and could even back up the Oppo BDP-95 in my main system. Anything else I should consider?

 

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RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 5, 2016 at 02:17:02
fantja
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Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Jim-
the 651BD is a very fine player for $375.

 

Less than the cost per annum of the DV-50!, posted on December 5, 2016 at 05:23:13
Jim Pearce
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Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 The real audiophile tragedy here is that I really am likely to send the Esoteric DV-50 for recycling when it only needs an $80 U.S. laser. But the Oppo is just as good for music, and so good with movie sound that my next step on my main system will be to replace the old Pioneer Elite 50" with a 4K display. I'll then go HDMI direct from the Oppo to the display and use the Anthem AVM20 as a pure analog pre-amp.

 

RE: "the Oppo is just as good for music", posted on December 5, 2016 at 16:06:09
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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 Don't know what kind of music you guys listen to up there in Canada but NOTHING I've ever heard on an OPPO sounded half as good as if played on an Esoteric deck.

OK, maybe Country Western sounds the same.

Maybe.




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: My concerns with Oppo are....., posted on December 5, 2016 at 17:14:31
AbeCollins
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Location: USA
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Contributor
  Since: February 2, 2002
 Having experienced the Oppo HA-1 DAC/headphone amp/pre-amp makes me a little gun shy on Oppo electronics in general. You also had the Oppo HA-1. While it is very versatile I thought it was a bit lean and clinical sounding.... no body or soul. I think you get what I'm talking about. I'm wondering if the Oppo players sound anything like the HA-1 DAC/headphone amp.




 

RE: OPPO Players..., posted on December 5, 2016 at 18:15:01
Ivan303
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Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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 To me they do, but I haven't spent much time listening to them and none at all in my main system. The 'Lean and Clinical' sound of the HA-1 was not as noticeable when using the Balanced Headphone Out jack to my HD-600 cans but in my main system it was worse than the cheapo Marantz NA-7004 as a USB DAC.

Had a chance to compare the OPPO Silver Disk spinner at a friends place, compared to a Computer output to a DAC but I can't remember the model of the DAC. Not DSD or Delta Sigma, an older one but considered 'Audiophile". All this with CDs and not SACD.

"The DV-50 uses Burr-Brown PCM1738 24-bit/192kHz DACs in a fully balanced dual-differential configuration. These DACs can convert linear PCM up to 24 bits and a 192kHz sampling rate, but not DSD. However they do have a DSD decoder interface for SACD playback, which TEAC uses in the DV-50."

Link below:

I also prefer the Esoteric players (DV-60) which use the Cirrus Logic CS4398, as does my Marantz DV-9600.


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

a side note..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 07:22:40
Jim Pearce
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Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 The Esoteric DV-50 doesn't decode HDCD - in fact it doesn't play them well - and the Oppo does it brilliantly. This is important to me because I have a ton of old Reference Recordings and (being a Canadian I have to love alt country) Emmylou Harris has a penchant for HDCD as well. Wrecking Ball through the Oppo is a delight, with the Esoteric it was a little incoherent.

 

RE: "love alt country"..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 07:50:23
Ivan303
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Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001

I KNEW it!

I do not own the HDCD above, but I would guess you do?

I think my Marantz DV-9600 must do HDCD all right (or ignores it altogether?) as I have a lot of Professor Johnson's stuff around here as well and it sounds great.




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

from Kal's 2011 review..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 07:04:51
Jim Pearce
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Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 Regarding the comparison between the stereo SACD sound between the Oppo and his reference, the Sony 54000ES:

"Again, the sound was superb, but differences quickly became apparent. The Sony had its characteristic clean and immediate sound, and sometimes switching to the Oppo seemed to put solo voices, such as Andrew Manze's violin, a bit back. However, the BDP-95 was consistently more open and spacious, with better articulation of all the instruments. This was most apparent with Sara K.'s "Set You Free": voice and guitar were clearly those of the same performer. Through the Sony, her voice took center stage and all else dimmed. Once I'd heard that difference, I heard parallel differences with the other discs, which led me to prefer the Oppo for its overall delineation and presentation of space."

http://www.stereophile.com/content/music-round-50-page-2-0#3GhLIFleuKIkZSo6.97

I was struck back then by how much his description reminded me of the sound of the Esoteric DV-50 in my system, and pressed him to reassure me that I would be happy with the change. But he kept a professional distance: he had the Esoteric only briefly etc.. Anyway, I dithered because I couldn't get the full benefit of Blu ray and HDMI without updating my old Pioneer Elite plasma and I just didn't want to do that until the standards settled. Well now they have, but the irony is that I may soon find myself buying the new 4K Oppo.

 

The new 4K Oppo doesn't stream Netflix,, posted on December 6, 2016 at 09:36:44
oldmkvi
Audiophile

Posts: 10583
Joined: April 12, 2002
 and costs less than half what the 105D sells for.
Some places don't even have the 105D anymore.
I wonder about the Audio quality on the new one, why such a difference in price?

 

the 203 is the BDP-103 replacement..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 10:04:07
Jim Pearce
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Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 From the preliminary description I don't think it will have high quality stereo outs, nor is it intended to be an audiophile quality player. I guess it remains to be seen whether or not there will be a 205.

 

Thanks for the good info! nt, posted on December 6, 2016 at 10:05:53
oldmkvi
Audiophile

Posts: 10583
Joined: April 12, 2002
 /

 

RE: Thanks for the good info! nt, posted on December 12, 2016 at 18:31:51
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

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Joined: January 4, 2002
 Here you go, there will be a 205! http://www.avsforum.com/oppo-udp-203-4k-ultra-hd-blu-ray-player-released/

 

another thing..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 10:31:05
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 looks like I can chain the UDP-203 with my BDP-95 to output the analog surround sound with the sound only HDMI out on the 203 and the HDMI in on the BDP-95. Although I'm always wary of CEC and HDCP conflicts, so this remains to be determined.

 

oh wait!, posted on December 6, 2016 at 11:35:15
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 That would be the BDP-105, I don't have an HDMI input.

 

Admit to not having heard the BDP-95...., posted on December 6, 2016 at 07:45:09
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
 Thinking the OPPO I heard at a friends home was the BDP-105 (stock).

As a 'tubes and horns' guy the last thing I want for long term listening is 'detail' and the OPPO I owned (Abe's old HA-1) had detail and then some. I blame the Sabre chip set for that but I could be wrong. I've gone a long way into Burr Brown Ladder DACs (two Audio-GD DACs in the house now) with a total of 12 PCM-1704UKs in the streams, so the DAC inside the DV-50 is likely just what I would be able to deal with.

So if you want to unload it...


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

It could be done..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 08:32:26
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 If you can arrange freight, pickup and boxing - or compensate me for it. I was serious about not wanting to throw it out: I've put out a lukewarm ad to see if I can get a few hundred for it but don't expect any response.

 

50 lbs is a lot of packaging and shipping from Canada..., posted on December 6, 2016 at 14:41:37
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
 If you could throw a visa for entry into Canada into the box, it might well be worth the expense. ;-)

Sill, the look on my wife's face when I tell her it's ANOTHER CD player (of which we already have 4 or 5) would also help justify the expense.




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: 50 lbs is a lot of packaging and shipping from Canada..., posted on December 9, 2016 at 03:29:09
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Ivan303-

which 4/5 players do you own?

 

cantankerous as ever..., posted on December 5, 2016 at 16:24:42
Jim Pearce
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Joined: January 4, 2002
 Brahms actually sounds better on the Oppo.

 

RE: cantankerous as ever..., posted on December 8, 2016 at 05:25:52
Disbeliever
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Joined: June 1, 2012
 Will sound better still on a Sony. I also find Esoteric unlistenable too cold & clinical

 

De gustibus non est disputandum..., posted on December 8, 2016 at 06:57:43
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 My experience is that the Oppo BDP-95 and Esoteric DV-50 sound very similar (in my system) with most music formats, while the Oppo is much better with both HDCD and movie sound through the 5.1 analog outs - giving me Blu ray compatibility and a path forward to a new HDMI display while maintaining the analog only Anthem AVM 20 pre-pro.

The Oppo also frees up some room in my rack, so that if I wanted a 2 channel player like my old Marantz SA-14 with a warmer sound - or even a DAC preferably with HDMI input and XLR output - I could throw it in. While I was never happy with warmer sounding players, I am open to the possibility that I just never owned the right one. I can say that my brother's Meridian played redbook CD better than the Esoteric in my system but I don't play a lot of plain vanilla CDS.

 

RE: De gustibus non est disputandum..., posted on December 8, 2016 at 09:01:28
Disbeliever
Audiophile

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 I found the Oppo 103 has inferior SQ & PQ compared to far cheaper Sony BD player 1000ES however this was using Sony DA5400ES AVR UK version which includes HATS. I play both redbook CDs & mch SACDs on my Sony XA5400ES and found Esoteric players virtually unlistenable , only hope my Sony combo lasts for 25 years like the Marantz CD94 but at my age I will never know.

 

the BDP-103 is entirely different..., posted on December 8, 2016 at 09:35:10
Jim Pearce
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Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 No high quality analog outputs and a single DAC channel instead of four devoted to each. I use the unbalanced high quality outputs for the front LR of 5.1 as well - same as I did with the DV-50. But then again, if you found Esoteric players incoherent you wouldn't like this player either: it sounds very similar. Regarding video my understanding is that with a top end 4K TV I'll be using Source Direct over HDMI and relying on the processing in the TV, so it's a moot point.

 

RE: the BDP-103 is entirely different..., posted on December 9, 2016 at 03:31:03
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Keep me posted -Jim.

 

RE: the BDP-103 is entirely different..., posted on December 9, 2016 at 01:57:46
Disbeliever
Audiophile

Posts: 1877
Joined: June 1, 2012
 I only use HDMI and told there will be no difference between Oppo 95 & Oppo 103 for SQ & PQ which is inferior to far cheaper Sony players same goes for the 105.

 

Before you throw it in the Garbage..., posted on December 5, 2016 at 18:17:33
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
 Send me an email.

I will promise it will spend the rest of it's days in a proper social and political environment. =:-0




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: Less than the cost per annum of the DV-50!, posted on December 5, 2016 at 06:42:22
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Yes, Jim-
I do remember your thread on the Esoteric DV-50. Recycling?

 

throwing it out!, posted on December 5, 2016 at 07:34:47
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 Seems a shame. I might post an ad in Canuckaudiomart to see if someone wants to salvage it. Still a great player but it just takes up so much space!

 

RE: throwing it out!, posted on December 5, 2016 at 13:25:42
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 15524
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
 Yes, a shame indeed, Jim

I enjoyed the Esoteric for SACD playback only. I do not care for the DV series rbcd playback. Hope you have a change of heart, get the machine fixed, and keep it.

Happy Listening!

 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 2, 2016 at 18:50:20
AbeCollins
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Posts: 46302
Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since: February 2, 2002
 I recently bought the Sony UHP-H1 for $300 off Amazon.com. I'm using it in a very basic 2-ch setup with TV in the family room. Picture quality is great and it plays my Blu-rays and SACDs.



 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 3, 2016 at 13:31:52
Disbeliever
Audiophile

Posts: 1877
Joined: June 1, 2012
 Sony UHP-H1 now down to £299 in UK, what is it connected to for SACD and how is the sound.

 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 3, 2016 at 14:51:21
AbeCollins
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Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since: February 2, 2002
It sounds fine but I can't offer a serious evaluation because it's in a system that is very basic for the TV/family room. I have the Sony attached to a modest 5.1 ch AV receiver in a 2-ch only setup with a pair of Tannoy bookshelf speakers. It's great for the family room but I haven't had the Sony in my main setup down in the basement for a good audio focused evaluation.


 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 4, 2016 at 00:02:10
Disbeliever
Audiophile

Posts: 1877
Joined: June 1, 2012
 Hi Abe is it possible to give the new Sony a SACD/CD evaluation in your main system , would it be HDMI or analogue connected, thanks.

 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 4, 2016 at 05:31:22
AbeCollins
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Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since: February 2, 2002
 Unfortunately no. The Sony is set up in a tight spot that's not easy to get to w/o moving the rack out into the room. Maybe when things settle down a bit as we have been busy with holiday related stuff.

 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 4, 2016 at 06:18:08
Disbeliever
Audiophile

Posts: 1877
Joined: June 1, 2012
 OK Thanks

 

amusing reading..., posted on December 3, 2016 at 13:12:38
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 I just saved a ton of money this summer because Bryston honoured the warranty on my 6B-SST some 14 years after the purchase. heck, they not only fixed it but updated the soft switch circuitry and replaced parts that were likely to fail. And they also fixed my 4B-SST some years back. But I wouldn't sweat this stuff on a $500 purchase. This player does sound interesting. But with Sony you also have to hope you don't run into a technical question: I'll be using the Audio Return Channel so I am a little concerned. On the other hand, Sony can usually be counted on for fewer anomalies in their implementation of advanced features. Usually...

 

RE: inexpensive small footprint universal player?, posted on December 1, 2016 at 16:14:26
samac
Audiophile

Posts: 780
Location: midwest
Joined: August 28, 2004

That Cambridge looks like a ver good component. If want to check out a new affordable option you might look at the Sony UHP-H1.

I really like mine. It has a fantastic picture and audio sounds very good as well. It can stream all kinds of video and audio.

Cheers,

Scott

 

I'm out of date...again..., posted on December 1, 2016 at 16:57:12
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 I had no idea Sony made players that support DVD-A. Looks intriguing for about $85 (CDN) more, I wonder if the video's as good as the Qdeo in the Oppo and Cambridge Audio?

 

RE: I'm out of date...again..., posted on December 2, 2016 at 08:54:18
Disbeliever
Audiophile

Posts: 1877
Joined: June 1, 2012
 Sony picture & sound I always find far better than Oppo or Cambridge two brands that I would never buy again. However the Sony costs approx. $500 in the UK not about $85 if I have read you post correctly

 

You read wrong..., posted on December 2, 2016 at 10:00:36
Jim Pearce
Audiophile

Posts: 23687
Joined: January 4, 2002
 The cost is $350 U.S., about $85 (CDN) more than the used 651bd. After I pay taxes etc. it would be over $500. As for Oppo, I'm very happy with mine, to the point where I'm ready to recycle my old Esoteric DV-50.

 

RE: I'm out of date...again..., posted on December 1, 2016 at 17:56:04
samac
Audiophile

Posts: 780
Location: midwest
Joined: August 28, 2004
 I'm not a videophile but I think it's fantastic. It's the best picture we've had. The reviews I've read give high praise to the picture quality.

Cheers,

Scott

 

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