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In Reply to: RE: Questions for Audio-Technica MC fans... posted by flood2 on May 23, 2015 at 03:49:46
Hi Anthony,You are absolutely right in that with that arm weight, I need a low compliance cart. The Denon 103 shows a resonance in my system around 9Hz. As you note, this is on the low end of what is desirable. However, I did not mention that I am running a rather heavy headshell (and am using a dampener) picked out to work with the Denon. Going to a very light headshell makes the arm compatible with carts that have a compliance upwards to about 15x10-6 cm/dyne.
Not to go into the issue too deeply, but my problem with the Denon is that the HF can get a bit tizzy/splashy. Clearly, additional arm loading would not be helpful (which is why I mentioned the arm weight.) I've played with alignment, loading and component swapping quite a bit, and don't have this issue with MM carts I have used, so I'm fairly sure this character resides with the cart (or possibly is a product of how the sound of the cart synergizes in my system as a whole.) I am using rather bright and resolving speakers (Focal Electra 906s), so any issues with the HF are easily heard.
My budget is around $250-300. I considered the Quintet, and the Red is in my price range, but I generally prefer a nude stylus... and personally have a bit of an issue paying several hundred for a bonded stylus. Unfortunately, the Blue is out of my price range.
Anyway, any suggestions are appreciated. Thank you for the very complete reply!
Re: Keats - ah, I've usually seen that adapted, not the direct quote. Thanks again.
Edits: 05/23/15Follow Ups:
Hi
From your description of tizzy/splashy, the first question that comes to mind is how many hours you have put on the cartridge?
At the best of times a spherical stylus already has an inherently higher level of FM distortion introduced to the signal due to the large scanning radius and this becomes worse as you move towards the inner grooves.
In addition to this, as the stylus wears, as you are probably aware, you get flats worn into the scanning surface and this increases the distortion even more. This occurs after only about 150 hours or so. In other words you don't really get many hours on the tip before the distortion at 15kHz starts to increase above 3%. In my personal experience, I can hear degradation out of ordinary (non-jewellery grade) elliptical styli after about 250 to 300 hours after which I reject them.
The other question relates to the records you play and their "vintage". The VTA requirements of new pressings (and those going back to the late 80s and early 90s) are much higher than those from the 60s through to mid 80s. VTA mismatch with respect to the cutting head can also account for the distortions you hear even if you have a "perfectly" aligned playback system with correct VTA as defined by the DL103 since the mismatch in VTA causes significant IM distortion and the worse the mismatch the higher the order of the IM distortion components.
I therefore have cartridges of differing ages with different VTA settings to match the pressing "era".
RE my signature, I'm impressed that you paid attention to it! Most people don't bother to look at them.... I capitalised the second "Beauty" so that it would be read in the correct "sense" of the original and to emphasise the symmetry..
Regards Anthony
"Beauty is Truth, Truth Beauty.." Keats
RE: Keats - thanks, I always look at the sig as it gives an insight into the person I am conversing with.
My cart has between 500 and 1000 hours on it, though the issue has been there since day one... if anything, it's gotten better (or I have become more used to it) over time.
"I therefore have cartridges of differing ages with different VTA settings to match the pressing "era"."
So you do a full set-up each time you play an album from a different era? Your dedication to accurate playback is remarkable. I can't imagine retiring or refurbing a cartridge after a few hundred hours. I think I'd have to retire vinyl playback as the cost of maintaining that exacting level would have me living on the street in no time.
Hi
I would say that your DL103 is probably due for a retip! If you are truly nearing 1000 hours, there is a strong likelihood of damage being done!
However, since you say that you have been experiencing the tizz issue since the beginning, this points to the fact that you are either sensitive to the distortion created by the spherical stylus or there is some setup problem with tonearm geometric alignment or antiskate. Regardless of the opinions of some that no antiskate is preferable, the laws of physics indicate that you should use it.
Since you have the option of using a low mass headshell, perhaps an OC9III might be the best option. I agree that the Ortofons are not exactly attractive based on the price. The low compliance and elliptical stylus will be causing significant wear on the records for the low end models. From what I read in another thread, the quality is not great either with significant azimuth errors. Having said that my F7 wasn't perfect with about 3° error.
"So you do a full set-up each time you play an album from a different era?"
Not quite!! I have two decks set up with appropriate cartridges - one for 70s and 80s, the second one more suited for current LPs, and an ELP laser turntable for the really old stuff. In the 60s, VTA wasn't quite so well defined, but as long as you are within 5 degrees or so, it is hard to notice.
However, my problem is that I am constantly swapping things out to experiment - For me that is the fun of this hobby...
My latest experiments with a Shure V15V/JICO SAS show that even with nearly 100% error in VTA, the records can still be played to an acceptable level, but the result is clearly not quite the same as using the correct cartridge VTA. However for transcription purposes, it is important to me to do the most accurate transfer possible. I kept my late father's old cartridges (including a late 60s Stanton 681EE which has a VTA of around 15 degrees).
All of the important recordings that we have on LP have largely been duplicated on CD so that is what I listen to "recreationally". The turntables are for transcription of the rare recordings and recordings that have not or will not be released digitally.
Before transcription, each record is carefully measured for thickness for 16 measurements which tells me what shims I need to get to my reference SRA. The record is carefully washed and then the recording and mastering process begins.. The problem is finding the time!! I am quite proud of the results - my mum was certainly shocked to hear what her LPs could actually sound like once cleaned up!
Regards Anthony
"Beauty is Truth, Truth Beauty.." Keats
"Before transcription, each record is carefully measured for thickness for 16 measurements which tells me what shims I need to get to my reference SRA. The record is carefully washed and then the recording and mastering process begins.. The problem is finding the time!!"
No doubt when you are meticulous to that level! Very, very interesting read and thanks for the suggestion. Not surprised you saw that the large error in VTA wasn't a deal breaker. I don't typically adjust VTA between my thinner and 180 gram records: there is sonic degradation as you deviate from ideal VTA, but when you play albums a few hours a night, you could go mad making those changes each an every time.
Thanks again.
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