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In Reply to: RE: I May Be Upgrading - But Not Sure. posted by geezerrocket on August 05, 2016 at 10:17:22
What's the verdict
Follow Ups:
The gentleman that has the MC 60s has agreed to let me have them for a couple of days, though I don't know how useful this will prove. According to him they haven't been used very much the past 10 years and I'm a little leary of wrecking something by just plugging them in.
I'm out of town right now, but I'll probably just take a leap of faith when I get home and buy them. Its not a money thing. I have been working without a contract for a couple of years and the union and management are going to settle soon. That means a bunch of back pay coming.
I know that Mike could make 'em sing with his all film cap supply as well as dumping the 12au7 for the 6cg7 phase inverter and whatever other witchcraft he performs.
The owner has a similar predicament; He has a all B.A.T. system as his everyday driver, but he's having a hard time parting with the Macs. Let me tell you, that B.A.T. gear with those Martin Logan Summits - Jeez that sounded magnificent!
Mikey has told me that he is getting 55 wpc from the MC 30s. That would be enough power, and in all honesty I like the sound of 6L6s better than the 6550/KT88. I know there are those here that don't but I sure do. Maybe the MC 30 would be a better fit.
Obviously I haven't heard every 6550/KT88 variety, but in general I think the 6L6 sounds fuller - But that's me.....
Another option is to just keep the Sherwood and get the Martin Logans with the integrated powered woofer. They are more money (2k more) but then I wouldn't have to get a bigger amp(s).
Meat; It's the right thing to do. Romans 14:2
I was never a big fan of the KT88/6550 sound much myself.
However the Gold Lion KT66's are wonderful!
email Mike on the side. He's honest and this way there is no pressure from jerks like ME!!! Only kidding. I just enjoy your enthusiasm!!!!
If money isn't the issue than wait for something special. Like a Marantz, Citation or even a sweeeeet set of VTA monoblocks or ST-120.
I feel you are just excited about just getting your hands on some Mac tube gear. If a Mac is what you want then get a nice one that Mike can CRANK on!!! Don't settle and make a lateral move. Put you hopes and restoration cash and into something special. Also Mike likes the nice ones to work on.
Charlie
I have six Mc60s and I'm putting new chassis on the two is not so nice condition. I also have a pair of Mc240s and an Mc275 and a pair of MA-230s.The Mc60s and the Mc275 are much like the Citation 2 in the sense that lean on correctness of sonics with a touch of euphoria and when you are using modern ESLs like the Martin Logan CLXs,this is important because these speakers love wide bandwidth amps that can strut their stuff.
There was a time I didn't care for my Mac amps because they sounded not so good and the mentality was to keep them stock at all costs.When I got my first mint pair back in the late 80s,the Mc60s sounded very good on the Beverage model 3 ESLs.Fast forward to 2004 because I had parked the amps for about 10 years as I was doing other things, I hooked the amps up and they sounded awful.I didn't measure any ripple on the filter caps so I figured everything was ok but then Elektron emailed me and said Mikey,don't give up on those amps because little did I know, you have to run the Mac amps producing power,before you can get a legit reading on ripple because at idle, they draw almost nothing..This turned out be true because once I changed out the filter caps and the bumblee caps in the phase inverter to voltage amp,along with the out of tolerance resistors,these amps were stunning after that. I then started on the Mc240 after I McShaned my Citation 2s so this gave me the idea to implement the complete McShane type rebuild to the Mac amps and loewen behold,I have NEVER heard an Mc240 sound so amazing.
Charlie,so many Mac and Citation amps get occasional bad rap in the audio sphere but ever since McShane figured a way to build an improvement strategy to cover both amps,you almost never hear anymore Mac/Citation bashing because a large percentage of them has had a McShane type rebuild done to them. Their sound and stability has improved on a grand scale.
It is such a shame that so many Mac amps got sold off to Asia and other places because people didn't know how to fix the issues with them.They also wanted the big money but since McShane,you don't find nearly as many Mac amps going to Asia anymore..People are now more compelled to hang on to them.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
Edits: 08/08/16
Traded a Deuce for the long gun pictured alongside the Sig.
Charles;
I had a Citation II for a few weeks. I bought it and the SP3A-1 at the same time from a co-worker who's father was going into the nursing home. I won't even tell you what I paid because I stole it! I told my co-worker that it was worth more, but he didn't want to screw with ebay, shipping, feedback, Craigslist etc.....
I tried the Deuce with the SP3A-1 for a bit, and while it was nice I didn't like it as much as my S-5000. So, I traded it for a near new DPMS AR-10 (.308 NATO caliber). This weapon should NOT to be confused with the pussy AR-15 (5.56 x 45mm NATO) that is currently the rage for douchebags creating civil unrest.
While I have not heard the amplifier offerings from VTA, I have my doubts if their iron is in the same league as the vintage Peerless, Mac, Freed, or Acro-Sound. There is a reason that a single 55 year old Heathkit W-6 Peerless 16431 output transformer costs as much as your amp. Understand; I'm not trying to disparage your amp as I'm sure it sounds just fine, but in general - You pay more, you get more.
Mikey, Eli, or Don may wish to chime in here.
As far as Mike liking the nice ones to work on; I get it. He told me that my S-5000 was the cleanest he had ever seen. He also said the one with the five slanted 12AX7s and big ultra linear transformers was THE one to have. Plus, my vanity would not allow a chrome pitted ugly duckling on the rack no matter how good it sounded.
Meat; It's the right thing to do. Romans 14:2
That is why I keep a pair of small junk thrift store speakers around that I don't care about blowing.
Dave
Other than expense, I don't think you can make a bad choice.
Among vintage integrated tube amps, an original S5000 is about as good as it gets.
Mikey would definitely get a pair of MC60s into 1st class condition. In good repair, the ARC preamp and "Mac" amps should/will outperform the Sherwood.
It's nice when you're the fellow who says, and gets away with, "Heads I win, tails you loose".
Eli D.
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