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In Reply to: RE: Three Agreed posted by Mechans on July 03, 2012 at 08:29:25
First, thank you all for the input.
The CCas are prohibitive for me... As I shop around they range from 4 to 6 bills
But given that, where would your next choices within the early Siemens be?
7308/E188CC
6922/E88CC
Follow Ups:
Some will say that the 7308 is vastly better than 6922 and they are entitled to that opinion. I can't say they aren't certaintly right. The 6922s however, as NOS are very, very good.
I have used the Siemens 6922 E88CC on the output of a CD player, it worked as well as I could have wanted as described above. I have not used the 7308 by Siemens. I use a Mullard CV2493/E88CC-01s which is comparable to a 7308 I am told and have read. That tube is also great with lots of top end sparkle not what you would expect from a Mullard. It would be a close call sonically believe it or not but pricewise I could get the Mullards for under $200/pair and obviously real NOS NIB and have come to prefer them. See which one you can get more cheaply I doubt you'll find Siemens 7308 NOS/NIB for a lot less than $300/pair, Used maybe.
Steve
Mine would be used as amplification tubes on the AMR DP 777... as it has its own preamp.
My latest price on premium 7308 Siemens from a very reputable dealer was $450. Compared to the 6922 E88Cs at $350.
I really appreciate your input. It would be great if all of us were sitting together in a room being able to swap out 6922s. It's a little tricky stepping into this territory. You can't turn around to a tube dealer and say, "Sorry, I don't like the way these tubes sound in my system." Yet at prices between 400 and 600, one thinks they should have some recourse. ;) I know in high end audio there is no justice.
I have a matched quad of Cca, from 1964 (I think). Supposedlythe holly grail of this tube family. To me, they sound like 7308s. I lived with them in my Einstein Absolute Tune for a few months, but eventually went back to 6922s which I generally preferred.
Jack
They are equivalent tubes dating all the way back to 1956. Some were made by Philips in Heerlen, Holland, others were made by Valvo in Hamburg, Germany, others were made by Siemens in Munich, Germany and others were made by Telefunken in Ulm, Germany.
So true, but you would hope that the journey of "experience" would flush out the reality among those of us who are tube addicted. :)
Your input has been helpful,Jack... because those 3 are the Siemens I haven been considering. Actually 2 of them since the CCas are out of line for me getting into 5 to 6 bills.
Can you you say a little bit what the similarities and the differences were between 7308/E188CC and the 6922/E88CC for you? And what had you stick with the latter?
I've liked what I heard of in the sound of Einstein Absolute so I know where somewhat in the same ballpark of listening taste.
In my experience, there are slight tonal balance differences between the two. Both are clean and crisp, with a Seimens "house sound", but the 6922s had a flatter FR, with more extended treble and deeper bass, while the 7308s had a slight emphasis on the lower treble and mid bass.. The other difference was that the 7308s were a bit more forward, with a shallower soundstage.
BTW, you really want the 6922s before they went to the "A" frame in the late 60s. I/m not sure on the exact year they switched.
Jack
Jack,
Thanks... real helpful... and I get it about the "A" frame...
I assume by "FR" you mean frequency response...? And, therefore, a purer sound.
In music as in life... one is always on the learning curve
Jack,
Thanks... real helpful...
In music as in life... one is always on the learning curve
The 6922s have better extension at both extremes, and do a much deeper soundstage.
Jack
So, you are saying that the Siemens 6922/E88cc... give you a better response than the 7308/E188CCs?
Better is a subjective term, but yes, in my opinion. I'm not a big fan of 7308s despite in theory they are supposed to sound better, especially quieter. I just haven't found that to be true in my case(s).
As always, YMMV
JackPS. Make sure that they are from the 50s or early 60s.
Edits: 07/04/12
Of course, it's always system and ear related. It would be wonderful if there was a tube library similar to the Cable Co. :)
Re: PS - Yes, from what I have been told try not to go later than 68. And try get the ones with the date code etched on the outside rather than on the metal tag within the tube. I presume that came after '68.
Thanks, again
In mid 1965, Siemens moved to stamping the three-lined code on an aluminium clad that was attached to the top mica support within the tube's glass envelope. This was only done for a period of 6 months or so before the appearance of the 2-lined A1 6-letter code.
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