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Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...

69.120.212.107
Posted on December 26, 2009 at 12:22:22
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 I just re-terminated my MAC CuQ speaker cables and discovered that behind all the insulation they are actually Canare 709 cable.
Just an FYI for all you cable folk!

 

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RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 26, 2009 at 14:48:56
RZCK
Audiophile

Posts: 105
Location: Midwest
Joined: October 3, 2009
 Now that is interesting ,do you still like the sound since you found out they were Canare? I've had MAC in the past but didn't know they used Canare.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 04:16:47
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 I actually had pulled them out of my system a few months ago and replaced them with Canare 4S11 from Blue Jean cable...how ironic!
Anyway I thought the 4S11 had a little more zip to the high end & at 1/3 the cost...Let's just say it's disingenuous, to say the least, not to mention what the cable actually is.

 

RE:Let's just say it's disingenuous, to say the least, not to mention what the cable actually is., posted on December 27, 2009 at 04:21:11
Cpk
Audiophile

Posts: 1518
Location: PA
Joined: May 13, 2005
 you'll find that a lot in this business

 

Just goes to show..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 05:22:08
Dynaudio_Rules
 Looks have more to do with how something sounds than we care to admit.

I have often said that Audiophiles hear with their eyes.

It would be funny if MIT cables were just re-terminated Canare too with blocks of sand and ferrite attached in a fancy case.

Most times people just need from Fresh Copper in their system.

 

RE: Just goes to show..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 05:29:03
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 I guess my point is that it's just dishonest not to say that's it's Canare.
When you're paying for a cable that you think is a custom design and find out it's something that you could buy for a fraction of the cost then it's fraud. I mean the guy is calling his cables "My Audio Cables" for god's sake!

 

RE:Let's just say it's disingenuous, to say the least, not to mention what the cable actually is., posted on December 27, 2009 at 05:33:49
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 P.S
The cable is covered in the traditional black mesh BUT underneath he put this industrial looking black plastic tubing over the grey Canare PVC.
I'm not surprised that since I've replaced them I'm getting more detail.

 

RE: Just goes to show..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 05:35:20
Dynaudio_Rules
 Yes is it dishonest...

I think though that there are more cable end sellers than there are wire manufacturers. I would be willing to bet, A LOT of wire cable brands share the exact same wire.

This Audio hobby is full of people willing to pay big money for small differences. Its ripe for anyone who is willing to re-package off the shelf items for a huge markup. I was just reading about some expensive $1,000 power conditioner being duplicated with less than $50 parts. That's $50 parts retail....imagine the wholesale cost of the parts.

With that said, I can say that I shop for value normally and have been very happy with the products I have purchased.

 

RE: Just goes to show..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 05:46:49
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 I'm on the same path,trying to find honest manufacturers that make quality gear.
At some point I'll post pic's because you really should take a look at all the plastic surrounding these cables.

 

I Sent You Mail....nt, posted on December 27, 2009 at 05:59:18
Dynaudio_Rules
 .

 

RE: Just goes to show..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 07:28:52
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 It's "God's sake", if you have to use that while discussing trivial matters.


Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Just goes to show..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 08:25:26
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 Not being religious but respecting others who are, the use of the small case g is appropriate.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 08:36:53
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002



Here are some pic's..

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 08:38:35
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002



another pic

 

Wow....Thats a G-Damned Shame!, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:15:45
Dynaudio_Rules
 I would be Mad as hell...or should it be Hell?

Well anyways why did they use spit loom tubbing?

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:15:45
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Alright, pictures finally!!! Holy Crap!!! that looks like garbage!!!!
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:16:57
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Wow, what's the dollar cost on these cables?

These make 12ga Romex look all the much better.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

Small "H" please...., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:18:14
Dynaudio_Rules
 Yes it does look like crap, I would call them out on every board on the WEB and demand my money back.

They should not be in business as far as I am concerned.....

 

RE: Small "H" please...., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:19:55
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 I gotta agree. Can you say make up on a pig?

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Wow....Thats a G-Damned Shame!, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:20:35
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 S/B GD shame.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

I Have To Ask This Question, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:20:50
Dynaudio_Rules
 So how do ALL those "Sound Pipe" people feel knowing that they have been bragging about Canare wire?

And probably in the same breath, they would down the Canare brand as cheap crap.

Kind of like lifting up the hood of your Corvette and finding a Honda engine....actually worse.

 

RE: Small "H" please...., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:23:30
Dynaudio_Rules
 They could have had the decency to at least do a better job hiding it. I would have at least stripped the Canare wire of its jacket, re-twisted it and use something better than crap split loom tubing.

Who sources them, Home Depot?

 

LOL....nt, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:24:16
Dynaudio_Rules
 .

 

I am going to e-mail them and ask them to answer for this..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:25:52
Dynaudio_Rules
 I hope they come here with an answer for this....

 

RE: I am going to e-mail them and ask them to answer for this..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:28:16
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Doubtful.
I see on their website Steve McCormack uses and endorses this brand of cables, although not this model.


Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: I Have To Ask This Question, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:29:00
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Yeah worse 'cause Honda makes a good engine.


Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:30:51
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 6 ft is $179.00
each additional foot is $25!

 

RE: I am going to e-mail them and ask them to answer for this..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:31:47
Dynaudio_Rules
 Steve should not associate himself and his products with such an un-scrupulous outfit.

Perhaps I should email him too and let him know just what it is he in endorsing.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:36:19
Dynaudio_Rules
 Canare 4S11 costs 1.25/ft


 

RE:Let's just say it's disingenuous, to say the least, not to mention what the cable actually is., posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:42:05
bacobits
 So much for MAC CuQ 3 ft cable @ $150 per 3 ft..
That is the cost on site for these. Correct?
HA what BS! How stupid too, I would have taken some acetone and eliminated the markings.

That is why I roll my own. Solid Silver, Teflon coated tri- brade .24ga .
Have not bought some other manufacturers cables in years.

D

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 09:48:44
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 I purchased 22 feet(from Blue jean Cable) with bananas on both ends for a little over $125.
I'm tempted to dissect the interconnects,but I have a feeling they won't have an identification.

 

RE:Let's just say it's disingenuous, to say the least, not to mention what the cable actually is., posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:07:57
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Yep, same here. 14 ga magnet wire and/or Tara Labs Prism Omni ST (bulk).

I'd like to try some of the Mogami 3103 or 3104 but I'm pretty happy with what I'm using now.


Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: I am going to e-mail them and ask them to answer for this..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:11:32
MyAudioCables
Manufacturer

Posts: 11
Location: New York
Joined: January 15, 2005
 The MAC CuQ speaker cable is designed around the Canare 4S11 wire.
The CuQ and MAC Digital IC are the only MAC cables built using Canare.
There was a great deal of time/testing done using different types of additional isolation, twist vs braid and termination to get the results that have been achieved.
There are not many, if any, people out there that actually manufacture their own wire and survive selling at the prices MAC brings to you.
Many reviews have been done with excellent results comparing the CuQs to other cables and validating that they stand on their own based on sound and dollar value.
Anyone that has done business with or called MAC knows what we're all about.

 

RE: I am going to e-mail them and ask them to answer for this..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:18:42
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Sounds straight forward and fair enough to me. ?????

Except that you're buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No?



Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

Thank you..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:29:10
Dynaudio_Rules
 But its really not a MAC cable if MAC does nothing but put its sticker on it...is it???

 

buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:31:47
Dynaudio_Rules
 And taking credit for it too....

They call that cheating where I am from....

John gets good grades on his tests so I am going to use his test and put my name on it because his test taking skills are well proven.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:41:24
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 I'll play devil's advocate and say that they've "slicked" it up aesthetically and put connectors on it for you.
They've "finished" a bulk wire/cable product, no?

Now, I can see that maybe it'd be a good, honest idea to mention that they use Canare cable for this model and make it this much better by doing A, B and C to it, yes?

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:47:28
Dynaudio_Rules
 I agree, it would be more honest to tell the truth from the start.

There are many cable brands that buy the same raw product from a handful of wire manufacturers. However I know of none who will buy built brand-X finish it and claim it as their own.

I mean you can buy Kimber Kable for example in bulk, I never seen anyone have the gonads to actually finish it and call it their product. I think Ray would be PISSED to say the least.

 

RE: Thank you..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 10:57:45
MyAudioCables
Manufacturer

Posts: 11
Location: New York
Joined: January 15, 2005
 The CuQs are not just a re-packaged wire as said previously. They are based on the 4S11 wire. Tested and proven more isolation/dampening, twist termination, select bananas/spades, select solder/soldering heat and huge amounts of time for this.
There is a significant difference with the CuQs - please enjoy what I've found through time and effort.
Enjoy the rest of the Holidays!
Steve

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:09:17
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
 What is so surprising about this. In all kinds of manufacturing companies source materials from OEM (original equipment manufactures) make some minor changes (usually packaging) stick there own name on it, up the price and then sell it. Many speaker manufacturers do this when they use OEM drivers, then stick them in there own cabinets and sell them at huge markups. If you have these cables and like them and feel the price was fair then just sit back and enjoy them.
Alan

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:15:22
Mike_in_MD
Audiophile

Posts: 1431
Location: Maryland
Joined: May 1, 2005
 It's called re-badging and it happens more than you think,especially in the auto industry. Remember the Honda Passport...guess what it's an Isuzu Rodeo re-badged and marked up(considerably).

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:20:25
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Yeah sure because the parent company owns the dies and both "badges", I see nothing wrong with that. Ford/Mercury/Lincoln etc.....

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:23:46
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Oh, you mean like Mapleshade and Anti-cables selling magnet wire in different configurations as speaker cable???


Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:24:17
Dynaudio_Rules
 I am an automotive designer I know very well how much it happens and to a greater extent than the obvious like the Mercury Villager and Nissan Quest or Ford Escape and Mazda Tribute.

But rest assured that Brand X knows and approves what Brand Y is doing...and in FACT have made concessions to make is possible.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:25:13
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Sure, but it's usually X brand speakers featuring Y brand drivers, not X brand speakers using Y brand drivers as X brand drivers. No?

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:25:59
Dynaudio_Rules
 No he does not mean like Ford/Lincoln/etc.

More like Mazda and Ford...

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:35:42
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Doesn't Ford own a piece of Mazda or Mazda makes these for Ford or vice versa? Something along those lines?
You get the idea.

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:39:32
Dynaudio_Rules
 Yes at the time Ford and Mazda were dating [working together] it was a Ford product for the most part, with some Mazda parts like in some cases a Mazda engine.

Point being that in every case a re-badge was done with both parties signing off on the deal and contributing some part to the end product.

Like I said, I would like to see MAC or some other company re-badge a Kimber, Cardas, Audioquest or like product and see how far it flies.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:40:51
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 I only know one thing from this thread, and that is I feel fortunate that I'm not a MAC customer, because I'd feel duped, badly.

Thankfully I have just the minimum intelligence necessary to think for myself and contruct my own cables and equipment.

By the way, I have some Tefon coated 99.99 OFHC ($$$) magnet wire in 24 awg coming from MWS. This should, at least in my book, be the ultimate in internal hook up wire and unshielded IC material.





Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:42:31
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Wondering if you have tried Mogami 2549 in a diy IC or similiar. Not to rebadge it or anything just for sonic evaluation.



Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Thank you..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:43:03
tube524
Audiophile

Posts: 254
Joined: August 1, 2009
 Big deal! tested and dampened. What improvements do you bring to the OEM. I can twist, terminate and experiment with banana plugs with great results.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:45:40
Dynaudio_Rules
 Yes I have tried Mogami, I actually like it.

I have used it in a Cross-connected design for speaker wire with great results and I have some XLR Mogami IC's.

 

RE: Thank you..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 11:48:03
Dynaudio_Rules
 Dampened = Split Loom Tubing

Otherwise I didn't see anything else from the pic.

 

RE:Let's just say it's disingenuous, to say the least, not to mention what the cable actually is., posted on December 27, 2009 at 12:49:49
bacobits
 I have used my cables for 10 years now with a bunch of different equipment. Never found anything better for the $$
The Mogami cables are pro studio cables and highly recommended too.
I have not tried these.
But these are the numbers, Analog cable : Part No. W2893 and Digital cable : Part No. W3228

D

 

RE: Thank you...The markings are actually CANARE 709 not, posted on December 27, 2009 at 13:45:21
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 Canare 4S11 as posted.
Made in japan.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 13:46:18
tube524
Audiophile

Posts: 254
Joined: August 1, 2009
 Well done for posting your finding to us. How many people would have paid the money you paid if they new it was a canare cable?

Ay any rate, we have different taste, priorities and limits to what we can pay to achieve a desired sound.

Best Regards,
t.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 14:39:48
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 Thanks for the support...the more I think about it the more angry I get.
MAC's response was total BS!
Best,
RM

 

RE: Thank you..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 15:46:43
Wendell Narrod
 In my opinion, what you are doing is fraud. I consider anyone who does business with you as being very foolish.

 

RE: Thank you..., posted on December 27, 2009 at 18:06:52
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Wow, kinda harsh.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 21:49:05
wilsynet
Audiophile

Posts: 14
Location: Northern California
Joined: December 27, 2009
 When you go to http://www.myaudiocables.com, and you click for "More Details" about MAC CuQ cables, you get the following text:

8awg of Canare pure stranded copper per channel - AND still very flexible.
Air dielectric corrugated layer added for isolation.
Gold plated OFC spades or BFA Bananas.
Spades will accommodate 9mm to 1/4" binding posts.

So MAC has been quite up front about using Canare cables ...

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 27, 2009 at 22:14:30
RZCK
Audiophile

Posts: 105
Location: Midwest
Joined: October 3, 2009
 Yeah but there isn't any "air corrugated layer" at all. Also the wire in the photo shows Canare 709,not the 4S11 claimed by the manufacturer.That is very shady business in my book.

 

How's that again?, posted on December 27, 2009 at 23:10:54
roblistens
Audiophile

Posts: 60
Location: Midwest US
Joined: December 11, 2009
 How's that again?

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 28, 2009 at 02:47:07
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 Canare was just added.

 

RE: How's that again?, posted on December 28, 2009 at 06:52:31
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Reread it slowly.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 28, 2009 at 06:54:09
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 He's been found out.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually...PIC's, posted on December 28, 2009 at 09:05:05
RZCK
Audiophile

Posts: 105
Location: Midwest
Joined: October 3, 2009
 Well looks like MAC just got exposed again.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 28, 2009 at 15:50:23
HumanMedia
Audiophile

Posts: 421
Location: Sydney, Australia
Joined: March 6, 2006
 Yes but the MAC cables never claimed that each individual component was designed and made by them, only the finished cable. Just like many cable makers use Eichmanns and WBTs, people don't seem to be getting upset about that, but it's the same non-issue IMO.

 

Eichmanns and WBT, posted on December 28, 2009 at 16:05:11
Dynaudio_Rules
 Using Eichmanns and WBT's are not the same at all and of course you know this....

Many cable makers use solder and Techflex too...

And I guess in your mind this is the same as Audio Research and other companies using Sovtek tubes or some other brand of tube right.

How lame of an excuse....

How would you like to find out that your wife is really your sister or your son was really the mail mans? Hey, they still would be human beings so its ok right?

 

RE: Eichmanns and WBT, posted on December 28, 2009 at 17:41:11
HumanMedia
Audiophile

Posts: 421
Location: Sydney, Australia
Joined: March 6, 2006
 Using Eichmanns and WBTs is exactly the same and you SHOULD know this.
And you are exactly correct that cable manufacturers use solder and techflex - so what is left? A bit of conductor and insulator. So its completely fine to use off the shelf everything, except for the conductor and insulator?

I think it is you who needs your expectations and view of reality corrected.
And forget your tube and mail man analogies there are so flawed and confused that they detract from your point.

 

Actually I Could Care Less...I Will Never Buy Any MAC cables, posted on December 28, 2009 at 18:37:38
Dynaudio_Rules
 Nor will I advise anyone else to buy their cables.

So really no need to go back and forth about this...I am just glad this thread is staying alive long enough for people to find out and make their own judgments.



 

You'd be surprised how many garage DIY cable makers..., posted on December 28, 2009 at 19:16:00
sherod
Audiophile

Posts: 4842
Location: Texas
Joined: August 3, 2003
 ...do the same thing as MAC. Very few make their own conductors and very few have a major cable manufacturer custom-make conductors to their specs.

 

RE: buying one thing and repackaging it as something else. No? ...YES, posted on December 29, 2009 at 15:37:52
vickgeo@live.com
Audiophile

Posts: 72
Location: N.Cal.
Joined: March 14, 2008
 I am one of those "duped" customers. Thing is, gullible fool I must be, I don't feel duped. My entire system (except for my cdp pc) is wired with MAC products,acquired one at a time as each excellent sounding product led to the next. Thing is, my evaluations are guided by my (tin?)ear. That which expands and deepens my appreciation and enjoyment of music, allows me to hear it better, rates highly. How it is done doesn't seem so important. However Steve Hallick achieves his results, he appears to be guided by a very good ear. That he makes the results available to music lovers at a price which puts many competitors to shame is laudable. This puts him in the company of some good guys of the cable industry, such as Frank Dai of Signal Cable, and Anthony Winn of Element Cable.

 

So you like Canare Products...Mid-Fi all the way....nt, posted on December 29, 2009 at 17:26:00
Dynaudio_Rules
 .

 

RE: Power Conditioners, posted on December 29, 2009 at 19:59:29
carbonman
Audiophile

Posts: 738
Location: British Columbia
Joined: May 12, 2001
 The $50 in parts is just the beginning for power conditioner manufacturers. They have labor costs to assemble the product, UL/CSA certification costs, markup for their retailers, plus having to create the product initially and protect the intellectual property they've created.
Figure you have to charge 8 or more times the cost of your raw materials to break even with most products. $1000 for the power conditioner you complain about is hardly out of line.
Consider the markup on other luxury goods (watches, jewelery, sports cars, etc.) and then think about your complaints regarding audio equipment - another luxury genre.
Cheers,

Graham

"Blue meters, big watts. This must be Heaven!"

Thorens TD126 Mk.III/Ortofon Super OM40, McIntosh MCD205, MDA700, C45, MC252, Joseph Audio RM33si Mk.II

 

RE: So you like Canare Products...Mid-Fi all the way....nt, posted on December 29, 2009 at 20:14:00
vickgeo@live.com
Audiophile

Posts: 72
Location: N.Cal.
Joined: March 14, 2008
 Hello, Mr. Rules- Your words vis-a vis Canare products, not mine. On the off chance I was obscure, I will clarify: I like what makes music more intelligible and emotionally satisfying when played through my system. Whether the material it utilizes is said to be Canare, Belden, magnet wire, pure silver, or pressed camel dung, or how it is considered by obsessive audioholics, means little to me.
You have accused me of being a closet Canare lover. What's next, being accused of being a devil worshiping porno junky?

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 29, 2009 at 21:16:51
Dmannnnn
Audiophile

Posts: 274
Location: Las Vegas
Joined: November 23, 2008
 I see nothing here to indicate that anyone has been 'duped'. Fraud? Are you serious? ALL manufacturers source parts and assemblies from a multitude of suppliers.

Did MAC state that they manufactured their own wire? Did you believe them to do so? What percentage of cable manufacturers do you think actually pull their own wire? What about your amplifier? If the builder uses transistors they didn't make, are they duping you?

Okay wait. Somebody has been duped! It's me. I've been duped into responding to the most ridiculous bashing thread in AA history.

And the analogy below about WBT's and Eichmann's, it is EXACTLY the same thing.

 

RE: So you like Canare Products...Mid-Fi all the way., posted on December 30, 2009 at 04:07:26
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 Don't you mind paying a higher price for a cable that you could have easily purchased at a 1/3 of the cost from sources that are up front about what they're selling?
BTW, the insertion of Canare on the MAC web site was posted after these initial posts.
Look at the pic's,the PLASTIC covering it's supposed to be:
"Air dielectric corrugated layer added for isolation."
Also as per MAC's response on this site the cable is supposed to be:
"They are based on the 4S11 wire."
In truth they are branded Canare Cable 709 made in Japan

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 30, 2009 at 04:12:45
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 As previously posted
Don't you mind paying a higher price for a cable that you could have easily purchased at a 1/3 of the cost from sources that are up front about what they're selling?
BTW, the insertion of Canare on the MAC web site was posted after these initial posts.
Look at the pic's,the PLASTIC covering it's supposed to be:
"Air dielectric corrugated layer added for isolation."
Also as per MAC's response on this site the cable is supposed to be:
"They are based on the 4S11 wire."
In truth they are branded Canare Cable 709 made in Japan
"You've been duped into responding to the most ridiculous bashing thread in AA history."
LOL

 

RE: "Air dielectric corrugated layer added for isolation.", posted on December 30, 2009 at 05:39:50
Cpk
Audiophile

Posts: 1518
Location: PA
Joined: May 13, 2005
 it shows how little understanding the mfg. has OR how stupid he thinks his customers are, either way the only thing it is doing is making the cable thicker....

 

RE: Thank you...The markings are actually CANARE 709 /CORRECTION, posted on December 30, 2009 at 06:03:46
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 709 IS 4S11

 

devil worshiping porno junky, posted on December 30, 2009 at 06:59:41
Dynaudio_Rules
 No I would be the Atheist who watches porn...


You would be the one putting words in peoples mouths....I simply made the statement that is seems as if you like Canare products. Which by the way are Mid-Fi, not in the same league as say a Acoustic Zen, Kimber, AudioQuest, MIT or the usual higher end cables. Its nothing wrong with it, I myself like the Mid-Fi Mogami products, another Japanese brand. They sound good.

But it is rather fitting that the Mid-Fi Canare cables are rapped in an even more Mid-Fi or should I say Low-Fi Flex-Loom tubing....opps I mean air-dialectic...lol.

I guess they are a step up from the Walmart White-Lighting cables, these essentially come from Home Depot.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 30, 2009 at 07:20:58
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
 I have followed this whole tread with interest and some amount of sadness.
It seems to me there are a few choices you can make considering these cables. If you have these cables and like them then just sit back and enjoy.
If you have these cables and don't like them you can call MAC and tell them you feel you have been duped and would like your money back. If you don't have these cables and feel what MAC is doing is unethical then don't buy.
It bothers me that during this Christmas holiday the joy that most of you are taking in possibly putting somebody out of business. Shame on you.
Alan

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 30, 2009 at 07:33:58
Dynaudio_Rules
 The greatest contributing factor of someones success or failure in business is their ethics or lack there of...

You will find that highly ethical vendors get plenty of business and repeat business regardless of price.

Blue Jeans Cables for example makes it clear exactly what wire you are getting, be it Belden or Canare. And I might ad, they sell at a reasonable price.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 30, 2009 at 12:57:07
jihad
Audiophile

Posts: 2342
Location: chain o' lakes
Joined: February 20, 2003
 Shame on you, that's a load of crap.

If I bought this guy's cables and found out they were an off the shelf budget/bulk product that was simply dressed up I'd be pretty pissed off too considering the price.

I've never heard of this guy or his products prior to this. You can be sure I won't bother with them now. I don't think anyone is trying to put him out of business. I dont' think this thread will help sales any though.

Also, I went to the MAC website after reading this thread. I didn't notice any mention of the Canare brand until after he was called out. That's just plain deceptive.





Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

I Vote MAC Should Send The Original Poster an Upgrade Cable, posted on December 30, 2009 at 13:03:41
Dynaudio_Rules
 Perhaps one of their top of the line cables as a show of good faith.

Plus on top of that an apology to customers who may have been lead to believe the Cu cable was something other than Canare.

When your integrity is in question it is always best to take the high road....as supposed to the road of denial and cover up.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on December 30, 2009 at 15:11:16
tube524
Audiophile

Posts: 254
Joined: August 1, 2009
 I bought three items from him and got rid of them quickly. i didn't however, post any negative feedback since I deserved what I got. Now I only buy from audio stores at least I can audition them or take them home for trial test.

The question is, does Canare allow their products to be repackaged and sold with out their prior approval? It's true that cable makers do utilize OEM cables, but I am sure the original manufacturer is made aware of it.

Happy Holidays
t.


 

RE: "Air dielectric corrugated layer added for isolation.", posted on December 30, 2009 at 15:22:59
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002



I found this for sale at at an online electrical supplier
Looks exactly like the "Air dielectric corrugated layer added for isolation." on the MAC CuQ's..see my original PIC post for comparison.

 

RE: devil worshiping porno junky, posted on December 30, 2009 at 15:58:38
vickgeo@live.com
Audiophile

Posts: 72
Location: N.Cal.
Joined: March 14, 2008
 Ah, here we are again. To continue a theme, I do feel as if if I were a well intentioned pagan who has wandered into a congregation of (self?)-righteous Evangelicals bent upon saving fools wandering in the sinful darkness of ideological hell. Pace! Change of context! Is there not something to be learned from the firsthand discovery that it is possible to obtain really marvelous sound from inexpensive, cheap actually, wires such as Anti-Cable, MAC, Signal, Element, and several others. Yes, the "high end" manufactures you cite do make some nice sounding stuff. I have some of it, and rotate it in and out of my system. But, I find it something of a revelation, for instance, that when I substitute a not-top-of the-line old pair of Signal ICs for my Shunyatas, the sound changes only slightly in character and not at all in quality.
I guess it is OK with me if I am drummed out of the Audiophile corps. I will remain someone who loves music and consequently places high value on the equipment which actually enhances my facility for hearing it.

 

Those are Klingon hair extensions. [nt], posted on December 30, 2009 at 17:14:02
alan m. kafton
Manufacturer

Posts: 5285
Joined: April 7, 2000
 nt

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 2, 2010 at 14:53:28
Grinnell
Audiophile

Posts: 709
Location: Front Range
Joined: December 23, 2007
 I have 2 cables I bought from MAC off Audiogon auctions so I didn't pay retail.

I like these cables, I have the copper braided and the ultra-silver and they have made a positive sound difference. I don't think I will ever get to the point of spending $200 or even $100 for a cable but MAC was a good value and sound better than the Blue Jean cables I have.

 

Damage Control....nt, posted on January 2, 2010 at 15:38:25
Dynaudio_Rules
 .

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 3, 2010 at 08:20:42
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 I'll sell you 21 feet of MAC CuQspeaker cable AKA Canare 4S11 for $75

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 3, 2010 at 13:09:40
The Dill
Audiophile

Posts: 2199
Location: Portland, Oregon
Joined: July 1, 2004
Contributor
  Since: February 3, 2016
 $75 for 21 feet! That is over twice retail for the Canare 4S11. Seems like the whistle blower is trying to cash in now ...

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 3, 2010 at 13:26:09
RZCK
Audiophile

Posts: 105
Location: Midwest
Joined: October 3, 2009
 No I don't think he is trying to cash in...I think he was being rhetorical seeing how much the person he replied to in the post liked MAC cables so much.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 3, 2010 at 15:12:05
alan m. kafton
Manufacturer

Posts: 5285
Joined: April 7, 2000
 If Grinnell is already satisfied with his purchase, why should he be compelled to purchase additional speaker cable he doesn't need?

 

HAHAHA! nt, posted on January 3, 2010 at 15:45:26
Steve Eddy
 nt

 

RE: HAHAHA!, posted on January 3, 2010 at 20:06:13
alan m. kafton
Manufacturer

Posts: 5285
Joined: April 7, 2000

"You will drop your weapon NOW!"

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 4, 2010 at 04:00:12
reddmadder
Audiophile

Posts: 384
Location: new york
Joined: April 12, 2002
 just a joke guys...If I really wanted to make a point I'd post an ad in AG and give it away for free.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 4, 2010 at 05:57:48
RZCK
Audiophile

Posts: 105
Location: Midwest
Joined: October 3, 2009
 Ugghhh...I said he was being RHETORICAL.

 

RE: Guess what ...MAC cables are actually..., posted on January 14, 2010 at 05:55:16
Grinnell
Audiophile

Posts: 709
Location: Front Range
Joined: December 23, 2007
 I paid about $30 a piece for the two cables i bought from him of Audiogon. They sound better then the Blue Jean or Audioquest IC's i got and for about the same price. Can't comment on his speaker cables but I understand why you are pissed.

I got a nice pair of Kimber 8PR 13 ft for my speakers cables very cheap :)

 

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