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In Reply to: RE: "...click, pop, click," "...exactly!" "...well said!" "...tell me about it!" "...good riddance to vinyl&q posted by jdaniel@jps.net on October 26, 2014 at 12:42:31
Many of my LPs, if not most of them, are very quiet and I love the sound of vinyl, but I recently got involved with DSD and I'm addicted. DSD is pretty amazing; it sounds as good or better than vinyl to me. Last month I bought a TASCAM DA-3000 DSD recorder so I could begin copying my LPs to DSD digital and the TASCAM can also playback DSD files directly from a USB flash drive. DSD sounds really, really good to me. I'm pretty much done with vinyl other than gradually making DSD copies of the LPs I already own. I'm considering buying the new Mytek Manhattan DSD DAC/Preamp with optional built-in ultra high performance phono stage.
Best regards,
John Elison
Follow Ups:
I have an Onkyo C-7030 CD player. It uses a chipset that converts everything to DSD. It's sound quality is, to my ear, better than the best CD players and converters available in the earlier days of digital, even in the 00s before DSD started to emerge. I bought it for ~ $130.
One has to wonder if CD players of this quality were available in the early days of CDs, whether LPs would have survived except as collectors' items.
Sure, there are a few LPs that, with $7,000 plus of front-end equipment, still sound a little better, but they hardly justify their cost.
BTW, the newer releases of Royal Philharmonic Orchestra works are quite well-recorded though some of the readings leave a little bit to be desired. If "Marche Slave" were any slower, those captured prisoners would never arrive.
I believe that your Onkyo is a 24/192 "upsampling" CD player. 24/192 level resolution is considered by some to be the sonic equivalent of DSD.
I googled that Onkyo player to death and never saw any reference to DSD conversion. Onkyo site says it has Wolfson 192/24 DACs. What gives?
The Wolfson DAC converts all the sources to DSD before analog. At least that's my understanding.
Here's a link to technical data for the Wolfson DAC used in the 7030. No indication of DSD capabilities.
I may be mistaken. My understanding is that the digital signal was converted to DSD. But I can't find any reference to support it.
nt
That's interesting! I hadn't considered converting PCM to DSD, but I do like the sound of DSD and I also like the sound of the two LPs I've copied to DSD.
Best regards,
John Elison
Imagine if HE were to come to the same conclusion. He would have to hire 50 unemployed teenagers to convert his stash to DSD.
I just came back from a trip to Brazil. I bought three LPs at a flea market in Belem; they are apparently the only 3 LPs in Brazil not owned by "that guy".
you bought them...it is probably a national tragedy down there...first thy loose the World cup, now you bought the other three LPs....
dee
;-D
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
Even of you made the perfect DSD copies of your LPS you just made the perfect copy of your LPS as they sound today on your current table, and then disaster happens and you find a much better table. Now you either have to make new copies, or just live with the sound of your previous table. I on the other hand enjoy all the improvements :) The damned curse of analog is that it can always improve.
dee
;-D
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
I don't think there's much chance of my finding a better turntable. I've been to five or six major audio shows and I haven't found one yet. Furthermore, vinyl is so imperfect to begin with that once you get to the level of performance that you and I have achieved, it really doesn't get any better -- only different. I'm almost certain that I will never want another turntable and I'm completely certain that I couldn't afford a better turntable unless I win the lottery. ;-)
Best regards,
John Elison
i am not. I get comfortable with what I have then a small change becomes a dramatic improvement and I hear things never before. And there is the doubt. It is one thing to hear a table at a show and in your own system. In analog nothing is finite :)
Dee
:)
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
the rest of us are out there searching for the holly grail :)
dee
;-D
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
Later Gator,
Dave
At least concerning my audio system! I am very satisfied with the sound of my audio/video system, especially with vinyl and DSD digital. I feel blessed to have a system that wows me every time I listen. It took a while to get here, but I have finally arrived.
Best regards,
John Elison
...Of course it could, but I am satisfied with it as it is. I have come to the conclusion that any money spent now (other than on source material) should be on my model trains.
Later Gator,
Dave
then the search begins...till i find the end of that path :).
dee
;-D
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
just asking :)
dee
;-D
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
I don't know. At the moment I'm simply considering my options. Even if I actually buy the Mytek Manhattan with built-in phono stage, I would probably keep my XOno and sell my Yaqin MS-22B. I really don't plan to get rid of my two turntables just because digital has now become my main focus. I have never discarded vinyl at any time. I grew up with vinyl and it's kind of a permanent aspect of my stereo hobby. Furthermore, at the rate I copy vinyl, it will take years to make DSD copies of all my favorite LPs. In fact, I may not finish that by the end of my life.
Best regards,
John Elison
I admit I am woefully uninformed when it comes to digitalizing. I am guessing that a DSD recorder would have the capacity to encode the audio signal in DSD, which is the technology used to record SACDs. Does this mean that your DSD recordings would then be play-able on a typical SACD player, but not on a Redbook CD player? Thanks.
There seem to be expensiv3e licensing options that drive up the cost of SACD processing. To process SACD, one must have licensed equipment and have paid, directly or indirectly, for the rights to use that patented format.At least, that's my understanding.
Edits: 10/27/14
nt
and media rights. Once an SACD is ripped it just a plain old DSD file. You remember some PS3 had a way to output DSD?
dee
;-D
True terror is to wake up one morning and discover that your high school class is running the country.
quote by Kurt Vonnegut
Since I'm never going that route please don't get rid of your LPs until I've had time to go through them. :-)
-Wendell
He can keep his LPs, I have my own. But do you suppose he'd be willing to make DSD files of mine? Analog superior to digital, you say? I'll contemplate that as I'm listening to inferior digital music -- on a warm tropical beach. ;)
Okay! I'll save them for you. ;-)
Ah how could I give up on that pure sound, the people who sell the lps the places I go to find LPs the list goes on its the music first but all the other things I mentioned and then some no I know what I like and I Lps are are a perfect match for me. And there is so much more to learn and experinece with TTs ah couldnt see myself walking away from them. But that dont mean its for everyone but it does mean its just right for me.
How can a DSD copy of an LP sound better than the LP ?
Or, did you not mean to imply that?
Thanks.
Dean.
reelsmith's axiom: Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.
I didn't mean to imply that DSD copies of LPs sound better than vinyl; they sound the same to me. What I meant was that some of the commercial DSD recordings I have sound exceptional -- as good or better than vinyl.
DSD seems to have more of an analog sound quality than high-resolution PCM, especially in the midrange and highs.
Best regards,
John Elison
I thought there was absolutely no difference between an LP and a 44/16 copy. Are you saying you've found some improvement with DSD?
I even prefer DSD to vinyl. YMMV
I like DSD as well. On many recordings it seems to open the sound up a bit more.
I've always thought 16/44 was a pretty borderline spec for hi-fi. It's created a lot of unnecessary headaches as encoders and players have slowly improved to overcome its side effects.
I'll have to be sure not to listen to DSD.
I'd like to think I'm done.
Dean.
reelsmith's axiom: Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.
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