Vinyl Asylum

• RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - caligari 20:01:55 04/03/10 (0)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  
  "the bearing in the Mk3 is connected directly to the motor; in 'The Beat' it is isolated from the motor.....lower noise."
  
  So glad to see new ideas in designing a direct-drive turntable. I have always thought many dd tables' bearing can be improved but more importantly the way the stator is attached to the motor. The criticism of DD motor's return torque force addressed and that the reverse torque force is lessened from getting into the plinth and tonearm. Very good idea! The "open loop" idea is intriguing. Don't know much about it but at least someone out there trying something new.
  
  Thanks for sharing the info and wonderful pictures.
  
  .
  

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• This man should be banned! - M3 lover 20:45:14 03/08/10 (0)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  Anyone having such a passion for music reproduction in his home (which I assume nearly all of us share) and the taste and means to put together such a wonderful system (which I don't have - and I'm unanimous in that) should be banned as an Inmate. Clearly his presence can only lead to lust and envy by the rest of us. ;-)
  
  At the same time mikel, I must congratulate you for continuing to push your realization of your hobby. I would love to see your set up, but most of all to hear it and enjoy a few favorite LPs, should I ever travel to your area. But I would not want to be spoiled even more by hearing your RTR.
  
  Beautifully done!
  
  "The piano ain't got no wrong notes!" T. Monk
  
  

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• RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - jweiss 17:25:53 03/08/10 (3)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  The copper platter you refer to was universally dismissed on a Garrard 501 by Michael Fremer, myself, and everyone else in the room when it was auditioned.
  
  I'd like to inject an alternative view about platter mats for the Garrard series of turntables.
  
  Jonathan Weiss
  

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  • RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - mikel 18:28:17 03/08/10 (2)
    In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by jweiss on March 08, 2010 at 17:25:53

    hi Jonathan,
    
    "The copper platter you refer to was universally dismissed on a Garrard 501 by Michael Fremer, myself, and everyone else in the room when it was auditioned."
    
    hummmmmmmm. ????
    
    i guess the first obvious question would be; your comment mentions the Garrard '501', i have a '301'. in your haste to diss a competitor (very classey move btw), did you miss-type that or was it actually a 501?
    
    second question; was this alledged copper platter referred to in your comment the exact one i am enjoying? or is that a guess?
    
    btw; i could care less if the platter is made of swiss cheese. if it sounds better, waaay better, that's good enough for me. and in this case, i loved it.
    
    lastly; do tell us about platter mats if you must.
    
    i'm simply reflecting the obvious hostile tone of your post. why do we have to do this this way? the last time this happened your responses to me were deleted.
    
    i do not consider you my enemy but clearly that's not how you see things.
    
    respectfully,
    
    mikel
    
    
    
    
    

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    • RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - jweiss 19:22:38 03/08/10 (1)
      In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 18:28:17

      Hi Mikel,
      
      I'm assuming you were using the copper platter made by TT Weights of Canada. I don't know of any other manufacturer of this kind of platter mat.
      
      This mat was auditioned on a Garrard 501 on a slate plinth in front of a host of people, including Michael Fremer, and myself. The unanimous decision was not positive. I'd like to see people not wasting their money on a useless so called upgrade. My comments have nothing to do with the Dobbin TT.
      
      Yours,
      
      Jonathan Weiss
      

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      • RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - mikel 19:39:47 03/08/10 (0)
        In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by jweiss on March 08, 2010 at 19:22:38

        *****"I'm assuming you were using the copper platter made by TT Weights of Canada. I don't know of any other manufacturer of this kind of platter mat."*****
        
        i have a new copper topped 'platter', not a platter 'mat'. i do own a copper platter mat but i've only tried it as a liner below another mat, and did not like it there. it could be made by TT Weights, but i have no idea. my copper topped Garrard 301 'platter' was made by Steve Dobbins.
        
        
        
        ******"This mat was auditioned on a Garrard 501 on a slate plinth in front of a host of people, including Michael Fremer, and myself. The unanimous decision was not positive. I'd like to see people not wasting their money on a useless so called upgrade. My comments have nothing to do with the Dobbin TT."*****
        
        the copper mat i have is smooth. i would imagine that the Lp would slide all over the place even if the mat were somehow glued down. i'm not surprised no one liked it.
        
        your previous post seemed curious and inconsistent; it first mentioned a platter and then a platter mat. i apologise if i overreacted. our previous encounter made me a bit defensive. i hope that we are past that.
        
        best regards,
        
        mikel
        
        
        
        

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• Wow, that room and everything in it is way past drool inducing. Happy listening! nt - Rick W 15:23:38 03/08/10 (0)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  nt
  

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• Amazing - JeffH 15:17:13 03/08/10 (0)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  I can only dream of your setup. It's simply great to see someone with such passion for music. Kudos to all involed!
  

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• RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - MikeWI 15:00:10 03/08/10 (1)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  Mike,
  
  Great update and nice photos! Can you expand on the "open loop feedback" system for the motor drive? I can imagine many kinds of feedback but they would all constitute a closed loop if you were using their information to modify the motor drive parameters in real time.
  
  Would love to hear your system some day. Drop me a note if you are ever in Milwaukee.
  
  Mike
  

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  • RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - mikel 15:26:32 03/08/10 (0)
    In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by MikeWI on March 08, 2010 at 15:00:10

    hi Mike,
    
    thanks.
    
    last summer i was in Kohler for a week for a business meeting and drove thru Milwaukee. really nice country and people you have there. if i ever get back there i'll look you up. you would be welcome to visit here if you ever get to the Seattle area.
    
    i only know about the 'servo' design for the direct drive motor in general terms. not all closed loop systems are created equal. the Rockport has a closed loop system, but it also has a $12k eddy current motor. in practice the servo never is activated unless the nuit is disturbed (the floating plinth gets bumped).
    
    the Mk3 closed loop speed control is not at that level and some correction is common. an open loop system evidently is less likely to have any cogging.
    
    i'm way out of my depth here and would refer you to Steve Dobbins for a better, more accurate and complete response.
    
    mikel
    

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• RE: new direct drive - user510 14:31:37 03/08/10 (2)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  I'd heard through the rumor mill that Dobbins was working on a design. Some said it was a string/belt drive. Nice to see rumors put to rest and reality shine in through the light of day.
  
  Good looking line-up there.
  
  I wonder if there isn't a 2-tone paint scheme to be had. Perhaps piano black, mostly, with some of that red in there for accent.
  
  -Steve
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Thorens Rules
  
  

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  • RE: new direct drive - mikel 14:56:59 03/08/10 (1)
    In Reply to: RE: new direct drive posted by user510 on March 08, 2010 at 14:31:37

    Steve,
    
    2 tone might be the bomb! kinda like an old Austin Healey 3000 (i owned a 100-6 two tone back in the day). my wife kinda likes the Red as it works in my room. i'm mostly a piano black guy as that is always negotiable.
    
    btw Steve, one of these days you need to drive on over across town for a listen. you would be welcome any time.
    
    mikel
    

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    • RE: new direct drive - user510 15:13:30 03/08/10 (0)
      In Reply to: RE: new direct drive posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 14:56:59

      Colors are quite subjective. Everyone has their preferences.
      That said I do favor that shade of red that Loricraft uses on some of their plinths. But not all over. Just the top plate. Or perhaps just little accents of it against the majority of piano black.
      
      -Steve
      ps: re; drive across town. Sounds like fun to me :-)
      
      
      
      Thorens Rules
      
      

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• Waaaaah! I want my gear to look that nice! - Muzikmike 13:03:07 03/08/10 (0)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  I'm getting to the point where sounding good has been achieved, so why not work for "lookin' good!" if possible?
  
  Very nice looking and I'm sure, sounding equipment.
  
  
  There is no such thing as too many records.
  There is just too little room for them!
  
  
  
  

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• I admire the pursuit of excellence - gd 13:02:10 03/08/10 (2)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  But how depressing to have the three tables bested by RTR. Though I am sure your RTR set up is also high-end (over to A-gon next to see).

  Maybe I'll save a step and not get a mega-table and go straight to RTR. Let's see if Acoustic Sounds will sell me some new RTR blue note re-pressings. What, there are none, everyone is too busy with vinyl? Arrg.... Time for a new hobby.

  Thanks for posting, I remember some a-gon conversations a few years ago on DD tables, the common wisdom was that it was too expensive to manufacture. In the mean time there are several high end DD tables now. Is the Beat drive scavenged and improved or made from scratch?

  Gregg

  
  

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  Edits: 03/08/10

  • RE: I admire the pursuit of excellence - mikel 13:09:26 03/08/10 (1)
    In Reply to: RE: I admire the pursuit of excellence posted by gd on March 08, 2010 at 13:02:10

    Gregg,
    
    everything is made from scratch.
    
    the motor is new. as far as who builds it and the other mechanical bits you'd need to contact Steve. i suspect he's a bit protective of all that stuff.
    
    anyway, no need to worry about 25+ year old (or more) caps and stuff biting the dust on this one. even though it does take some of the fun out of it.
    
    mikel
    

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    • Thanks (n/t) - gd 18:13:25 03/08/10 (0)
      In Reply to: RE: I admire the pursuit of excellence posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 13:09:26

      GD
      

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• looks like fun - Iain42 12:07:35 03/08/10 (3)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  Beautiful selection of tables. I've been getting into RTR and Vinyl again over the last year.
  
  I have been shopping for a good light and those look incredible. Would you mind sharing what they are and where you found them?
  
  
  High sensitivity, wide dynamic range, low distortion, and smooth frequency response. Pwk
  
  

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  • here ya go.... - mikel 12:32:04 03/08/10 (2)
    In Reply to: RE: looks like fun posted by Iain42 on March 08, 2010 at 12:07:35

    every visitor to my room loves those lamps, many have purchased one.
    
    uses little electricity, well made, low mass so you never worry about it falling on your precious tt.
    
    comes in white or warm light.
    
    see the link below.
    
    mikel

    • i-Tower LED floor lamp   (Open in New Window)

    
    

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    • RE: here ya go.... - Iain42 13:26:30 03/08/10 (1)
      In Reply to: RE: here ya go.... posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 12:32:04

      Thanks
      
      This item is on backorder until early May, 2010.
      
      I'll gladly wait.
      
      
      High sensitivity, wide dynamic range, low distortion, and smooth frequency response. Pwk
      
      

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      • RE: here ya go.... - mikel 13:37:34 03/08/10 (0)
        In Reply to: RE: here ya go.... posted by Iain42 on March 08, 2010 at 13:26:30

        my local friends have basically purchased all the local stock of this lamp. it will be worth the wait.
        
        also; there are more than one source on-line for it.
        
        mikel
        

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• glad to see direct drive coming of age - beach cruiser 11:53:02 03/08/10 (5)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  If you accept the common thinking that a machine is an antique at 25 years of age, it 's pretty nice that this design feature is available in modern equipment. Pity about the modern price though.
  
  Hopefully, other new more affordable designs will come along. Not that the job has changed, and all old designs have know value, it's just that when the old tables were designed , audio expectations were different , and the market reflected this.
  
  That's pretty col stuff you have, and will have in the future. Good on you. I have a simple system, (simple=budget) but the thing that set it free to sound it's best was a good sounding table.
  

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  • price - Lew 12:04:05 03/08/10 (4)
    In Reply to: RE: glad to see direct drive coming of age posted by beach cruiser on March 08, 2010 at 11:53:02

    You wrote, "pity about the price..." Where do you see mention of the cost of the new Dobbins' TT? Or maybe you have the information via another source. If so, please let us know the number. Thanks.
    

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    • I've bought a lot of stuff before - beach cruiser 12:31:41 03/09/10 (1)
      In Reply to: RE: price posted by Lew on March 08, 2010 at 12:04:05

      and I check a lot of audio.
      
      I didn't know what the price might be, but it doesn't take much thinking to know it would be expensive. Like audio expensive, which is a wild market, driven by desire over needs. When men with testosterone start buying stuff, prices can get crazy.
      

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      • Testosterone + money + desire = - Lew 16:54:19 03/09/10 (0)
        In Reply to: RE: I've bought a lot of stuff before posted by beach cruiser on March 09, 2010 at 12:31:41

        Trouble. That's T-R-O-U-B-L-E, my friend.
        

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    • RE: "the price is $20k. the 'couple of' people who have heard it have bought one." - Ivan303 12:07:45 03/08/10 (1)
      In Reply to: RE: price posted by Lew on March 08, 2010 at 12:04:05

      Looks like he edited it out of his posting buy you can read the pre-edit posts by cliking on the edit dates below his post.
      
      
      

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      • RE: "the price is $20k. the 'couple of' people who have heard it have bought one." - mikel 12:15:46 03/08/10 (0)
        In Reply to: RE: "the price is $20k. the 'couple of' people who have heard it have bought one." posted by Ivan303 on March 08, 2010 at 12:07:45

        yep.

        my above post was basically a cut and paste from a number of my posts on AudiogoN. a person over there did ask about the price so i answered it, but after consideration i felt that it was not my intention to bring price up to begin with. if someone asks then so be it.

        yes, it's $20k.

        my other edits were for my terrible typing and spelling.

        mikel
        

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        Edits: 03/08/10
• Nice budget system...nt - tweakk 11:43:18 03/08/10 (21)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  nt
  

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  • Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) - John Elison 12:41:10 03/08/10 (20)
    In Reply to: RE: Nice budget system...nt posted by tweakk on March 08, 2010 at 11:43:18

    
    

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    • Wonderful thing... - tweakk 12:54:22 03/08/10 (0)
      In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by John Elison on March 08, 2010 at 12:41:10

      It knocks my socks off to see the limits of vinyl playback pushed to such a level. Not only sonicly but aesthetically also.
      

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    • RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) - mikel 12:48:43 03/08/10 (18)
      In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by John Elison on March 08, 2010 at 12:41:10

      hi John,
      
      my intentions are to have one arm with a removable headshell so i can play around with MM's, Moving Irons and low priced cartridges. i have an Ortofon M20??? (can't remember the exact model). anyway; i want to get into that stuff and have some fun. this arm will likely go on the Garrard.
      
      best regards,
      
      mikel
      

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      • RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) - John Elison 20:06:24 03/08/10 (3)
        In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 12:48:43

        Hi Mike,
        
        That sounds like a good plan. What brand of tonearm are you considering? The Technics EPA-100 might be a good one.
        
        Best regards,
        John Elison
        

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        • RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) - mikel 20:21:16 03/08/10 (2)
          In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by John Elison on March 08, 2010 at 20:06:24

          hi John,
          
          when my finances recover from these recent jolts, i will need to find an appropriate 'vintage' arm using a headshell. i've not yet settled on one. i'll be using my current three arms for my low output MC's; the 2 Ortofon A90's and the Lyra Olympos.
          
          my plan for my 2 other spots is to find a good arm for a mono cartridge and then the vintage arm. i already have the MM inputs on the Allnic H3000.
          
          thanks for the recommedation on the EPA-100. if i can find a good one when i can afford it i'll seriously consider it.
          
          best,
          
          mikel
          

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          • vintage arm? - Milos 22:51:15 03/09/10 (0)
            In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 20:21:16

            You might consider the Schick 12" arm. I use 'em on a Garrard 401 and a Thorens 124, and like them plenty. Thomas Schick has a website, but--and this is the best part--you're already friends with the distributor.
            
            Couldn't resist! But you can take care of yourself..........
            
            Milo
            

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          • RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) - John Elison 10:01:46 03/09/10 (0)
            In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 20:21:16

            Hey Mike,
            
            Something just occurred to me since you say you are interested in playing around with some of the lower priced cartridges. I wonder if you might also be interested in playing around with a Technics SL-1200. It could be very interesting to find out just how well or how poorly the SL-1200 sounds in your system with an Ortofon A90 cartridge. If you are interested, I would be more than happy to send you my SL-1200 Mk2 for you to play with for a while. It has RCA connections to the tonearm so you could use expensive interconnects. It also has tonearm damping and a strobe disabler. Let me know if you're interested because I'd be happy to send it to you.
            
            Best regards,
            John Elison
            

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      • M20FL Super, - Lew 14:11:35 03/08/10 (11)
        In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 12:48:43

        if you bought the one I recommended. Scuttlebutt is that the M20E (elliptical) version is a tad better sounding. This is something I have not verified, as I am having so much fun with the FL (Shibata) version. You can buy just the M20E stylus to go on your M20FL Super.
        
        Mike, Would you care yet to say how your Rockport fares against the Beat?
        

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        • Shibata? - MAS 16:35:26 03/08/10 (7)
          In Reply to: RE: M20FL Super, posted by Lew on March 08, 2010 at 14:11:35

          I thought FL stood for Fine Line. Did you source yours from Thakker?
          

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          • I keep making that mistake - Lew 19:14:05 03/08/10 (5)
            In Reply to: RE: Shibata? posted by MAS on March 08, 2010 at 16:35:26

            At one point I really thought it was a Shibata. Then I looked it up and found, as you did, that it was a "Fine Line" (whatever that connotes). Yet that incorrect idea crept back into my brain. Anyway, it's a wonderful cartridge for $180, and I am enjoying it immensely. Sorry for posting bad info. Thanks, Ivan303, for the exact description.
            

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            • I know moeny is tight at the mikel ranch these days, but for a mere $230... - Ivan303 20:59:18 03/08/10 (4)
              In Reply to: RE: I keep making that mistake posted by Lew on March 08, 2010 at 19:14:05

              

              Mike can take a step UP, I'd bet, to the Jico MM-1, which sports an even better line contact profile(r/R 2.5/75um).
              
              Or I could offer to bring mine up for a "Cheap MM Cartridge Challenge".
              
              I agree to fly up (at Mike's expense, of course) bring along my $230 Jico MM-1 cartridge, sit around all day eating Mike's food, drinking his beer and listening to his system.
              
              When I got home I'd post here claiming my cartridge sounded better, irrespective of the results. Sound like a deal?
              
              Just kidding, of course!
              
              But after a few more hours of serious listening, the JICO MM-1 is CLEARLY a very good MM cartridge at a ridiculous low price.
              
              
              
              
              

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              • RE: I know moeny is tight at the mikel ranch these days, but for a mere $230... - nu2toobs 17:04:05 03/09/10 (0)
                In Reply to: RE: I know moeny is tight at the mikel ranch these days, but for a mere $230... posted by Ivan303 on March 08, 2010 at 20:59:18

                I've been listening to my MM1 for a couple weeks, and man is it good!! Kills my 150MLX on my system.
                I can't listen to enough lp's.
                
                
                

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              • sit around all day eating Mike's food, drinking his beer and listening to his system. - mikel 21:14:11 03/08/10 (2)
                In Reply to: RE: I know moeny is tight at the mikel ranch these days, but for a mere $230... posted by Ivan303 on March 08, 2010 at 20:59:18

                you'll fit right in.......:-)
                
                i do need a proper 'headshell' arm before i start aquiring more cartridges. no doubt the Jico is the Chiznitz, and then some.....and we'll get to that as time goes by.
                
                thanks for the kind offer to play 'first born'.....but the line forms waay over there.....
                
                cheers,
                
                mikel
                
                seriously, you would be more than welcome to come and trash my place anytime.
                

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                • The M20FL Super is not king of the MM/MI thread any longer... - Lew 16:59:03 03/09/10 (1)
                  In Reply to: RE: sit around all day eating Mike's food, drinking his beer and listening to his system. posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 21:14:11

                  The M20E (same cartridge with less expensive elliptical stylus), the Azden something or other, and now the Technics EPC P100C, are all said to be a bit superior. I confess I bought an Azden. So far it's very nice, in some ways better than the M20FL Super, maybe. It's a moving target. Jico MM would not be a contender; the thread is about vintage devices.
                  

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                  • Read the Vinyl Engine thread on the origins of the MM-1... - Ivan303 13:40:06 03/10/10 (0)
                    In Reply to: RE: The M20FL Super is not king of the MM/MI thread any longer... posted by Lew on March 09, 2010 at 16:59:03

                    It just might be a vintage cartridge after all! :-)
                    
                    From the 'vinyl engine' thread linked below:
                    
                    "Now, I've been following JICO for a couple of years. Upon first sight, the JICO MM-1 cartridge looked familiar. And the longer I've been looking at the pictures - comparing it to the Philips Super-M series in the mk1, 2 and 3 incarnations - I come to the conclusion that it is the same design.
                    
                    Rgds, L."
                    
                    

                    • Jico MM-1 SAS   (Open in New Window)

                    
                    

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          • RE: Nude Fine Line (r/R 8/40µm) - Ivan303 16:45:51 03/08/10 (0)
            In Reply to: RE: Shibata? posted by MAS on March 08, 2010 at 16:35:26

            

            According the William Thakker.
            
            
            
            
            

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        • RE: M20FL Super, - mikel 14:43:47 03/08/10 (2)
          In Reply to: RE: M20FL Super, posted by Lew on March 08, 2010 at 14:11:35

          thanks Lew, yes that's what i bought. and it's sitting on my self waiting for it's turn. with my room mods over the last couple of months i've not had a chance to go down that road yet.
          
          regarding the Rockport and the Beat, i'm looking forward to more long term listening to get a better handle on that. my focus was more the Mk3 and the Beat since they were most similar in presentation. briefly; the Beat simply out-Mk3's the Mk3. every Mk3 strength is just a little better on the Beat. and then the Beat laps the field in terms of bass energy.
          
          back to the Rockport <--> Beat difference.....i think the Rockport still has it on low level detail and refinement, but the Beat is quite a bit closer to the Rockport than the Mk3 in those areas. and it's farther ahead of the Rockport in certain aspects of bass performance than the Mk3. forgetting audiophile stuff......in musical terms the Beat is just sooo involving and compelling. each part of the music becomes special and significant. the Rockport claims your mind, the Garrard claims your heart, the Beat claims your soul.(not sure that's true but it sounded cool).
          
          ask me again about the Rockport--Beat question a month after i get the Beat. i purchased it because it bested the Mk3, and my feelings on how it compared to the Rockport were not solid.
          
          mikel
          

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          • Thanks, Mike - Lew 19:16:10 03/08/10 (1)
            In Reply to: RE: M20FL Super, posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 14:43:47

            Carry on. It really is unfair to have asked you for conclusions at this early stage.
            

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            • RE: Thanks, Mike - mikel 19:53:22 03/08/10 (0)
              In Reply to: RE: Thanks, Mike posted by Lew on March 08, 2010 at 19:16:10

              hi Lew,
              
              your question was an obvious one and trust me i had been thinking about it. so no problem at all.
              
              best,
              
              Mike
              

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      • Please try a Stanton 980LZS... - tweakk 12:58:04 03/08/10 (1)
        In Reply to: RE: Nice Budget! ;-) (nt) posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 12:48:43

        I would love to know how it compares to a top tier cartridge.
        
        Thanks for sharing your setup BTW...
        

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        • Where are they available? (NT) - MAS 12:49:33 03/09/10 (0)
          In Reply to: RE: Please try a Stanton 980LZS... posted by tweakk on March 08, 2010 at 12:58:04

          .
          

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• RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - P Fowler 11:38:15 03/08/10 (1)
  In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by mikel on March 08, 2010 at 10:31:54

  Inquiring minds and all that - what is the benefit of the copper platter top?
  
  Other than looking way cool, of course... ;-)
  
  Pete
  

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  • RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' - mikel 12:27:42 03/08/10 (0)
    In Reply to: RE: new direct drive turntable, 'The Beat' and 'stuff' posted by P Fowler on March 08, 2010 at 11:38:15

    personally i have not built many dozens of platters and listened to the various combinations. but Steve Dobbins did do that. he found that untreated copper sounded the best. his opinion was that copper interfaced best with vinyl and transfered energy the best (not sure if that is the best way to describe how the copper and vinyl connect).

    Steve loved the sound of the Garrard 301 but felt that the 50 year old platter design and construction was the source of the high noise level of the 301. listening to this platter i would have to say he was right.

    anyone who owns a Garrard and does not get this platter will never know how it can sound. the Garrard is not noisey, the platter is noisey.

    it sounds great so who am i to dispute Steve's perspective.

    Steve experimented with a clear laquer finish over the copper to eliminate oxidation. he found that the laquer coating harmed the sound by reducing the transfer of energy (or something like that).

    e-mail Steve at vetterone@msn.com for a better explanation.

    mikel
    

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    Edits: 03/08/10

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