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What benefit preamp?

72.14.224.1
Posted on October 6, 2009 at 07:15:10
royewest
Audiophile

Posts: 64
Location: Berkeley, USA
Joined: June 7, 2008
 I have a DAC (Lavry DA10) that when plugged into my upgraded S.E.X. amp drives my full-range speakers to much higher volume than I would ever imagine listening to them.

As I spent another hour last night trying to figure out what bone-headed mistake I made assembling my nonfunctional Quickie, I was wondering: Would a preamp do anything for me here?

In other words, what are the benefits of a preamp other than:

* Switching inputs (would be very handy -- but could do this with a good switching box that has no darn heater circuit)
* Increasing current for components that need it (I have none that do)
* Adjusting volume (no need with the S.E.X.)

What are the sonic benefits to a preamp?
RE: my system sounds better with one is the big one. n/t, posted on October 9, 2009 at 20:38:49
Matts_
Audiophile

Posts: 1975
Joined: February 4, 2005

RE: What benefit preamp?, posted on October 9, 2009 at 15:40:44
royewest
Audiophile

Posts: 64
Location: Berkeley, USA
Joined: June 7, 2008
 P.S. My Quickie is working now. It may have been working earlier and without bright tube glow I was confused. I just cleaned up the soldering a bit and all is better now. Thanks for the encouraging words.

RE: What benefit preamp?, posted on October 6, 2009 at 09:39:39
Paul Joppa
Industry Professional

Posts: 5028
Location: Seattle, WA
Joined: April 23, 2001
Contributor
  Since: July 1, 1999
 Technically you are correct - i.e. there is no technical reason that I know of to precede an integrated amp (one with enough gain and a level control) with an active preamp.

Some people insist they prefer the sound with a preamp added. Not everybody, just some. Nobody can argue with another person's perception. I am not aware of any solid evidence pointing to a plausible theory why, and I'm reluctant to speculate. The only answer is to do your own listening and see what you hear.

That's an example of why clubs and group meetings can be so valuable - you get to hear much more different gear than you can afford to have in your home yourself!

RE: What benefit preamp?, posted on October 8, 2009 at 07:55:18
nicetom@netscape.com
Audiophile

Posts: 209
Location: No. California
Joined: November 30, 2005
 I'd add to, or rather subtract from, Paul J's remarks, that no level control is needed in the integrated amp if a passive volume control, resistor-based or transformer-based (RVC or TVC), is used. Each of these has its fierce advocates and detractors, and you'll never know until you give them a fair try yourself. I went from a $6000 Convergent Audio Technology SL-1 active preamp to a $120 Chase RLC passive, and was struck by the new transparency. I've never gone back and never will. On the other hand, Bottlehead's own Grainger M, whose wisdom in our Forum is almost legendary, believes that there's no "drive" without an active preamp. Maybe it's a matter of what counts the most with any given listener. Incidentally, there's no better place than RVC's or TVC's to learn how heavily wire influences sound, even when just a few 4" lengths are used. I learned what junk Kimber AGSS is, last seen at $18.50 per foot, by comparing it with some superthin wire that needed to have its Teflon insulation burned off, the wire then cleaned with alcohol.
Preamp Benefit, posted on October 6, 2009 at 07:47:15
Grainger49
Audiophile

Posts: 4738
Location: Knoxville
Joined: April 30, 2002
 Many who have SEX amps use preamps and love the results.

A preamp adds "drive" to the music. Most often, but not always, a source component driving an amplifier needs more current capability than the component itself has.

The best thing you can do is try it. And the community here will get your Quickie going if you stay with it.


Remember, YOU are the only one who needs to be happy with the sound of your system

Grainger Morrison
There Is Only One (Grainger Morrison, it seems)
RE: Preamp Benefit, posted on October 6, 2009 at 09:06:14
artsybrute
Audiophile

Posts: 716
Joined: March 19, 2002
 To me, a preamp means something that can amplify and adjust a signal from all kinds of sources, including phono and tape. So even though most people call line stages preamps, to avoid confusion I'll call Foreplays and Quickies line stages. I'd like someone to correct me if he or she feels I'm wrong.

I wouldn't base my listening on an integrated audio/video unit, because discrete components are usually better at their dedicated functions than a do-everything design. For example, in my experience a good DAC design puts most of its budget into turning bits into analog output. A good line stage puts its design budget into taking a line level output, maybe cleaning or dressing it up, and from there sending it, as musically as possible, to drive an amplifier. They are different functions, even though the voltage level of the DAC may be fine to send to an amp. You'll see from the posts here that something that's important to Foreplay users is getting the levels and impedances perfect for the best sound. Many people here invest a lot into their line stages, and they're not dummies.

The Quickie, at least to me, starts out as a line stage but is easily modifiable into an active interstage (which is the way I think of it). I just received mine today. One is being modded into a headphone amp (again a dedicated function), and the other to drive a low pass filter, kind of turning it into part of and active crossover. Matching current, voltage and impedance requirements to capture a signal and drive a component, using quality stuff, can get you great music, IMO.

This is the longest-winded way I could say what Grainger said.







Triamp... Take a load off!

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