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Whiner's Woad

How many believe we are over moderated.

76.251.236.171

It's beginning to feel just like middle school where you must first raise your hand to speak as if we need permission.

Or like big brother is watching and we don't want to be audited.

Or maybe like talking on the phone and the word bomb is followed by quiet little clicks in the background.

Folks, I believe we are heading toward a P.C. world of hell.

Follow Ups:

You got moderated to the Whiner's Row. now row back to . . - John PA 13:30:04 08/05/08 (0)
the Asylum and don't ask this question again! :^)

The Elaborate DAC=Johnny's Balloon Meshplate 27 Balanced Preamp=Balanced Six Pacs=Newform Research 645

see images at: www.pbase.com/jamato8
RE: How many believe we are over moderated. - subdud 07:20:59 08/5/08 (0)
Many here perceived the discouse in question as a cat fight as if it were out of hand. I thought it was an enlightening if spirited discussion.

I would love to reread the thread to see if I missed something, but I just can't seem to find it. Anyone know where it went?
yer asking for a one way ticket to whiners, bub* - jaiva 03:03:40 08/5/08 (0)
a
For the 139th Time, the Solution (IMHO)....... - Todd Krieger 02:19:35 08/5/08 (3)
Have a "no-hold-barred" forum..... Call it the "Hall of Flame", "Trash Dumpster", "The Sandbox", or whatever..... If someone makes a statement in poor judgment or stirs the pot, move it to the Sandbox..... Let the catfights take place there, out of sight from the main boards.

In regard to "banning" members, once again, unless the member makes a threat of harm or violence, I'm opposed to it. Besides, the one who made the racial comment will forever have a "scarlet 'R'" pasted on him/her, in the minds of many who witnessed the goings-on.
- Agree; perhaps simpler to moderate, and keeps an open forum. ~t - mpathus 17:22:56 08/05/08 (0)
  .
- Agreed as well- make Whiner's Whoad look like preschool...nt - Dman 05:18:38 08/5/08 (0)
  nt
  The Musician has three disciplines: the disciplines of the hands, the head and the heart.
  -Robert Fripp
- agree on all points* - jaiva 02:46:07 08/5/08 (0)
  a
No....... Go Outside if you want less .....nt. - jea48 20:59:47 08/4/08 (0)
> >
You must find endless entertainment reading truck stop urinal messages in the Deep South. nt - tinear 20:41:54 08/4/08 (1)
s
- RE: You must find endless entertainment reading truck stop urinal messages in the Deep South. nt - subdud 04:58:11 08/5/08 (0)
  But that was before the internet.
Nope. - KellyG 18:08:37 08/4/08 (0)
Best moderated board on the net!

-Kelly

Without music, life would be a mistake.
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Under-moderated, if anything - Mike K 17:00:45 08/4/08 (2)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

As a former moderator, I can truthfully say I think The Bored and
moderators tolerate way more nonsense than should be tolerated.
You can get away with saying a lot of really stupid stuff on this
board.

Mike

Agreed - Diode 14:09:11 08/06/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Under-moderated, if anything posted by Mike K on August 4, 2008 at 17:00:45

Too many people nowadays have little interest in being civil in their communications on the internet with each other, so I applaud any steps that are taken to keep order on this website.

Amen a thousand times! nt - Fiddler 19:13:19 08/05/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Under-moderated, if anything posted by Mike K on August 4, 2008 at 17:00:45

nt
RE: How many believe we are over moderated. - middleground 16:53:02 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

Have you ever tried posted anything remotely controversial on Audiogon?
No. Not at all.... - deaf_j 16:24:33 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

No. I have never been moderated.
If I were a moderator it would probably be worse (in some people's mind).

Regards, Jerry
Regards, Jerry
No - plantsman 15:36:34 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

It is thankless job and on most forums they strike an excellent balance.
No, I agree with most of the others that we are not. -nt - Raiderman 14:11:44 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51
RE: How many believe we are over moderated. - jimmycj 13:51:05 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

Not at all
No nt - Don T 12:33:19 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

Give me rhythm or give me death!
maybe a little but it's not my sandbox - jimmyjames 11:54:42 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

I didn't spend any money or sweat to build the asylum.
You want to be bored to death by TROLLS? - richardl 11:29:59 08/4/08 (2)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

Read last Sundays NY Times magazine if you want to read something disgruntling about people with nothing to do and lives filled with hate. The moderators keep the shitheads out.

I didn't feel the responders in this case were trolls. Did you? nt - subdud 11:51:36 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: You want to be bored to death by TROLLS? posted by richardl on August 4, 2008 at 11:29:59

*

"...bored to death by TROLLS" - trolls are mostly entertaining. OTOH, have a look below in this thread - - carcass93 11:46:42 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: You want to be bored to death by TROLLS? posted by richardl on August 4, 2008 at 11:29:59

aren't you bored with conformists jumping eagerly all-on-one, as soon as somebody hints at displeasure with moderator's actions?
It's definitely not overmoderated... - mkuller 11:22:17 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

...this is a private audio hobbyist newsgroup.

It should be fun.

And there are still a few a**holes out there (you know who you are) who are stalking some posters and trying to get a rise out of them.

If that's what they want, or to tell off-color schoolyard jokes - then Outside is where they belong.

Not here.

Why, you trying to send these whiners outside or something? - Arya 12:09:03 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: It's definitely not overmoderated... posted by mkuller on August 4, 2008 at 11:22:17

> > If that's what they want, or to tell off-color schoolyard jokes - then Outside is where they belong.

<
Suggested Improvements: software and policy - Tony Lauck 10:43:30 08/4/08 (8)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

I don't mind if useless and objectionable threads are occasionally pruned. I do not like it when a thread is blown away due to someone else's offensive post and as a result one or more non-offensive posts of mine are deleted forever. I would like to see a software change in this regard: I would like every one of my posts to be emailed to me, so that I can easily keep archival copies. (I know that I can do this myself, but it is extra work.)

One other thing that I would like to see is more consistency on placing inmates "on holiday". In particular, I would like to see a policy that posters are given a written warning prior to suspension. I would also like for the policy to ensure that inmates are given copies of all posts that are the basis of warnings or suspensions.

Tony Lauck

"Perception, inference and authority are the valid sources of knowledge" - P.R. Sarkar

Not exactly buying the "it's their property, they are free to do whatever the f... they please" argument? - carcass93 11:18:12 08/4/08 (3)

In Reply to: RE: Suggested Improvements: software and policy posted by Tony Lauck on August 4, 2008 at 10:43:30

Me neither - but look at couple of eager ones below...

That's great logic - and after little bit of thinking and some further approximation, you'll understand that Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot etc. were absolutely within their rights killing millions.

Now, that's a wild leap of logic(if there was any).....* - darkmoebius 11:29:08 08/4/08 (2)

In Reply to: RE: Not exactly buying the "it's their property, they are free to do whatever the f... they please" argument? posted by carcass93 on August 4, 2008 at 11:18:12

nt

I guess you missed the approximation part. N/T - carcass93 11:34:35 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: Now, that's a wild leap of logic(if there was any).....* posted by darkmoebius on August 4, 2008 at 11:29:08

N/T

No, I didn't...* - darkmoebius 11:36:56 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: I guess you missed the approximation part. N/T posted by carcass93 on August 4, 2008 at 11:34:35

nt

RE: Suggested Improvements: software and policy - racerguy 11:01:54 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: Suggested Improvements: software and policy posted by Tony Lauck on August 4, 2008 at 10:43:30

> > I would like every one of my posts to be emailed to me, so that I can easily keep archival copies. (I know that I can do this myself, but it is extra work.) < <

OMG! Are you serious?

This is a joke, right?

RE: Suggested Improvements: software and policy - Tony Lauck 11:38:40 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Suggested Improvements: software and policy posted by racerguy on August 4, 2008 at 11:01:54

Not a joke at all.

If one spends some effort composing and editing a post, one would not like to lose this work, be it a server failure or a Bored action. Sending these emails could be a per-user option, just like allowing inmates to send you email.

Tony Lauck

"Perception, inference and authority are the valid sources of knowledge" - P.R. Sarkar

Look above and click on Forum Rules. -t - Bruce Kendall 11:00:21 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: Suggested Improvements: software and policy posted by Tony Lauck on August 4, 2008 at 10:43:30

I realize that you posted that pretty much following reflexes (or is that instincts?), but... - carcass93 11:15:52 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Look above and click on Forum Rules. -t posted by Bruce Kendall on August 4, 2008 at 11:00:21

...I believe it was suggestion to CHANGE those very Forum Rules.
Sometimes in the past I thought it was. I guess things. . . - John PA 10:40:48 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

never stay the same. I see much more going on here that stays and people that are not banned as compared to HeadFi, where I hang out a lot. I wish it was a little less moderated, maybe more in line with here so I guess I don't think it is over moderated here.

Listening to the Grateful Dead from Germany and it all sounds good. . . .

The Elaborate DAC=Johnny's Balloon Meshplate 27 Balanced Preamp=Balanced Six Pacs=Newform Research 645

see images at: www.pbase.com/jamato8
I'd like to agree with you...but THEY KNOW WHERE I LIVE. [nt] - chris.redmond2@bushinternet.com 09:41:52 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

nt
Best Regards,
Chris redmond.
Not me - racerguy 09:40:48 08/4/08 (7)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

And I wonder why you're getting all bent out of shape over the removal of a tasteless/racist POLITICAL joke (and all the garbage that followed) that was posted on an AUDIO forum.

RE: Not me - subdud 09:49:46 08/4/08 (6)

In Reply to: RE: Not me posted by racerguy on August 4, 2008 at 09:40:48

The joke was tasteless, no doubt about it. The garbage, as you put it, was thought provoking, therefore to me, something valuable. IMO
You see the point? This is an example of differing opinions. Now, it would be censorship if either of us weren't able to express our different opinion.
Perhaps it was off topic but this is General and I've seen off topic here before without moderation.

But, how did it relate to Audio? - darkmoebius 11:26:41 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Not me posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 09:49:46

The Moderators have to come to our current rule set through trial and error, bot here and on other forums.

While it might be great for national discourse to have long discussion on the nature of race, politics, and social mores, it does absolutely nothing for a forum specifically created to discuss audio.

In fact, The Bored has learned that discussions exactly like that usually in end two scenarios: 1) all out nastiness and name calling along with personal threats, 2) becoming so big and involved that they overwhelm the main page of whatever forum they are on so that no other topics can be seen.

It's a simple matter of forum management.

Which brings us back to the question - Why here?

The are hundreds if not thousands of forums on the web for in-depth discussions of race relations and it's influence on free speech.

If you really want to join the Wild West of discussion here at the Asylum, come joins us "Outside". Search the archives, I'm sure you will find the link somewhere in an old post, I did (about 6+ years ago). Bring your flameproof undies because it can hot out there.

RE: Not me - racerguy 10:57:56 08/4/08 (4)

In Reply to: RE: Not me posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 09:49:46

> > Now, it would be censorship if either of us weren't able to express our different opinion. < <
And this is private property. You and I are here as guests. We have no "freedom of speech" here. We are bound by what the owner(s) feel constitutes civil discourse. Just like if you came to my house and started making remarks I found offensive - "freedom of speech" would not prevent me from demanding that you cease, and banishing you from my property if you refused.
> > I've seen off topic here before without moderation. < <
Indeed - and this renders moot your whole argument about over-moderation.

RE: Not me - subdud 11:26:51 08/4/08 (3)

In Reply to: RE: Not me posted by racerguy on August 4, 2008 at 10:57:56

"Indeed - and this renders moot your whole argument about over-moderation."

Not really, in fact it strengthens my argument. Because the thread concerning the tasteless joke wasn't moderated because it was off topic but because someone, a reader objected most likely, could not deal with the subject matter, couldn't just ignore it and decided no one else should either. Censorship is someone else deciding what is fit for you and me. See?

RE: irrelevant - mls-stl 13:49:44 08/4/08 (2)

In Reply to: RE: Not me posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 11:26:51

> > Censorship is someone else deciding what is fit for you and me. See?

If you feel that someone being unable to spout whatever thought pops into their fevered little brain constitutes "censorship" then I think you have a rather myopic view of things.

What constitutes appropriate speech and behavior has always been dependent on where you are and who you're with. There is nothing new or unusual about that. A joke that would have everyone rolling on the floor in laughter after a few too many beers on poker night would not be a good choice for a pastor's church sermon or the principle's opening comments at an elementary school's Christmas pageant.

Audio Asylum is still a privately owned and operated entity. No one was sent to jail, fined or prevented from continuing their joke elsewhere. (If you Google "offensive jokes" you'll get over 400,000 hits.) There are plenty of people posting merrily away on Usenet some of the rudest material imaginable. There is little doubt in my mind that his joke would find a home there and probably many other places, too.

Further, a private organization has no particular obligation to explain their rules or act in a consistent manner that is pleasing to you. However, that same privilege would extend to you if you decide to start your own internet forum.

True censorship is where the person is prevented from saying what they have to say anywhere. Period. Consider North Korea, where still today, criticism of Kim Jong Il will not only get the perpetrator but his entire family sent to a forced labor camp.

Now that is what I call censorship. If Audio Asylum's removal of a rude political joke is the biggest problem a person has today, then they really don't have much to worry about.

RE: irrelevant - Brian Damage 14:29:44 08/14/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: irrelevant posted by mls-stl on August 4, 2008 at 13:49:44

[/B] What was the joke?

RE: irrelevant - Brian Damage 14:33:49 08/14/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: irrelevant posted by Brian Damage on August 14, 2008 at 14:29:44

[B]How [/B]do you turn off [B] nold[/B]?
I don’t think the actions by the bored had anything to do with political correctness…… - three_sox 09:24:50 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

.... They were simply managing the forum as they see fit. Is it arbitrary? Yes, it is. I like how that part works.

I must say I didn’t agree with the bored allowing a solitary post praising the bored’s actions ( like a nice pat on the back) and then archiving the thread! I think that was an extremely arrogant move. If the bored didn’t want further discussion on the matter then delete the threads.

I think the bubble-over with Drums is a total non-event. It will be all forgotten very shortly.

As for folks petitioning to have him banned? Good heavens above it is amazing how reactionary and narrow-minded some folks are.

Smile

Sox
Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? - musetap 08:48:56 08/4/08 (5)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

This place certainly doesn't feel "overmoderated" to me.

The removal of clueless, stupid and offensive posts which would just irk the shit
out of most any reasonable AA member by the mods just seems like a practical
policy in keeping the place relatively civil. It really doesn't seem like a PC policy
at all as those policies usually bear a closer resemblance to fascist behavior than
what transpires here.

A good barkeep cans the obnoxiously drunk, offensive and distruptive in maintaining a
decent joint, why shouldn't the mods here 86 people that exhibit similar behavior?

There's a difference between a common sense approach and a PC approach
and I feel the moderators here are much more inclined towards the former.

You want unmoderated? Hang out Outside or somewhere else.

"...You're all welcome to stay for the next set...we're going to play all the same tunes, but in different keys..." -Count Basie

RE: Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? - subdud 08:53:13 08/4/08 (4)

In Reply to: RE: Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? posted by musetap on August 4, 2008 at 08:48:56

"A good barkeep cans the obnoxiously drunk, offensive and distruptive in maintaining a
decent joint, why shouldn't the mods here 86 people that exhibit similar behavior?"

Would a good barkeep also 'can' the discussion following the event?

RE: Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? - Jonesy 09:54:52 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 08:53:13

I think they have to error on the side of caution as this is still a forum that can be viewed by the public at any time, be it now or years down the road.

It's possible keywords/strings, such as referred to in "the joke", may appear through "any" web search engine, totally unrelated to the Asylum.

Anyone coming across those strings could judge the strings as damaging, rather than healthy discussion, and then question the sites operation itself.

So in the end, as much as we think the moderator is keeping an eye on us, an even bigger brother, "Joe-Non-Asylum-Inmate-Public", can come down on The Bored if no action is taken.

Just a theory,

Jonesy

"Would a good barkeep also 'can' the discussion following the event? " - musetap 09:48:52 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 08:53:13

Depends on how the barkeep interpreted the results.

I would have the confidence in a good barkeep to make the right decision regarding such and trust his/her judgement.

Otherwise I'd be elsewhere.

Rick W. just summed up this ridiculous hullabaloo in an eloquent way.

His advise is very practical and clearheaded.

"...You're all welcome to stay for the next set...we're going to play all the same tunes, but in different keys..." -Count Basie

Seems to me there's a thread discussing it below. IIRC what was deleted was..... - Rick W 09:32:01 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: Paranoid? HEY! Who's that over your shoulder?!? posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 08:53:13

the actual "joke" itself and some reaction underneath it. Guess the mods felt it was more important to get rid of that lame-ass excuse for a joke than keep the comments below it. I definitely agree with their decision.

It ain't like it didn't get discussed. Get over it. This is an audio forum, not a repository for tasteless jokes incorporating inflammatory racial epithets.

Well said... that purt much sums it up!...N/T - musetap 09:38:48 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Seems to me there's a thread discussing it below. IIRC what was deleted was..... posted by Rick W on August 4, 2008 at 09:32:01

N/T
"...You're all welcome to stay for the next set...we're going to play all the same tunes, but in different keys..." -Count Basie
If you REALLY want to be "over modearted"...... - Ozzy 08:27:00 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

....go try posting something that the Audio Nazis in the Agon forum disagree with.......

Oz

RE: If you REALLY want to be "over modearted"...... - subdud 08:32:20 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: If you REALLY want to be "over modearted"...... posted by Ozzy on August 4, 2008 at 08:27:00

I agree with you there. Seems they have no rhyme or reason for doing so, only whim.
So why won't you go ahead and create another, completely unmoderated forum (NT)? - porky_pig_jr 08:23:41 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

NT

Love it or leave it, right? - subdud 08:29:45 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: So why won't you go ahead and create another, completely unmoderated forum (NT)? posted by porky_pig_jr on August 4, 2008 at 08:23:41

It sure is getting a bit stuffy around here. Perhaps it's time for a change.
Overmoderated? - *Michael Z* 08:16:54 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

If 95% of the people on this site did not act like school children, they would not have to be treated as such.

And if you want to say what the fuck you want? Go Outside and get eaten by the wolves.

The last thing this place is, is overmoderated. They keep it to audio... hence "audio asylum" and it is a public forum. Really, it's more social responsibility than crushing freedom of speech.

I am not afraid to open posts and read them with my family in the room kind of thing.

This whole thing has past it's prime now, no? Drums gor his slap on the wrist, he ment nothing by it, he will not do it again. LET IT GO.
I think this site is very balanced as is. - grantv 07:14:02 08/4/08 (3)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

If anything, perhaps slightly more censorship would be best, not less IMO.

Can you give an example of something that you feel should have been erased? nt - subdud 07:28:45 08/4/08 (2)

In Reply to: RE: I think this site is very balanced as is. posted by grantv on August 4, 2008 at 07:14:02

*

RE: Can you give an example of something that you feel should have been erased? nt - grantv 07:42:09 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: Can you give an example of something that you feel should have been erased? nt posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 07:28:45

-People shilling products
-People advertising without really advertising... "does anybody know where a good place would be to sell my Sony CDP-500 CD player, I'm asking $400."
-Anybody making derogatory comments about another (part. unjustified)
-Basically.... read the rules. Many people stretch them if not break them without having their posts deleted.
Bottom line IMO is this; if you go to a restaurant 5 times and have crappy food/service every time, do you go back a sixth time just to complain. I wouldn't go back (after 2 or 3 times). There are plenty other sites to visit if one doesn't like this one, this one is theirs to moderate as they please. I feel they do a great job.

RE: Can you give an example of something that you feel should have been erased? nt - subdud 07:55:24 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Can you give an example of something that you feel should have been erased? nt posted by grantv on August 4, 2008 at 07:42:09

All very good points indeed and I agree with you.

I guess I should explain what prompted my asking. The previous exchanges following the 'tasteless joke', I hope mentioning it doesn't get this moved, being shut down and or moved just as it was beginning to get honest and real about underlying emotions. Maybe this isn't the place but I don't think it's a bad thing to get it out in the open. It just seems a shame since it was an honest exchange among intelligent people mostly.
RE: How many believe we are over moderated. - hodad 06:59:11 08/4/08 (2)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

Not at all . There are plenty of other places to go online and act like a jerk . Why should we have to conform to them ?

RE: How many believe we are over moderated. - subdud 07:00:56 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by hodad on August 4, 2008 at 06:59:11

Some may think you should be censored for name calling. How would you feel about that?

RE: How many believe we are over moderated. - hodad 10:29:45 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 07:00:56

If it's a moderator I'm fine with that . If it's his decision that I stepped over the line . I would think the moderators would support someone that favored civility . I don't care what anyone else thinks .
If you really want moderation overkill................. - Dan Banquer 06:53:21 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

Go to Audiocircle for technical censorship.
d.b.
Eheh......huh - smcdonie@uwsp.edu 06:46:08 08/4/08 (1)

In Reply to: RE: How many believe we are over moderated. posted by subdud on August 4, 2008 at 06:42:51

.

Is that a question? - subdud 06:53:25 08/4/08 (0)

In Reply to: RE: Eheh......huh posted by smcdonie@uwsp.edu on August 4, 2008 at 06:46:08

*

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