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The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression...................

68.3.132.52
Posted on October 27, 2009 at 22:10:31
Todd Krieger
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Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 Anybody who was fortunate to get both the Mono and Stereo Beatles Box Sets will be in for a treat.......... The descriptions of the two sets in the press seem to be pretty accurate.

The Stereo set was for some reason done with "little" compression, but the sound becomes mangled. I personally think it's an indictment on the compression process itself. Far better none at all. The Mono set just presents the music in an unadulterated manner, far better than many modern recordings. Generally speaking, the sonic difference collectively is "lyrics intelligibility", the openness of the top end, and the lack of mid-bass exaggeration, in the mono set.

The difference becomes glaring when listening in the next room, where the "stereo" effect is mostly negated. The Mono set sounds a lot more like a real band in the living room.

Since I'm listening to these sets in a CD changer set to "shuffle", it's hard to do a "disc by disc" comparison. (I might do that later.) But I'll say right now, the Mono set will get lion's share of the play time.


Hype, posted on October 28, 2009 at 13:57:00
mbnx01
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Posts: 1548
Location: Phoenix
Joined: October 22, 2004
 The Mono box is so over-hyped. I have both. Some of the stereo albums are much better (Revolver, the White Album, MMT) than the mono albums. This whole 'mono' thing is getting ridiculous.

Buy the stereo set and be done with it. I wish that's what I had done.

RE: Hype, posted on October 28, 2009 at 15:40:31
kentaja
Manufacturer

Posts: 3116
Joined: March 26, 2001
 But there are certainly Beatles titles were mono is significantly better, i.e. PPM, MTB and Rubber Soul. The original stereo mixes on these albums is unlistenable, at least to these ears.

When did you first notice the lyrics intelligibility" issue, and, posted on October 28, 2009 at 10:03:11
bjh
Audiophile

Posts: 11876
Location: Toronto, Canada
Joined: November 22, 2003
 did you post on it here (or elsewhere).

Just curious.
Everything matters, don't forget to tweak your placebos!
RE: When did you first notice the lyrics intelligibility" issue, and, posted on October 28, 2009 at 11:08:22
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 22055
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 I noticed it playing the Stereo set, particularly with the mid-era CDs. I didn't really think about it too much until noticing the lack of that artifact with the mono set.

Another thing about the Mono set is I noticed the "harmonic shadings" in such a way I recall hearing the Beatles as a child back in the 1960s. The song "Penny Lane" was a revelation (as was the whole MMT album), in regard to background instruments- I just noticed them more easily, the attacks and decays, and also a more acute "sense of tonic"......


Now we understand it..., posted on October 28, 2009 at 12:15:57
astralnavigator
Audiophile

Posts: 580
Location: North York, Ontario
Joined: June 28, 2009
 1. The mid-era CD's - Help and Rubber Soul - are a disappointment in the stereo set as they are sourced not from the original tapes but from 16 bit 1987 digital files. They don't sound all that great, at least not up to the level of the others.

2. Some of the monos - Rubber Soul through White Album - are different mixes completely, which is why you are hearing them a lot differently.

No compression issue here. In one case, a shitty digital source, in the other, completely different mixes. You are comparing apples and oranges and trying to make sonic judgements from that.

RE: Now we understand it..., posted on October 28, 2009 at 15:34:41
Squonk
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Posts: 1682
Location: Indianapolis
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 I'm waiting to hear his comparison of the new remasters to the '87 CDs before I bring the hammer down. lol
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RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 28, 2009 at 08:10:35
FenderLover
Audiophile

Posts: 3313
Joined: July 31, 2007
Contributor
  Since: May 17, 2009
 Todd, just posted my thoughts on the new re-master of Please, Please Me (on Rocky Road). I felt that the new re-masters took away much of the clipped or compressed tones found on earlier re-masters. At least for this album. I thought the earlier MFSL Please, Please Me was better. At least after two listenings of the new re-master.

RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 28, 2009 at 01:49:07
Squonk
Audiophile

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Location: Indianapolis
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 Just curious, which do you prefer, the '87 CDs or the newly remastered stereo CDs?
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RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 28, 2009 at 10:58:31
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 22055
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 I have the 1987 White Album (I think)..... It's a nice sounding set..... Maybe I'll compare the three versions.............


RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 28, 2009 at 10:02:42
felrob
Audiophile

Posts: 53
Location: Vancouver
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 I picked up the Stereo box set on Friday. I previously had Abbey Road, Sgt.Pepper's, and the white album cds from previous releases. I have listened to the old vs the new of these three, and for me there is no question at all that the new cds are far superior. There is much more information on them. The old releases are missing a lot of upper mid and high end in comparison (and are therefor lacking a lot of the fine background detail), and are also missing a lot of the detail in the bottom end and lower to mid midrange. In the new ones, you can clearly hear the bass (although a little tubby at times), and you can *very* clearly hear the drums, especiually the floor tom and kick drum. Rurns out that Starkey guy could actually play - who knew?

RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 28, 2009 at 22:01:32
Spendor Harbeth
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Posts: 601
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 In all seriousness....either your ears are clogged, your system sucks, or you are just bullshiting us all.

A cd changer? Let's move on,

RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 29, 2009 at 01:08:51
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 22055
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 "A cd changer? Let's move on,"

What's wrong with a CD changer?

What CD player do you use, pray tell?


RE: The Beatles Box Sets- A Lesson in Compression..................., posted on October 29, 2009 at 08:32:05
Spendor Harbeth
Audiophile

Posts: 601
Location: Left Coast
Joined: May 15, 2009
 CD Changers are the lowest on the totem pole. I don't have the energy to go into it, but they are compromised in every way. So if that is how you are doing your comparisons, then no wonder.

How many high end companies do you know that make changers? Exactly.

Naim CD5 XS with XPS.

Generalizations............, posted on October 31, 2009 at 13:37:32
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 22055
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
 "CD Changers are the lowest on the totem pole. I don't have the energy to go into it, but they are compromised in every way. So if that is how you are doing your comparisons, then no wonder."

Actually, I did the comparisons on the Paradox/JVC/Prism DA-2 rig.......

But.........

You shouldn't generalize anything like that. The changer I use is a Magnavox 748 modified by Don Allen. People have been retiring four grand players in favor of these mod changers. (Magnavox CDC-748, Marantz CC-45, etc.) Maxed-out, I think they're absolute performers.

"Naim CD5 XS with XPS."

Nice player........ Care for a duel?? [-;


RE: Generalizations............, posted on October 31, 2009 at 15:29:40
Spendor Harbeth
Audiophile

Posts: 601
Location: Left Coast
Joined: May 15, 2009
 Yes, to be fair, I should not generalize. There are some very good changers.

But most would agree they really don't represent the state of the art in cd playback.

Well, speaking of duels, I am going to take a listen to the new CD5 XS and Flatcap XS. My dealer is going to give me a ridiculous trade in if I like it. But I'm not making a lateral move.

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