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In Reply to: RE: any experience with ADS L710's? posted by cloudwalker on March 13, 2015 at 15:21:54
I agree with everyone. The difference seems to be a preference for the "new sound of speakers" vs. the "old sound". Many listeners would like the new sound, but I prefer the old sound., especially with vocals and guitars. They are using newer Emovita amps and preamps, while I have an older HK AVR 7000. The price for my receiver 15 years ago was as much as theirs today. Using that receiver with these speakers and an Atlantic Tech subwoofer seem to be a perfect match to me. These speakers were made before subwoofers came out. But I like the sound of a subwoofer. So I disconnected one woofer in each speaker and they sound perfect to me. I hope to have them the rest of my life. One note..I bought the receiver at a yard sale. They said it quit working suddenly one day. I noticed the jumpers were put in backwards(l to r amp and l to r preamp. I did not tell them what the problem was, but I knew. Some engineer goofed and make the jumpers fit either way.
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The difference seems to be a preference for the "new sound of speakers" vs. the "old sound".
tweeter power handling has long dominated speaker design and necessitated 3 way designs in the past. Note that with the Braun/ADS designs, the tweeter was crossed over at 4 kHz. Which is what many manufacturers of the day implemented. The JBL L100 chose an even higher frequency - 6 khz so that they could be driven at high output levels without frying the tweeter. The problem with the JBL approach, however, is that 5" midranges have poor dispersion at 6 khz resulting in incredibly inconsistent directivity in the top octaves since the dome tweeter does quite well in its range. You end up with a strange fun house mirror effect in staging with instruments that span both drivers.
The original Advent used a 1 kHz crossover to minimize such issues, but alas many folks ending up blowing the tweeters using high powered amps like those from Phase Linear. The New Advent both raised the crossover frequency to 1.5 kHz and used ferro-fluid cooling for its tweeter.
Modern tweeters have higher power handling so they are most often crossed over at 2-2.5 kHz. There is really no need for a dome midrange since a 5" driver (with a nominal 4" piston) is smaller than the wavelength for that frequency. The odd exceptions you'll find are three way pro monitors like that from ATC that still use a dome midrange and higher tweeter crossover points to achieve a reported 109 db output level!
Since I am a coherency freak, I prefer modern two ways with more rigid cabinets using flush driver mounting to eliminate diffraction effects found with the older mounting designs. For me, a modern incarnation of the L710 is a Polk LSi9 with its ring radiator tweeter and 2.5 way design using 5" midrange/woofers.
Glad to see the Polk LSi9 mentioned. What a looked-over, underated speaker it is. Still good even by today's standards. Any problems it has are minor and can be overcome by bi-wiring and partially stuffing the rear port. I wonder how its successor the LSiM703 is. No dealers in my area.
I find it to be a very neutral reproducer. Unlike many modern designs with a rising top end, it actually rolls off the top octave a bit which is fine by me! I loath overly bright sounding speakers.
Mine are effectively three ways using powered subs to do the heavy lifting. I experimented with about a dozen combinations of low pass / high pass settings and found that 40 / 50 hz provided the most linear measured result.
That there were no good older 2 way designs. I also have a pair of KEF 103.2.s that sound good although I like the ADS speakers because the midrange sounds better (being a 3 way design)
That there were no good older 2 way designs.They were challenged by power handling or bandwidth issues that led to compromises.
The KEF crossed its 8" woofer over at 3 kHz. That's a wavelength of 4.5 inches - which means that its directivity nearing the crossover point would be exceptionally narrow transitioning to a dome tweeter that immediately changes the situation to that of wide dispersion. That's the kind of inconsistency that severely impacts coherency.
edit: One of the nice things about the Advent is its driver blending. While it had a 10" woofer (nominal 9" piston), it crossed over to tweeter at 1 kHz for the original and 1.5 kHz for the New Advent. Even at the higher frequency, that is right at a 9" wavelength. In this case, the tradeoff was at the expense of top end response due to the large tweeter. But its sins were largely that of omission, not that of an audible driver transition.
Edits: 03/15/15 03/15/15
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